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PeterMollenburg
Senior Member
AustraliaRegistered users can see my Skype Name
Joined 5479 days ago
821 posts - 1273 votes 
Speaks: English*
Studies: FrenchB1
| Message 81 of 451 02 May 2014 at 1:49am | IP Logged |
songlines wrote:
Re. the film/TV watching: unless you have it only in the background as "noise" while
you're concentrating on
other things, I'd certainly suggest "counting" it. It may not be what you think of as
study-study, but it's still
valuable input/exposure to native material. - Perhaps keep tracking it separately...?
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Hey songlines.....
Now that I've registered for the superchallenge (double in French). I need to count
everything I watch, thus i'll do a readjustment to my previous hours up to this point,
(see below).
------------------------------------------------------------ -----------
study time adjusted, readjusted and adjusted again.. very important stuff!
----------------------------------
Légende / Legend
C = Cours (Courses)
A = Audio seulement (Audio only)
L = Lecture (Reading)
R = Regarder ; films français etc
(Watching; French movies etc)
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French:
Heures d'etudes 2014
(Hours of Study 2014)
Date: 01/05/14 (FIRST DAY OF MAY INCUDED IN TOTALS & TOTAL AVG HERE)
Hrs,min: C213,06 A86,40 L24,30 E0,30 R33,05
Total:357,51
Jours (days): 121
Moy. de l'an: 2,57
(Yearly average)
----------------------------------
Les mois:
--------
avril:
(April) C34 A12,35 L1 R20
Total: 67,35
Moy. du mois: 2,15
(Monthly average)
----------------------------------
mars:
(March) C24,30 A24,45 L11 E0,30 R9
Total: 69,45
Moy. du mois: 2,15
(Monthly average)
----------------------------------
février:
(February) C49,55 A21,30 L7 R3
Total: 81.25
Moy. du mois: 2,54
(Monthly average)
----------------------------------
janvier:
(January) C101,41 A27.50 L3,30 R0
Total: 133,01
Moy. du mois: 4,17
(Monthly average)
----------------------------------
----------------------------------
Dutch:
Studie-uren 2014
(Hours of Study 2014)
Het begin
(Commenced): 20/3/14
Datum (date): 30/04/14
Uren,minuten: C33
(hours,min)
Totaal (total): 33
Dagen (days): 42
Gemiddelde per dag
(daily average): 47min
----------------------------------
De maanden
(the months):
---------
april:
(April): C23
Totaal: 23
(total)
Maandgemiddelde
(monthly average): 46min
----------------------------------
maart:
(March): C10
Totaal
(total): 10
----------------------------------
SUPERCHALLENGE:
I opted to go for a double SC in French :)
As for the superchallenge, twitter will take a little getting used to. I've PLENTY of
books- paper format, epub (on iBooks) Audiobooks with text, I've signed up to use Yabla
again today for a year. I have Engrenages to watch (all 4 seasons), I have about 25
French movies that I can watch any number of times, I've the season of Les Revenants
which I can watch again, I've got a handful of Easy French readers and some VERY thick
French texts, I've all levels of reading out there. Some I will read faster, some
intensively. I've also got the whole series of Sex and the City which has both French
subtitles and French audio dub so I'll prob go through those too as well as some other
series with similar options. I'm not going to count my coursework in which books are
used as I've decided I will aim to do ONE hour of coursework a day from here on, which
will likely entail very little advancement in the texts I use. I'll need all the time I
can get as I'm a slow reader and usually with French EXTRA EXTRA SLOW as I usually opt
to read intensively, when I dont i'm still a LOT slower than most
1 person has voted this message useful
| napoleon
Tetraglot
Senior Member
India
Joined 5019 days ago
543 posts - 874 votes
Speaks: Bengali*, English, Hindi, Urdu
Studies: French, Arabic (Written)
| Message 82 of 451 02 May 2014 at 7:24am | IP Logged |
I noticed you'd registered for the Super Challenge. Or rather, a Double SC.
We'll have so much fun this year with the Super Challenge.
En avant!
1 person has voted this message useful
| PeterMollenburg
Senior Member
AustraliaRegistered users can see my Skype Name
Joined 5479 days ago
821 posts - 1273 votes
Speaks: English*
Studies: FrenchB1
| Message 83 of 451 02 May 2014 at 8:07am | IP Logged |
napoleon wrote:
I noticed you'd registered for the Super Challenge. Or rather, a Double SC.
We'll have so much fun this year with the Super Challenge.
En avant! |
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Yep a double SC, no onion, no beetroot, no pineapple, with goats cheese, 1 live goat, sea salt & a flipsy, plus
a dabb of avocado, a poached egg & some bacon.
Tnx napoleon, Bonne chance avec ton défi super doublé... I recently started following ur log so expect me to
leave u behind in my dust, not. Seriously, I'll be following you, all the best!
2 persons have voted this message useful
| napoleon
Tetraglot
Senior Member
India
Joined 5019 days ago
543 posts - 874 votes
Speaks: Bengali*, English, Hindi, Urdu
Studies: French, Arabic (Written)
| Message 84 of 451 02 May 2014 at 9:07am | IP Logged |
Your posts are like a ray of sunshine. You have a real funny bone in you. :)
Bonne chance à vous aussi, mais on croit que les livres seront plus difficiles que la télé. Au moins, il y a moins de livres à lire que la dernière fois.
P.S.
Je te suivrai aussi, surtout pour ta humour charmante.
Edited by napoleon on 02 May 2014 at 9:14am
1 person has voted this message useful
| Jeffers
Senior Member
United Kingdom
Joined 4912 days ago
2151 posts - 3960 votes
Speaks: English*
Studies: Hindi, Ancient Greek, French, Sanskrit, German
| Message 85 of 451 02 May 2014 at 10:45am | IP Logged |
I was wondering if you had missed your own advice about not taking drugs while signing up
for the Super Challenge. Maybe you needed a strong drink to whack up the nerve to sign
up?
2 persons have voted this message useful
| PeterMollenburg
Senior Member
AustraliaRegistered users can see my Skype Name
Joined 5479 days ago
821 posts - 1273 votes
Speaks: English*
Studies: FrenchB1
| Message 86 of 451 11 May 2014 at 2:00am | IP Logged |
napoleon wrote:
Your posts are like a ray of sunshine. You have a real funny bone in
you. :)
Bonne chance à vous aussi, mais on croit que les livres seront plus difficiles que la
télé. Au moins, il y a moins de livres à lire que la dernière fois.
P.S.
Je te suivrai aussi, surtout pour ta humour charmante. |
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Thanks napoleon... I hope your SC is going well :)
1 person has voted this message useful
| PeterMollenburg
Senior Member
AustraliaRegistered users can see my Skype Name
Joined 5479 days ago
821 posts - 1273 votes
Speaks: English*
Studies: FrenchB1
| Message 87 of 451 11 May 2014 at 2:08am | IP Logged |
Jeffers wrote:
I was wondering if you had missed your own advice about not taking
drugs while signing up
for the Super Challenge. Maybe you needed a strong drink to whack up the nerve to sign
up? |
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Sorry Jeffers, not sure how I missed this post...
haha, yeah I went on drug fuelled binge for a few days, being the rockstar that I am.
Hence my pseudonym. Pleaes keep it hush hush when my real name is revealed over
Twitter, I don't want a wave of fan histeria coming my way.
I didn't get going on the SC for a couple of days as I needed to get my head around the
concept first by reading a lot of the discussion. Then came the birth of my beautiful
daughter :) While we were still in hospital I began little by little increasing my
reading amount each day and started using Yabla for video content. On returning home
I'm sprinkling study in between helping my wife with the management of the household
and 'baby time'. When I return to work I'd imagine juggling all this will become a
little trickier. Fortnuately -touches wooden desk- our baby is a pretty settled baby
and allows for us to not walk around like zombies throughout the day.
You're doing extremely well on your SC, keep it up, i've been noting your progress near
the top of the leaderboard. It seems there are a couple up the top that eat, sleep and
live for this challenge, perhaps reluctanctly even. It might be hard to overcome their
feats of progress but you're cetainly doing extremely well hot on their tails ;) Thanks
for your help along the way Jeffers :)
2 persons have voted this message useful
| PeterMollenburg
Senior Member
AustraliaRegistered users can see my Skype Name
Joined 5479 days ago
821 posts - 1273 votes
Speaks: English*
Studies: FrenchB1
| Message 88 of 451 11 May 2014 at 2:29am | IP Logged |
Here's a copy of a discussion from the Super Challenge discussion thread page 14
discussing the effectiveness of native content films
PeterMollenburg wrote:
Hey guys,
This SuperChallenge is pretty cool. For me it's giving me the 'push' to use more native
materials, and for me the 'course collector' that's certainly a good thing. As I was
slightly slow off the mark with this challenge and didn't really get going for a good
few days or more into the challenge with my reading and watching I went on a mission
and became rather enthused by the 'leader board' and climbing up the ladder some
ways... I went from 41s to breaking into the top 20.
But in my madness to read and read and watch and watch I began to wonder relative my
language level (French B1) how effective watching movies really is. It so happens this
article mimics some of my suspicions, adds a few more and elaborates in a balanced way
on how useful it actually is to your goal of improving in a language depending on your
level to watch foreign movies.
Are
You Wasting Your Time Watching Foreign Language Movies?
Just to balance this post out a little I'd like to include the following link which
says exactly why reading, and more precisely 'extensive reading' is so good for
language learning:
The inescapable case for
extensive reading
These articles may have come up before on HTLAL, but I just thought it would be
worthwhile reflexion for some of us who's main goal after all is fluency (whatever that
means for the individual) |
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Jeffers followed up with this:
Jeffers wrote:
All I can say about the first article is: wait and see. Yes, his
points against watching films have an element of truth. But you can find flaws with
any language learning method. So I say, wait and see. Watch your 200 films in French
(since you signed up for a double), and I'm pretty sure you will see significant
benefit. In the first few months, you will no doubt think that the article is
absolutely correct. But the more you watch, the more you will find that the language
is becoming familiar.
Okay, you will probably gain more from reading your 200 books. But that half of the
challenge is a much greater time commitment, and generally speaking more taxing.
One thing I didn't get in the article is when the author wrote, "You can’t listen
multiple times." I have watched the Hindi film Sholay at least a dozen times. In the
last 2 years, I've watched Amélie 5-6 times. I'm now reading slowly through the script
to Amélie, and I plan to watch it again a few times when I'm pretty sure I understand
almost everything. What's interesting about this is that I find I understand most of
the text simply because I've watched the film so many times with subtitles. So,
clearly something has sunk in.
The advice at the end of the article is actually pretty good advice for how to watch
films. I would add one thing: find a few films that you really enjoy and wouldn't
mind repeating. Then study the films. Jot down notes while watching them, and build
up more notes as you go. Over the course of the Super Challenge watch them as many
times as possible. Initially watch with subtitles if necessary, but after a couple
times, you should probably be okay watching without subs. In other words, use the
intensive approach with a few films. Over the course of the Super Challenge you should
see great improvements in your understanding of those few films, but also improved
comprehension of other films as well.
To steal some advice from emk, Buffy the Vampire Slayer is dubbed pretty well in
French, and transcripts are available. He has also recommended starting with
documentaries, since the speaking is clearer and slower than the average film. I would
add that another good option is 7 jours sur la planète, since you can read the nearly
exact French subs while watching. |
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And Expugnator wrote:
Expugnator wrote:
My 2C: watching dubbed series was quite comfortable after the first
series. Watching
native films is still hard after 1 1/2 year of watching at least 10 minutes each day.
Maybe reading scripts in the beginning will be the best thing to do in order to make
sure
you will actually become familiarized with the French employed in those films. |
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and me....
PeterMollenburg wrote:
Jeffers wrote:
Okay, you will probably gain more from reading your 200 books. But that half of the
challenge is a much greater time commitment, and generally speaking more taxing.
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I think I'll be 'leaning' more on the reading side of things but still continue some
watching of course. I will utilise more of the pause and play type method and Yabla I
think as it makes you focus on the language. Then my entertainment/down time I could
spend watching the movies/series. In Yabla I can watch short clips over and over and
play a game in which you fill in the missing words from the dialogue. I know I need to
hear language spoken at normal speed also so I won't ignore films and series but I will
certainly try to use more active methods of study. I'm beginning to doubt the
likelihood of me completing a 'double' given the time commitment in the last few days,
which cannot be sustained when I return to work (i'm on leave), and that when I do use
Yabla/pause and play method it takes me at least double the time to watch something- ie
a 30 min episode of sth takes at least an hour, more if I enter some flashcards at the
end, which I find is important if I want to get something out of what I watch. The
thing for me too is to not drop my courses as I do indeed get benefit from them, so I
need balance of decent learning strategies.
Jeffers wrote:
One thing I didn't get in the article is when the author wrote, "You can’t listen
multiple times." I have watched the Hindi film Sholay at least a dozen times. In the
last 2 years, I've watched Amélie 5-6 times. I'm now reading slowly through the script
to Amélie, and I plan to watch it again a few times when I'm pretty sure I understand
almost everything. What's interesting about this is that I find I understand most of
the text simply because I've watched the film so many times with subtitles. So,
clearly something has sunk in.
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I totally agree, I found that point a little weak as well.
Jeffers wrote:
The advice at the end of the article is actually pretty good advice for how to watch
films. I would add one thing: find a few films that you really enjoy and wouldn't
mind repeating. Then study the films. Jot down notes while watching them, and build
up more notes as you go. Over the course of the Super Challenge watch them as many
times as possible. Initially watch with subtitles if necessary, but after a couple
times, you should probably be okay watching without subs. In other words, use the
intensive approach with a few films. Over the course of the Super Challenge you should
see great improvements in your understanding of those few films, but also improved
comprehension of other films as well.
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Sounds good to me :)
Jeffers wrote:
To steal some advice from emk, Buffy the Vampire Slayer is dubbed pretty well in
French, and transcripts are available. He has also recommended starting with
documentaries, since the speaking is clearer and slower than the average film. I would
add that another good option is 7 jours sur la planète, since you can read the nearly
exact French subs while watching. |
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Yeah, I have been pondering whether I should buy Buffy, I think I will at some point.
Documentaries sounds like a good idea too. As for 7 jours sur la planete, i need to
look into that. I have the app on my phone but have not tried it out, but I think that
would be different to what you're talking about, i'm sure a search online will land me
in the right place, so I'll check it out. Thanks for your input Jeffers :) |
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Edited by PeterMollenburg on 11 May 2014 at 2:30am
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