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The Awesome Difficulty of Korean, Finnish | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : Language Learning Log |  | |
| Chung Diglot Senior Member Joined 7148 days ago 4228 posts - 8259 votes  20 sounds Speaks: English*, French Studies: Polish, Slovak, Uzbek, Turkish, Korean, Finnish | Message 25 of 559 07 May 2012 at 11:56pm | IP Logged | |||||
That's funny. I feel somewhat similarly when I hear Latvian. It sounds a little bit like Estonian and Finnish. However there are times when Latvian sounds more like Lithuanian (or at least it dredges up stuff that I got used to from TY Lithuanian) - it could be the words and syntax that trigger that response.
I also just can't listen to / watch the videos repeatedly but find them much more usable when doing the associated exercises and reading the texts that paraphrase the dialogues (although I gather that you don't have the books). Have you tried watching Supisuomea and then doing some of the attached exercises? 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| Evita Tetraglot Senior Member Latvia learnlatvian.info Joined 6544 days ago 734 posts - 1036 votes Speaks: Latvian*, English, German, Russian Studies: Korean, Finnish | Message 26 of 559 08 May 2012 at 12:15am | IP Logged | |||||
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Regarding Korean - yes, they mentioned the numbers only go up to 100. Oh well, I'll have to learn them anyway, probably with the help of Anki.
Korean reminds me of French with the way the next word can change how the previous word is pronounced. It's difficult to remember all the rules and therefore I'm very grateful for the TTMIK podcasts. Learning grammar from them is fun, yes, but their biggest value for me is in pronunciation and listening practice. They have 25 lessons in the first level and then they have a test lesson which is 100% in Korean and which uses only words taught in the level 1 lessons so I should be able to understand it once I've finished all the lessons. But I don't know, I'm not sure what to expect. Usually when both teachers talk to each other they do it too fast for me. I will probably need to review most lessons at least one more time before I attempt the test. Maybe next week if everything goes well. EDIT: About Supisuomea - I've seen the site and I decided to leave it for later. I've tried various things for Finnish and I realized that it's best to learn grammar from my book. I will use the internet resources for listening and reading practice when I've done all the noun cases and all the main verb forms. Edited by Evita on 08 May 2012 at 12:21am 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| Warp3 Senior Member United States forum_posts.asp?TID= Joined 5527 days ago 1419 posts - 1766 votes Speaks: English* Studies: Spanish, Korean, Japanese | Message 27 of 559 08 May 2012 at 12:18am | IP Logged | |||||
CZ is right. The Sino-Korean numbers are used far more often than Native Korean ones, especially for anything beyond the 30-40 range. So while the lower numbers are still important (1-9, 10, 20, 30, and maybe even 40) then higher numbers (50, 60, 70, 80, 90) are used less frequently than you'd expect. Native Korean also stops at 99, so 100+ uses Sino-Korean anyway. Edited by Warp3 on 08 May 2012 at 12:19am 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| Evita Tetraglot Senior Member Latvia learnlatvian.info Joined 6544 days ago 734 posts - 1036 votes Speaks: Latvian*, English, German, Russian Studies: Korean, Finnish | Message 28 of 559 09 May 2012 at 11:25pm | IP Logged | |||||
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As I have mentioned, my minimum goal for each day is to do the Anki reviews in both languages. On most days I also try to add some new words but that depends on how much I actually study and how many new words I come across. And I didn't do much studying in the last two days. I expect the next two will be better.
Finnish I kept up with Anki and added a couple of new words from lesson 6 of my book but I didn't do much else. Korean I listened to TTMIK lessons 4, 5, and 6 again in my effort to review everything before trying the level 1 test. The stuff there seems easy now. I added the vocabulary to Anki so it's all good. Speaking of Anki, I'm a bit disappointed that the sibling card delay doesn't work as expected. When doing the reviews today I got both siblings of a card in one session, and that shouldn't happen according to the settings. Oh well, I guess I'll have to live with it until Anki 2 comes out. They've been preparing the new release for almost a year now so hopefully it will be ready soon. Also, I changed the maximum number of new cards in a day to 12. Since every Korean word has two cards I decided I needed to move through them a bit faster, especially since I already know some of those words very well (I learned them before I started using Anki). Oh, and a milestone - today was the first time I typed in Korean without having the printed keyboard layout before me. It went quite well. 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| Evita Tetraglot Senior Member Latvia learnlatvian.info Joined 6544 days ago 734 posts - 1036 votes Speaks: Latvian*, English, German, Russian Studies: Korean, Finnish | Message 29 of 559 13 May 2012 at 11:31am | IP Logged | |||||
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I can't say that language studying has been a big part of my last week but I have dutifully spent at least 20 minutes each day on each language, mainly to work with Anki. My Finnish word count is up to 375 at the moment. Do Finns really use the same word 'kynä' for both pens and pencils?
I tried out the "Hyvin menee" book and audio. I think it's a good resource if you have a teacher but not so much by itself because it's all in Finnish (and no answers to exercises). And the audio contains long pauses between words and expressions. My Korean deck has 74 cards at the moment, which means 37 words. 19 of the reverse cards are still waiting to be shown for the first time. A couple of days ago, I changed the delay time for new sibling cards up to 22,000 minutes to lessen the chance of both sibling cards being shown in the same session. What I'm doing with my Korean deck is - I'm slowly adding words to it from my notes from the TTMIK lessons. It's turning into a routine now that my typing is getting better (I no longer feel like I'm embarking on a special project just to enter some words in Korean) so it's a good thing. I'm hoping I can keep it up once I start work again in a week. I'm not entering the Korean numbers into Anki yet. I'm not sure if I even should. It's probably not important to know how to write them, the important thing is to recognize them when you hear them, and I'm not good at it because I've had very little practice. 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| Serpent Octoglot Senior Member Russian Federation serpent-849.livejour Joined 6589 days ago 9753 posts - 15779 votes 4 sounds Speaks: Russian*, English, FinnishC1, Latin, German, Italian, Spanish, Portuguese Studies: Danish, Romanian, Polish, Belarusian, Ukrainian, Croatian, Slovenian, Catalan, Czech, Galician, Dutch, Swedish | Message 30 of 559 13 May 2012 at 12:16pm | IP Logged | |||||
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well, pencil is lyijykynä (lyijy=lead), and you can say just kynä, it will be understood depending on the context. for example, if you try a google images search you'll see that it's equally common in both meanings:)
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| Evita Tetraglot Senior Member Latvia learnlatvian.info Joined 6544 days ago 734 posts - 1036 votes Speaks: Latvian*, English, German, Russian Studies: Korean, Finnish | Message 31 of 559 14 May 2012 at 12:09am | IP Logged | |||||
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Today I was thinking about word order in a sentence. Korean is completely different, of course, but the Finnish word order is quite similar to Latvian - not surprisingly so, perhaps, since both languages rely on case endings to express relationships between words. My Finnish textbook doesn't say much about word order, though, so I looked up the respective article on Wikipedia. There are six examples of how to say "I have money" in Finnish, and I think all of them correspond perfectly to Latvian. I love that.
However, I noticed a difference between the Finnish and the Latvian word order already in the first lesson and it was difficult to get used to. In sentences like "Missä kirja on?" (Where is the book?) the Latvian word order would be "Missä on kirja?" I think I've gotten mostly used to it now but it was a rather big obstacle when I just started learning Finnish. And I'm sure I would mess up the word order even now if I had to speak Finnish to someone. As for Korean... having the verb at the end of the sentence is one major thing. Having question words in the middle of the sentence is another major thing. The fact that Koreans omit pronouns like crazy and that "샀어요?" (Bought?) means "Did you buy it?" (or even "Did he buy it?", depending on the context) is yet another major thing I'm trying to get used to. On one hand, it all seems so difficult, but on the other hand, I love that it's so different. It's exciting. And did anyone see the recent NCIS episode "Playing With Fire"? It had a whole Korean subplot, there was a document in Korean and they were trying to decipher it. I thought it was pretty cool. But my knowledge of Korean allowed me to notice that all the syllables in the letter they found had a final consonant in them, which would never happen if you hit the keyboard keys typing English words but disguising them in Hangeul. I'm guessing the NCIS prop department tried to make all the syllables look somewhat similar to the average American who doesn't speak Korean. Heh. 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| viedums Hexaglot Senior Member Thailand Joined 4658 days ago 327 posts - 528 votes Speaks: Latvian, English*, German, Mandarin, Thai, French Studies: Vietnamese | Message 32 of 559 14 May 2012 at 4:42pm | IP Logged | |||||
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Your remarks about how Finnish sounds like Latvian are interesting. It makes me wonder about the phenomenon of vowel harmony that exists in Latvian – the way ‘es vēlos’ is pronounced with an open ē but ‘tu vēlies’ with a closed one. I’m curious if this could be attributed to contact with Finnish, although it seems that Finnish vowel harmony works in the opposite direction, i.e. the initial vowel influences what follows. And according to Wikipedia, “standard Estonian has lost its vowel harmony.” Hmm… in any case it might make that aspect of Finnish easier to pick up.
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