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Declined nouns | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : Philological Room |  | |
| Cavesa Triglot Senior Member Czech Republic Joined 4998 days ago 3277 posts - 6779 votes  Speaks: Czech*, FrenchC2, EnglishC1 Studies: Spanish, German, Italian | Message 9 of 33 25 June 2013 at 11:15pm | IP Logged | ||
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Czech
Slovak most slavic languages 2 persons have voted this message useful | |||
| tarvos Super Polyglot Winner TAC 2012 Senior Member China likeapolyglot.wordpr Joined 4696 days ago 5310 posts - 9399 votes Speaks: Dutch*, English, Swedish, French, Russian, German, Italian, Norwegian, Mandarin, Romanian, Afrikaans Studies: Greek, Modern Hebrew, Spanish, Portuguese, Czech, Korean, Esperanto, Finnish | Message 10 of 33 25 June 2013 at 11:23pm | IP Logged | ||
Breton does not uses cases. EDIT: See Mark got there first, he is correct about Breton indeed (don't know about Welsh). In Dutch cases are obsolete, although genitives are found in archaisms, and other cases are found in set phrases or oblique pronouns. One hundred years ago they were alive and well in the written language though Edited by tarvos on 25 June 2013 at 11:34pm 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Chung Diglot Senior Member Joined 7145 days ago 4228 posts - 8259 votes 20 sounds Speaks: English*, French Studies: Polish, Slovak, Uzbek, Turkish, Korean, Finnish | Message 11 of 33 25 June 2013 at 11:57pm | IP Logged | ||
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All Uralic languages as far as I know make such distinctions to varying degrees.
By number of cases (sometimes hard to define) and the associated marking, Komi-Permyak and Obdorsk Khanty represent extremes in quantity with the former having 24 of them (I keep thinking that another Komi dialect has 27, but I can't find the source for that anymore) while the latter has 3. This map on WALS for number of cases in 261 languages should be of interest. 2 persons have voted this message useful | |||
| Cavesa Triglot Senior Member Czech Republic Joined 4998 days ago 3277 posts - 6779 votes Speaks: Czech*, FrenchC2, EnglishC1 Studies: Spanish, German, Italian | Message 12 of 33 26 June 2013 at 12:52am | IP Logged | ||
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It would be an awesome map but I find it quite contraproductive that there is a note for many languages with no declinations but some languages with the declinations aren't there just because the countries are small. :-)
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| Serpent Octoglot Senior Member Russian Federation serpent-849.livejour Joined 6586 days ago 9753 posts - 15779 votes 4 sounds Speaks: Russian*, English, FinnishC1, Latin, German, Italian, Spanish, Portuguese Studies: Danish, Romanian, Polish, Belarusian, Ukrainian, Croatian, Slovenian, Catalan, Czech, Galician, Dutch, Swedish | Message 13 of 33 26 June 2013 at 9:35am | IP Logged | ||
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Even Ukraine doesn't have a note :/
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| Josquin Heptaglot Senior Member Germany Joined 4833 days ago 2266 posts - 3992 votes Speaks: German*, English, French, Latin, Italian, Russian, Swedish Studies: Japanese, Irish, Portuguese, Persian | Message 14 of 33 26 June 2013 at 10:18am | IP Logged | ||
You're right, the Brythonic languages don't have cases. Sorry about that, I thought they had. 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| tarvos Super Polyglot Winner TAC 2012 Senior Member China likeapolyglot.wordpr Joined 4696 days ago 5310 posts - 9399 votes Speaks: Dutch*, English, Swedish, French, Russian, German, Italian, Norwegian, Mandarin, Romanian, Afrikaans Studies: Greek, Modern Hebrew, Spanish, Portuguese, Czech, Korean, Esperanto, Finnish | Message 15 of 33 26 June 2013 at 10:50am | IP Logged | ||
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I don't know about Welsh, but Breton has quite simple grammar. It shares the mutations
with its other Celtic brethren, but plural formation is quite simple for example, and word order is very flexible due to it being topicalised (and almost always verb- second). RE: Arabic, I believe MSA has three cases; nominative, accusative, genitive, but I am not sure about the dialects, which could vary wildly. Wikipedia states that for Classical Arabic, the construct state is relevant and that it puts the modifying noun in the genitive case. In Hebrew at least, there are no cases. However nouns that modify other nouns in noun- noun phrases modify the pronunciation (and sometimes spelling) of the noun. Hei usually becomes Tav at the end of a noun in status constructus. You could call this a "case", as it usually implies a construction close to an adjectival or genitival phrase; "beit sefer" (house of book), meaning a school. It also occurs in other situations "Mishpachat Zahavi" (the Zahavi family). The word for family is mishpachah. However the use of status constructus in Semitic languages is not productive everywhere. In Hebrew, its use to form genitival phrases (which are actually mirrored quite well by Breton, which prefers noun-noun phrases to noun-adjective ones), is usually supplanted by using a prepositional phrase "shel" nowadays. In Breton genitival phrasings are usually done by nouns. "E ti da dud" (in your parents' house, literally in house your parents). Edited by tarvos on 26 June 2013 at 12:28pm 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
 Iversen Super Polyglot Moderator Denmark berejst.dk Joined 6692 days ago 9078 posts - 16473 votes Speaks: Danish*, French, English, German, Italian, Spanish, Portuguese, Dutch, Swedish, Esperanto, Romanian, Catalan Studies: Afrikaans, Greek, Norwegian, Russian, Serbian, Icelandic, Latin, Irish, Lowland Scots, Indonesian, Polish, Croatian Personal Language Map | Message 16 of 33 26 June 2013 at 12:15pm | IP Logged | ||
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So among the current Romance languages only Romanian has cases (though Ancient French had them too). The Brythonic languages don't have them, Dutch may be on the way to loosing its genitive, but all other Indoeuropean and Uralic languages have at least 2 cases (1 case isn't enough to form a case system), and the genitive is normally the last separate case to get lost. Even Esperanto has cases because of its accusative, but no genitive.
Edited by Iversen on 26 June 2013 at 12:16pm 1 person has voted this message useful |
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