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Finding Holes at B2/C1/C2 | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : Advice Center |  | |
| sctroyenne Diglot Senior Member United StatesRegistered users can see my Skype Name Joined 5382 days ago 739 posts - 1312 votes  Speaks: English*, French Studies: Spanish, Irish | Message 1 of 21 10 March 2014 at 8:46pm | IP Logged | ||
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So at the advanced level, I should be able to express anything in my TL that I can in my
native language. But also at the advanced level, I should be able to think of what I want to say directly in the TL and quickly re-formulate what I want to say using what I'm capable of saying. Having lived in an immersion environment, I feel like I got pretty good at the latter - so good, that it's hard to figure out what I *can't* say. Does anyone have suggestions for exercises or activities that will help uncover what I'm missing? I thought of perhaps translating my writing/thoughts from English to French so that I know exactly what I want to say without my brain adapting my thoughts to only include what I already know how to say. Any thoughts? 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Leurre Bilingual Pentaglot Senior Member United StatesRegistered users can see my Skype Name Joined 5416 days ago 219 posts - 372 votes Speaks: French*, English*, Korean, Haitian Creole, SpanishC2 Studies: Japanese | Message 2 of 21 10 March 2014 at 9:16pm | IP Logged | ||
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Reformulating what other people say in more concise ways is in my experience much harder-
maybe this is one 'hole' you could turn your attention to? I used to do exercises where I would take any native speaker's argument (from all different levels of register) and summarize it on the spot. Then I would do that while switching levels of speech (easier for Korean and less obvious for French, but still doable). So I would pretend I would be summarizing an eloquent argument to a friend, casually, or a casual argument in front of a professor, etc. Just a thought. 5 persons have voted this message useful | |||
| Serpent Octoglot Senior Member Russian Federation serpent-849.livejour Joined 6588 days ago 9753 posts - 15779 votes 4 sounds Speaks: Russian*, English, FinnishC1, Latin, German, Italian, Spanish, Portuguese Studies: Danish, Romanian, Polish, Belarusian, Ukrainian, Croatian, Slovenian, Catalan, Czech, Galician, Dutch, Swedish | Message 3 of 21 11 March 2014 at 12:38pm | IP Logged | ||
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I like Benny's approach to this
4 persons have voted this message useful | |||
| Luso Hexaglot Senior Member Portugal Joined 6052 days ago 819 posts - 1812 votes Speaks: Portuguese*, French, EnglishC2, GermanB1, Italian, Spanish Studies: Sanskrit, Arabic (classical) | Message 4 of 21 11 March 2014 at 2:18pm | IP Logged | ||
In my experience, there's a difference between attaining a high formal level (C1, C2) in some language and reaching the level you describe. We all have ways of dealing with our shortcomings: I tend to take refuge in expressions I already know. Talking with some colleagues (that was in German class), they confessed to be doing the same. I suggest you try a bit of a native's life: see news broadcasts, read books, talk to people, etc. If you are very comfortable with all you hear, read and say, congratulations! If not, go plug those holes in your knowledge. 3 persons have voted this message useful | |||
| Serpent Octoglot Senior Member Russian Federation serpent-849.livejour Joined 6588 days ago 9753 posts - 15779 votes 4 sounds Speaks: Russian*, English, FinnishC1, Latin, German, Italian, Spanish, Portuguese Studies: Danish, Romanian, Polish, Belarusian, Ukrainian, Croatian, Slovenian, Catalan, Czech, Galician, Dutch, Swedish | Message 5 of 21 11 March 2014 at 3:03pm | IP Logged | ||
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Natives also have the same kind of shortcomings, btw. It's normal that some things are easier to express in one language than another.
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| osoymar Tetraglot Pro Member United States Joined 4727 days ago 190 posts - 344 votes Speaks: English*, German, Portuguese, Japanese Studies: Spanish, French Personal Language Map | Message 6 of 21 11 March 2014 at 6:45pm | IP Logged | ||
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One of my professors told me about Benjamin Franklin's approach to improving his
speaking- he would find a transcript of a speech he found particularly well done, have it dictated to him and take notes. He would then try to give the speech himself, based on his notes. Comparing the two allowed him to find turns of phrase and rhetorical techniques that he had not yet mastered. It's a somewhat tedious exercise, but this can be extremely helpful for improving languages at B2 and above. You just need to find some video or audio on a topic and in a register you'd like to work on, (you only need the transcript if you need it to understand, in which case I would recommend finding an easier source or using another technique) and you don't even need a teacher to correct you- just note places where you substituted an expression more familiar to you for what the speaker used, or areas where you hesitated. Of course, once you've noted some expressions that you'd like to add to your active repertoire, you can spend a bit of time practicing them. You can do this in a separate session if it's too exhausting to do it all at once. 5 persons have voted this message useful | |||
| kujichagulia Senior Member Japan Joined 4838 days ago 1031 posts - 1571 votes Speaks: English* Studies: Japanese, Portuguese | Message 7 of 21 12 March 2014 at 12:54am | IP Logged | ||
Just wanted to say that this link is awesome. Thank you very much! 2 persons have voted this message useful | |||
| tarvos Super Polyglot Winner TAC 2012 Senior Member China likeapolyglot.wordpr Joined 4698 days ago 5310 posts - 9399 votes Speaks: Dutch*, English, Swedish, French, Russian, German, Italian, Norwegian, Mandarin, Romanian, Afrikaans Studies: Greek, Modern Hebrew, Spanish, Portuguese, Czech, Korean, Esperanto, Finnish | Message 8 of 21 12 March 2014 at 12:03pm | IP Logged | ||
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One thing I do is take complex texts (literary or historical) and force myself to
rephrase them in my own words in modern language. I do this especially in French right now, and it's amazing how many words you still miss (even though I can definitely claim to speak French). 2 persons have voted this message useful |
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