New Super Challenge Discussion thread2014 (General discussion) Language Learning Forum

New Super Challenge Discussion thread2014
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Language Learning Forum : General discussion

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Bownly
Newbie
United States
Joined 3849 days ago
2 posts - 2 votes
Speaks: English*

Message 113 of 766

11 May 2014 at 3:10am | IP Logged

I'm really digging the new redesign--nice work! However, I think I'm inclined to agree against the daily streak
badges only because I'm scared of personally falling prey to their ensuing psychological mind games:
namely, hoarding and preemptively posting tweets. Weekly streaks should significantly minimize any of that
though, I'd think. That's just speaking selfishly though.

And, if I could also take a second to play back-seat designer, I think it might be neat to display our twitter
avatars on the home page for easier self-locating. Just an idea.

Thanks for all the work you've put in getting this all set up and running.
1 person has voted this message useful

Solfrid Cristin
Heptaglot
Winner TAC 2011 & 2012
Senior Member
Norway
Joined 5327 days ago
4143 posts - 8864 votes

Speaks: Norwegian*, Spanish, Swedish, French, English, German, Italian
Studies: Russian

Message 114 of 766

11 May 2014 at 8:02am | IP Logged

I think the weekly badges would be brilliant for keeping people motivated, but I am concerned that the daily
ones will lead to too much clutter and bad conscience. The weekly ones fit in nicely with the "marathon and
not a sprint idea" :-)
1 person has voted this message useful

Serpent
Octoglot
Senior Member
Russian Federation
serpent-849.livejour
Joined 6590 days ago
9753 posts - 15779 votes

4 sounds
Speaks: Russian*, English, Finnish^C1, Latin, German, Italian, Spanish, Portuguese
Studies: Danish, Romanian, Polish, Belarusian, Ukrainian, Croatian, Slovenian, Catalan, Czech, Galician, Dutch, Swedish

Message 115 of 766

11 May 2014 at 9:57am | IP Logged

I think counting all our languages together also fits better with the marathon and not sprint idea. It keeps the challenge from turning into an elitist "make progress in a big European language you're B2 in" (or watch K-dramas :)). It feels really unfair, I'd have honestly spent those 4 months differently and set different goals if this change had been announced in advance.
I suggest keeping the new ranking available but not as the default one.I also totally wouldn't mind showing only each participant's best language at least until they get a star in other languages.
Speaking of that, it would be great if within the sorting by language people could be sorted by how much they've done.

Edited by Serpent on 11 May 2014 at 11:39am
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Serpent
Octoglot
Senior Member
Russian Federation
serpent-849.livejour
Joined 6590 days ago
9753 posts - 15779 votes

Message 116 of 766

11 May 2014 at 10:20am | IP Logged

surrealix wrote:

The big discussion seems to be the daily sprint badge - and I'm happy to remove this (or more likely, convert it into something else). But before I do, I'll play devil's advocate and present a counter argument ;-).

Jeffers wrote:

We need something to encourage the people further down, and the weekly
tweet streak is something they can feel is achievable. But seeing all those 7-day
badges above them might also be discouraging: one more reason they aren't succeeding.

The reason for adding daily sprint badges was actually to encourage people further down
the list. Achieving the weekly streak badge is a long commitment and the payoff is
months down the track. The daily badge gives a more immediate feedback for studying
now rather than leaving thingns until later because you've got 18 months. In
addition, even just 5 minutes every day for a week really helps to form the habit and
mindset of doing some study - which is important if you're going to keep this up for
over a year.

For people starting mid-way through the challenge, or for people who let their study
lapse, the daily badge is also a way to visibly "catch up" to people higher in the
rankings. I've only just started, and having a small, acheiveable first goal is going
to help with the kick-off.

Perhaps the badge could appear for everyone who's done something in the past 7 days? ie appear not from the second but from the first week of consistency, giving everyone the benefit of doubt?
We also have a simple consistency thread where you can keep track daily.

IDK about others, but for me it's very draining to literally count everything i read or every minute i watch. I mean it's great for short-term challenges like Tadoku or 6WC, but in the long run it's much better to simply report whenever you complete at least one item or even more than one. And I'm not even bad at maths :D

Edited by Serpent on 11 May 2014 at 10:32am
1 person has voted this message useful

Jeffers
Senior Member
United Kingdom
Joined 4902 days ago
2151 posts - 3960 votes

Speaks: English*
Studies: Hindi, Ancient Greek, French, Sanskrit, German

Message 117 of 766

11 May 2014 at 10:25am | IP Logged

I quite like the new ranking system. Of course, it moved me up a couple ranks, so I suppose that biases me. However, as I am bringing in more time on my secondary languages, I know my ranking will drop. I don't mind because I think it rewards people for doing the Super Challenge as Cristina intended. She wanted this to be a challenge about one (or at most two) languages. Due to the strong opinions of a few of us (myself included), she reluctantly allowed as many languages as a person wants.

One thing Christina was worried about, and mentioned several times, was the possibility that new people would look at the front runners who have 5+ languages, and think that's the norm, and that's the way to succeed at this challenge. Now, with a slight bias towards those doing few languages, and with only one language showing, that won't be a problem at all.

(Edited out one section).

Edited by Jeffers on 11 May 2014 at 10:27am
2 persons have voted this message useful

patrickwilken
Senior Member
Germany
radiant-flux.net
Joined 4526 days ago
1546 posts - 3200 votes

Studies: German

Message 118 of 766

11 May 2014 at 10:29am | IP Logged

PeterMollenburg wrote:

But in my madness to read and read and watch and watch I began to wonder relative my
language level (French B1) how effective watching movies really is. It so happens this
article mimics some of my suspicions, adds a few more and elaborates in a balanced way
on how useful it actually is to your goal of improving in a language depending on your
level to watch foreign movies.

Hi Peter:

I started watching movies in my TL when I was A1, after 400+ movies I am at about B2. I find watching movies/tv-shows in my TL extremely helpful.

I recently had a drink with a friend of my mother in Berlin who has been learning German for many years (she learnt German at school and has continued into her sixties in Australia to learn on-and-off). She reads German novels in Australia, but when she was in Berlin she couldn't follow a lot of what people were saying, because everybody was talking too fast. She hadn't learnt to hear the language properly because she hasn't been exposed to the sounds enough.

It's obviously important to regularly hear the language as you learn: (1) because you need to understand it when people speak; and (2) so when you read you are silently enunciating the words correctly as you read.

Of course, you'll learn more complex syntax and more vocabulary from reading - books are more complex linguistic vessels - but what you get from watching films/tv-shows is extremely useful and can't be replaced easily in other ways.

5 persons have voted this message useful

Serpent
Octoglot
Senior Member
Russian Federation
serpent-849.livejour
Joined 6590 days ago
9753 posts - 15779 votes

Message 119 of 766

11 May 2014 at 10:46am | IP Logged

Jeffers wrote:

One thing Christina was worried about, and mentioned several times, was the possibility that new people would look at the front runners who have 5+ languages, and think that's the norm, and that's the way to succeed at this challenge. Now, with a slight bias towards those doing few languages, and with only one language showing, that won't be a problem at all.

I think it's pretty obvious that everyone has different goals in their various languages. And if everyone's "other" languages (apart from the best and/or those with stars) are collapsed, the spherical newbie in vacuum will have to be serious to even pay attention to the fact that those on top are learning more than one language. (I'm not sure whether it's possible to collapse individual lines)

I'm all for not occupying Kerrie's or anyone else's whole screen, especially with languages in which I've only watched one or two football matches in 10 days (keeping me well on track with video, I stress). I'm all for having to prove I'm serious about all the languages I signed up with. But that's really not the best way to do that. It's a drastic change that ideally should've been discussed before the previous challenge ended.

Edited by Serpent on 11 May 2014 at 11:08am
1 person has voted this message useful

Jeffers
Senior Member
United Kingdom
Joined 4902 days ago
2151 posts - 3960 votes

Speaks: English*
Studies: Hindi, Ancient Greek, French, Sanskrit, German

Message 120 of 766

11 May 2014 at 11:07am | IP Logged

Serpent wrote:

It's a drastic change that ideally should've been discussed before the previous challenge ended.

It doesn't change the challenge an iota. You read your 100 books and watch your 100 films, and you will have completed your challenge. What's changed is a ranking system for an optional bot. Surely you're not doing the super challenge for the sake of screen position?

8 persons have voted this message useful

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