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Geoffw in TAC2015: RU, HE and Friends | ||
Tags: Football/Soccer | Yiddish | Hebrew | Dutch | Total Annihilation Challenge (TAC) | Russian | German | French | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : Language Learning Log |  | |
| geoffw Triglot Senior Member United States Joined 4680 days ago 1134 posts - 1865 votes  Speaks: English*, German, Yiddish Studies: Modern Hebrew, French, Dutch, Italian, Russian | Message 25 of 251 04 January 2013 at 3:51pm | IP Logged | ||
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I recently received Assimil Using French from amazon, but I was disappointed to discover that, despite apparent
information indicating otherwise on the webpage, it did not include the audio. At least it was cheap, but now I need to figure out what to do with this, as I've never tried using an Assimil course without audio. I notice that, unlike NFWE, the basic course instructions say nothing about doing two waves. It looks like maybe my extensive reading has paid off. I flipped to a couple random lessons in the 50s and 60s and was somewhat surprised to find that I could read them and understand almost every word, missing about 1-3 per lesson. The instructions in the beginning suggest that they expect the learner to be unfamiliar with most of the words in the lessons, so this is a bit weird, though in a good way. Nevertheless, it's clear that the course is MUCH more advanced than NFWE, and that the grammar and idiom presented here are well beyond what I have mastered to date. While my listening comprehension and pronunciation certainly need to improve, I have other established ways to work on them, so I think the biggest question is whether I can form the basic sounds required to say the words correctly, and I can work on perfecting the sound in other ways. I tried reading a lesson aloud, "blind," i.e., without having previously read it, and I felt relatively confident that it went very well, but perhaps I should record myself reading an excerpt and upload it here to see what other people think. It looks like I can at least get a lot of mileage out of this book by 1) reading and understanding everything in a lesson, 2) reading the lesson out loud in French a number of times, working on things like pacing, pronunciation, and concentrating on understanding the nuances being emphasized in the lesson, and 3) doing an "active wave" sort of activity and work on translating the English back into French with better and better speed and accuracy. If anyone has other suggestions or experiences to share, feel free! 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Quique Diglot Senior Member Spain cronopios.net/Registered users can see my Skype Name Joined 4674 days ago 183 posts - 313 votes Speaks: Spanish*, English Studies: French, German | Message 26 of 251 04 January 2013 at 8:02pm | IP Logged | ||
I don't know what you read, but there is audio for Using French, sold separately:
certainly happy to have them for NFSW/FWT. 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| geoffw Triglot Senior Member United States Joined 4680 days ago 1134 posts - 1865 votes Speaks: English*, German, Yiddish Studies: Modern Hebrew, French, Dutch, Italian, Russian | Message 27 of 251 04 January 2013 at 8:13pm | IP Logged | ||
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I know that audio exists, the issue is that I thought the audio was included in what I bought, but it was not, so now
I don't have it available. 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| geoffw Triglot Senior Member United States Joined 4680 days ago 1134 posts - 1865 votes Speaks: English*, German, Yiddish Studies: Modern Hebrew, French, Dutch, Italian, Russian | Message 28 of 251 10 January 2013 at 11:38pm | IP Logged | ||
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I posted some initial high-level goals in my first post in the log, but here are some more that I've been thinking
about relating to my non-TAC languages and need to get down "on paper." German ----------- I want to take a certification exam this year, and I think it actually may happen this time. I'm currently targeting the TestDaF, which grades each of its four sections (listening, reading, speaking and writing) separately, and can give any of three passing scores for each section, ranging from B2-C1. I'm fairly confident that I should be able to pass, and I doubt that the listening and reading sections should be challenging at all, but it would give me an excuse to make sure my active skills are working still and also prove to some extent that I'm not merely overestimating my level. Hebrew ----------- I want to start working through Assimil's L'Hebreu this year. I've looked through it and I think my French is good enough to start any time, though further improvement will help. For now, I'm doing two Assimil courses already, and three is too many. Having just read the "secret languages" thread that has been revived, I was reminded that my best bet at having a real "secret language" will be in Hebrew, since my kids should be proficient in a few years (as long as I can keep paying the private school bills), and this has made me even more antsy than I had been already. More on me and my history with Hebrew whenever I officially start studying it again with Assimil. I've had on my calendar since last May when I started French that come May 2013 it would be time to start Hebrew (based on the assumption that by then I would be sufficiently competent in French to handle an Assimil course, which now appears to have been quite reasonable). 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Quique Diglot Senior Member Spain cronopios.net/Registered users can see my Skype Name Joined 4674 days ago 183 posts - 313 votes Speaks: Spanish*, English Studies: French, German | Message 29 of 251 11 January 2013 at 11:02am | IP Logged | ||
You can use their ISBN to look for them in Abebooks, etc. Alternatively you could download it from the Internet, but then you could get in legal trouble. 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| geoffw Triglot Senior Member United States Joined 4680 days ago 1134 posts - 1865 votes Speaks: English*, German, Yiddish Studies: Modern Hebrew, French, Dutch, Italian, Russian | Message 30 of 251 11 January 2013 at 2:40pm | IP Logged | ||
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As we all know, everyone has their own peculiar way of using Assimil, which is both part of the charm and part of
the frustration of Assimil. Il fait part de ses qualités-ou de ses défauts. I've been wondering how other people are doing the active wave, and considering whether or not I want to change the process I've developed for myself and that I've been doing up until now. 1) Depending how I feel that day, and possibly how hard the words are that day, I may or may not first listen to the recording of a lesson. Next, I read the French out loud, concentrating both on pronunciation and verifying that I have 100% comprehension (a prerequisite for successfully completing the active wave, I think). 2) Thereafter I go line by line, and if I can't quickly spit out the French version for a line 100% identically to what is on the page, I check the French and try again as many times as necessary before trying the next line. This is the hardest part of the whole process, as there are always a few lines that take a couple tries to get exactly the same as Assimil's French translation. 3) I go back to the beginning and try to repeat my perfect performance for each line. If I'm not confident that I got a line exactly correct, I glance at the French text and try again. Again, once I get a line 100% I move on. I usually get most of the lines confidently, but slowly. 4) Repeat step 3) as many times as seems necessary until I can go through the entire lesson confidently translating with 100% accuracy and at a reasonable speed. This whole process usually takes between 5-15 minutes depending how hard the lesson is. It took much longer for the earlier, simpler lessons, but has gotten easier as I progress, despite the rising complexity and length of the lessons. I'm certain that this is a valuable exercise. My concern is whether I am shortchanging the "activation" part of the active wave, in that my successful completion of the tricky bits may be due in part to my having them in short term memory. I'm wondering whether it would be more effective to struggle more and mess up more, but rely less on the French text at first. This might mean not completing the lesson in the same amount of time, or not completing the lesson with as strong a "performance." For French, I plan to simply finish the way I have been doing, and if I think it would be worthwhile I can try a second active wave. I want to figure out what other options there are for doing active waves with other languages, as well as my possible second active wave in NFWE. Any comments or suggestions welcome. 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| tastyonions Triglot Senior Member United States goo.gl/UIdChYRegistered users can see my Skype Name Joined 4657 days ago 1044 posts - 1823 votes Speaks: English*, French, Spanish Studies: Italian | Message 31 of 251 11 January 2013 at 2:48pm | IP Logged | ||
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I never look at the French version before doing the translation, even though Assimil tells you to, because I feel like I would be relying too much on short term memory if I got to look at it beforehand. This means that I often mess up whichever words haven't been used in a few dozen lessons.
[Edit: But I also tend to review the audio of lessons weekly. I have them in a seven-group rotation, e.g. I review lessons 1, 8, 15, etc. together on one day, then 2, 9, 16, etc. on another day, and so on. So this provides some reinforcement of vocab.] Edited by tastyonions on 11 January 2013 at 2:51pm 2 persons have voted this message useful | |||
| geoffw Triglot Senior Member United States Joined 4680 days ago 1134 posts - 1865 votes Speaks: English*, German, Yiddish Studies: Modern Hebrew, French, Dutch, Italian, Russian | Message 32 of 251 11 January 2013 at 2:54pm | IP Logged | ||
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Interesting. So do you ever find yourself just at a loss as to the vocab? If so, how to you deal with it? After reviewing
the French text, I usually have more issues with grammatical forms, prepositions, and the like, but even then I still have some vocab that I need to refresh. 1 person has voted this message useful |
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