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English as the universal language | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : General discussion |  | |
| cordelia0507 Senior Member United Kingdom Joined 5840 days ago 1473 posts - 2176 votes  Speaks: Swedish* Studies: German, Russian | Message 97 of 206 14 November 2009 at 12:21pm | IP Logged | |||||
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Currently the norm for language studies in school, in Northern Europe (smaller countries) is some variation of this (don't nitpick, just an illustration)
Current Setup Foreign language 1 (compulsory): English Foreign language 2 (compulsory) Choose one: German / French Foreign language 3 (optional) Choose one: As above + Spanish / Russian (in some schools a non-European language on offer). In the interest of fairness, simplicity and promoting unity on equal terms: My Preferred model for the EU! Foreign Language 1 (compulsory): Esperanto Foreign Language 2 (compulsory) Choose one: English / German / French / Spanish Foreign Language 3 (Optional) Choose one: As above + Russian / Chinese / Arabic . 4 persons have voted this message useful | ||||||
| cordelia0507 Senior Member United Kingdom Joined 5840 days ago 1473 posts - 2176 votes Speaks: Swedish* Studies: German, Russian | Message 98 of 206 14 November 2009 at 12:47pm | IP Logged | |||||
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Furthermore, here is what would "cure" the English of their aversion to foreign languages:
Brit (in English): Excuse me where is the nearest metro station? Frenchman (in French OR Esperanto): I am sorry, my English is not very good, how can I help you? (repeat x26 across the EU... Eventually he'd get it... ) For speakers of smaller languages, the idea of leaving ones own country/area and still speak ones own language is ludicrous! And imagine the attitude that a German person would get in London if he went up to the nearest Englishman and asked for directions in German...And while considering that, bear in mind that German is IN FACT a MUCH bigger EU language than English is. "There is something rotten in the state of the.... EU....." Anyway, I don't think this adds up. There is only one explanation for the domination of English in the EU and that explanation is not European.. so why are we accomodating it? Wake up, fellow union citizens! :-) Edited by cordelia0507 on 14 November 2009 at 12:52pm 2 persons have voted this message useful | ||||||
| Gusutafu Senior Member Sweden Joined 5523 days ago 655 posts - 1039 votes Speaks: Swedish* | Message 99 of 206 14 November 2009 at 1:15pm | IP Logged | |||||
Since at least 99% of the European population easily prefers English to Esperanto, you may have a hard time rallying support. And what exactly is "fair" about forcing everyone in Europe to study a particular, made up language? Every country is equally oppressed by the central European dictatorship? I suppose that IS fair in a way. And why discriminate against Arabic, Chinese or Swahili? In the interest of the state religion Multiculturalism, aren't all immigrant languages equally sacred? Edited by Gusutafu on 14 November 2009 at 1:18pm 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| cordelia0507 Senior Member United Kingdom Joined 5840 days ago 1473 posts - 2176 votes Speaks: Swedish* Studies: German, Russian | Message 100 of 206 14 November 2009 at 2:38pm | IP Logged | |||||
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I think your personal view of the EU and issues such as "multiculturalism" is distracting you from the question of a common language for the EU.. I agree that those are important concerns, but:
If we take EU as a given (or pretend that Sweden isn't in the EU) then consider this: 1) A headmaster of a German school travels to a European conference on education, in Helsinki. 2) An EU expert on agriculture (Portuguese) is having lunch with a Polish colleague in Brussels. 3) An Italian chef is giving a lecture on pasta-making in Hungary... 4) A Greek policeman is liaiasing with a colleague in France about an escaped criminal. 5) An Austrian athlete participates in a competition in the Netherlands. None of these are scenarios are unlikely in the least. What is absurd about it is that their conversation is likely to be in English! What possible justification could there be for this? 1) It's not the language of any of the people or places in the examples... 2) Both the German and the French speaking people are native speaker of languages that is BIGGER in the EU than English. 3) To get to a decent conversational level in English all of the people involved would have had to spend HUGE amounts of time that could be better spent on other things. This is particularly true for the speakers of non Germanic languages. WHY in your opinion is it right for these people to speak English under the circumstances in the examples? Edited by cordelia0507 on 14 November 2009 at 2:57pm 2 persons have voted this message useful | ||||||
| Gusutafu Senior Member Sweden Joined 5523 days ago 655 posts - 1039 votes Speaks: Swedish* | Message 101 of 206 14 November 2009 at 3:13pm | IP Logged | |||||
It's pretty convenient, considering that they all will have studied English at school. It may be absurd that English is the lingua franca, but it is. I would have liked it to be Greek, Latin or even better, Old Church Slavonic. I could settle for German or French too, but English isn't that bad either. Isn't it because of familiarity that people dislike English as a lingua franca? If we all had to study French, do you think you would like that any better? Or Esperanto, that would be crazy! There is no Esperanto Shakespear, no Esperanto Dickens. Not even any Esperanto CSI! One thing that would be even more absurd than using English, a third language so to speak, would be to use a language that isn't even spoken by anyone anywhere. You also seem to be forgetting that English has a fantastic literary heritage, and is the main language of several very large and rich countries. 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| Sennin Senior Member Bulgaria Joined 6036 days ago 1457 posts - 1759 votes 5 sounds | Message 102 of 206 14 November 2009 at 4:18pm | IP Logged | |||||
I think doing business in Old Church Slavonic or Latin would be pretty cool, but not very practical. Greek would give an unfair advantage to the Greek people and they're already boastful of their history, the Brits are no match for them. Esperanto is near the bottom of my list when it comes to the chic factor. The current situation with English being dominant is much preferable, at least it is a decent language with literature and all. ( ...and if people are multilingual they won't be so reliant on the lingua franca. ) Edited by Sennin on 14 November 2009 at 4:38pm 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| Gusutafu Senior Member Sweden Joined 5523 days ago 655 posts - 1039 votes Speaks: Swedish* | Message 103 of 206 14 November 2009 at 5:07pm | IP Logged | |||||
Not that you would have a head-start at Old Church Slavonic...
That's a very good point. Let English be one of the three or four languages each educated person knows. This probably won't happen, but it would be very much better than everyone knowing just their native language plus the lingua franca, or worse: just the lingua franca. 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| cordelia0507 Senior Member United Kingdom Joined 5840 days ago 1473 posts - 2176 votes Speaks: Swedish* Studies: German, Russian | Message 104 of 206 14 November 2009 at 5:57pm | IP Logged | |||||
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Literature is a "Red Herring" in this context.
What does Shakespeare and Dickens have to do with my ability to communicate with a Romanian or Dutch person in a mutually convenient language? Of course English is more convenient for US PERSONALLY, who are reading this right now on this forum, and who have been through 10 years of compulsory English in school, university literature etc. We are the perfect products of this system. I am saying, let's come up with a better solution now, to start introducing for future generations. The British Empire is over The Cold War is over. The future of the US as the main world power or indeed a world power all is unclear. New times, new language... For that matter, Esperanto is so easy to learn, that we could all be speaking it fluently next year if we wanted. Tell that to a Pole or Greek person who can barely make himself understood after years of studying English. 2 persons have voted this message useful |
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