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Benny Lewis

 Language Learning Forum : Polyglots (Topic Closed Topic Closed) Post Reply
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Solfrid Cristin
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 Message 105 of 164
30 April 2012 at 9:56pm | IP Logged 
Don't you guys ever get tired of the p...... contests? Benny has thrown himself into a sea of Mandarin - and he has come out speaking Mandarin. Personally I never thought it was possible to get to a C1 in three months regardless of method, but I am still impressed by a B1, or even a high A2 - if that is what it is.

He uses the same method I used back in 1974 when I was sent to Spain alone by my mother to live in a Spanish family, and the same method I am now using by sending my daughter to live alone in a Spanish family for three months at the age of 12. I hope the discussion is not whether immersion and speaking from day one works or not, because I cannot honestly belive that anyone can doubt that. The only thing we can possibly discuss with any sort of merit is to which degree it works for any given individual.


Also it is a stupid claim that someone else "would learn better had they used method x". How on earth can anyone say that? I know that I learn best by immersion, and I can say it is a good method, but I could not possibly say that any other individual would learn better using that method than any other method, as we all learn in different ways.

Benny has inspired a lot of people, and he is not a fake. He lives what he preaches. I am just half way through the article, but I am reading it with great interest, and between the influence of nway and Benny, I might just give Mandarin a try.

Hey, fabriciocarraro, shall we try it together after we have "mastered" Russian?





Edited by Solfrid Cristin on 30 April 2012 at 9:57pm
9 persons have voted this message useful



fabriciocarraro
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Speaks: Portuguese*, EnglishB2, Italian, Spanish, Russian, French
Studies: Dutch, German, Japanese

 
 Message 106 of 164
30 April 2012 at 11:53pm | IP Logged 
Solfrid Cristin wrote:


Hey, fabriciocarraro, shall we try it together after we have "mastered" Russian?


Well, my next language will probably be French, but I don't see why I can't try Mandarin along with that =)
1 person has voted this message useful



translator2
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 Message 107 of 164
01 May 2012 at 12:08am | IP Logged 
Having read dozens of books and essays about the Chinese language, I absolutely LOVE this article by Benny. Reading articles like this one make me excited about learning languages again. I may just become a fan after all!

Now I can't wait to see what he thinks of Arabic.

fabriciocarraro wrote:
Great new Benny's post about Chinese


Edited by translator2 on 01 May 2012 at 1:52pm
4 persons have voted this message useful



fabriciocarraro
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russoparabrasileirosRegistered users can see my Skype Name
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Speaks: Portuguese*, EnglishB2, Italian, Spanish, Russian, French
Studies: Dutch, German, Japanese

 
 Message 108 of 164
01 May 2012 at 2:34am | IP Logged 
translator2 wrote:
Having read dozens of books and essays about the Chinese language, I
absolutely LOVE this article by Benny. Reading articles like this one make me excited
about learning languages again. I may just become a fan after all!


By the way, how did you learn Portuguese, translator2? I mean the method, materials, etc.
1 person has voted this message useful



translator2
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 Message 109 of 164
01 May 2012 at 2:19pm | IP Logged 
Nothing terribly exciting I'm afraid.

My first experience with Portuguese was when I enrolled in an Advanced Portuguese class in 1988. I was already fairly advanced in Spanish and I come from a French-speaking background. Based on the written language, I mistakenly thought that it was so similar to Spanish that I could skip the first two years and start with the third-year course. The class started with advanced grammar and reading crônicas. At first I was completely lost because although the text looked a lot like Spanish, the sounds were quite different. The only thing I could do was read the text as though it were Spanish and at first I got a lot of reprimanding from the Brazilian professor. (Remember, there was no internet, so I had never heard Portuguese spoken before). I remember marveling at the wonderful sounds (like the "o" or "te" at the end of words). By the end, I had earned an A and was the top student in the class (although that says more of my former classmates than it does about me). I was also taking Latin and Italian at the same time which in hindsight was probably not such a good idea.

From there I continued with whatever textbooks/grammars were available at that time and whatever limited books and videos I could get my hands on. I do remember subscribing to a VHS service from TV Globo where they would send me video tapes of novelas such a A Próxima Vítima or the show Fantástico. In the pre-internet days, you had to grab the resources where you could (there was no Amazon.com either). I remember reading translations of novels. One in particular was Sidney Sheldon's Se Houver Amanhã. Every once in a while if I was lucky, I could get my hands on a copy of the magazine Veja. Then I started working as a translator and I have since been exposed to all kinds of documents and texts (court documents, technical specifications, business letters, etc.) in Portuguese. There is also a large Brazilian population where I live.   

I really don't understand the need for special "methods" or "language consultants". It just takes a lot of time and hard work.


fabriciocarraro wrote:
translator2 wrote:
Having read dozens of books and essays about the Chinese language, I
absolutely LOVE this article by Benny. Reading articles like this one make me excited
about learning languages again. I may just become a fan after all!


By the way, how did you learn Portuguese, translator2? I mean the method, materials, etc.


Edited by translator2 on 01 May 2012 at 8:51pm
2 persons have voted this message useful



mick33
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United States
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Studies: Thai, Polish, Afrikaans, Hindi, Hungarian, Italian, Spanish, Swedish

 
 Message 110 of 164
01 May 2012 at 7:52pm | IP Logged 
Solfrid Cristin wrote:
Don't you guys ever get tired of the p...... contests? Benny has thrown himself into a sea of Mandarin - and he has come out speaking Mandarin. Personally I never thought it was possible to get to a C1 in three months regardless of method, but I am still impressed by a B1, or even a high A2 - if that is what it is.
Hear, hear! I couldn't agree more.

Solfrid Cristin wrote:
He uses the same method I used back in 1974 when I was sent to Spain alone by my mother to live in a Spanish family, and the same method I am now using by sending my daughter to live alone in a Spanish family for three months at the age of 12. I hope the discussion is not whether immersion and speaking from day one works or not, because I cannot honestly belive that anyone can doubt that. The only thing we can possibly discuss with any sort of merit is to which degree it works for any given individual.


Also it is a stupid claim that someone else "would learn better had they used method x". How on earth can anyone say that? I know that I learn best by immersion, and I can say it is a good method, but I could not possibly say that any other individual would learn better using that method than any other method, as we all learn in different ways.

Benny has inspired a lot of people, and he is not a fake. He lives what he preaches. I am just half way through the article, but I am reading it with great interest, and between the influence of nway and Benny, I might just give Mandarin a try.
I think another dimension to the critiques of Benny is based on the following question, Are you a person who aims for the stars but can be pleased when you land on the moon? Benny seems to be and is happy to achieve what he achieves while his critics will claim that because he didn't actually hit the stated goal (in this case C1 level) he wasn't really successful. The thing is, reaching B1 or even A2 level still means that he is now speaking Chinese, however imperfectly.

Edited by mick33 on 01 May 2012 at 8:00pm
4 persons have voted this message useful



tmp011007
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Congo
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 Message 111 of 164
02 May 2012 at 3:33am | IP Logged 
Solfrid Cristin wrote:
He uses the same method I used back in 1974 when I was sent to Spain alone by my mother to live in a Spanish family, and the same method I am now using by sending my daughter to live alone in a Spanish family for three months at the age of 12.

same "method"? I doubt it.. would you please describe what you mean by "his method"?

Quote:
I hope the discussion is not whether immersion and speaking from day one works or not, because I cannot honestly belive that anyone can doubt that.

don't worry, it is not

Quote:
..and he is not a fake.

based on his spa, fre, por and ger skills, well, he is not "fake".. BUT..

Quote:
He lives what he preaches.

I do disagree


mick33 wrote:
I think another dimension to the critiques of Benny is based on the following question, Are you a person who aims for the stars but can be pleased when you land on the moon? Benny seems to be and is happy to achieve what he achieves while his critics will claim that because he didn't actually hit the stated goal (in this case C1 level) he wasn't really successful. The thing is, reaching B1 or even A2 level still means that he is now speaking Chinese, however imperfectly.

if you really think anyone/someone would be able to pass a, let's say, Spanish B1 test in 3 months -"just" the speaking part- without any prior knowledge, well, then you are right..


p.s. on a second thought, maybe portuguese, galician and even Italian speakers might be able to do that..

Edited by tmp011007 on 02 May 2012 at 7:11am
3 persons have voted this message useful



fabriciocarraro
Hexaglot
Winner TAC 2012
Senior Member
Brazil
russoparabrasileirosRegistered users can see my Skype Name
Joined 4714 days ago
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Speaks: Portuguese*, EnglishB2, Italian, Spanish, Russian, French
Studies: Dutch, German, Japanese

 
 Message 112 of 164
02 May 2012 at 3:58am | IP Logged 
translator2 wrote:
Nothing terribly exciting I'm afraid.

My first experience with Portuguese was when I enrolled in an Advanced Portuguese class in 1988. I was already fairly advanced in Spanish and I come from a French-speaking background. Based on the written language, I mistakenly thought that it was so similar to Spanish that I could skip the first two years and start with the third-year course. The class started with advanced grammar and reading crônicas. At first I was completely lost because although the text looked a lot like Spanish, the sounds were quite different. The only thing I could do was read the text as though it were Spanish and at first I got a lot of reprimanding from the Brazilian professor. (Remember, there was no internet, so I had never heard Portuguese spoken before). I remember marveling at the wonderful sounds (like the "o" or "te" at the end of words). By the end, I had earned an A and was the top student in the class (although that says more of my former classmates than it does about me). I was also taking Latin and Italian at the same time which in hindsight was probably not such a good idea.

From there I continued with whatever textbooks/grammars were available at that time and whatever limited books and videos I could get my hands on. I do remember subscribing to a VHS service from TV Globo where they would send me video tapes of novelas such a A Próxima Vítima or the show Fantástico. In the pre-internet days, you had to grab the resources where you could (there was no Amazon.com either). I remember reading translations of novels. One in particular was Sidney Sheldon's Se Houver Amanhã. Every once in a while if I was lucky, I could get my hands on a copy of the magazine Veja. Then I started working as a translator and I have since been exposed to all kinds of documents and texts (court documents, technical specifications, business letters, etc.) in Portuguese. There is also a large Brazilian population where I live.    


Great story, and very interesting! Thanks for sharing! =) Nowadays with the internet we take many things for granted, it must have been a real challenge to learn a language out of the country.

translator2 wrote:
I really don't understand the need for special "methods" or "language consultants". It just takes a lot of time and hard work.


About that, not every language learner has the same motivation, or knows what works for him/herself. Of course it takes a lot of time and hard work, but if you have someone to guide you through the way or at least to show it to you, a non-experienced language learner will stop hitting his head against the wall with useless methods and start taking some shortcuts. I don't see it as a bad thing.


1 person has voted this message useful



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