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Does anyone else have the same view? | ||
Tags: Number of Languages | Fluency | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : General discussion |  | |
| cordelia0507 Senior Member United Kingdom Joined 5840 days ago 1473 posts - 2176 votes  Speaks: Swedish* Studies: German, Russian | Message 9 of 27 23 January 2010 at 9:31pm | IP Logged | ||
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That is a good choice. Stick with them for a few years until you spend any serious time on anything else. German has hard grammar and when it comes to Spanish in the USA your skills would always be compared with that of native speakers, so you need to get seriously good at it.
I am convinced you will one day have very impressive language skills, Datsunking! Be careful to stay focussed on quality in what you are doing and not jumping from one language to another. A vocabulary of a few hundred words, some tourist phrases and basic grammar is nothing more than a party trick. You might as well not bother. What you need is solid skills; Check out the Göthe institute's German certification (advanced) and set your sights on that - it's prestigeous. Shouldn't take you more than a year or two with your talent and high level of motivation, as long as you stay focussed. 3 persons have voted this message useful | |||
| mick33 Senior Member United States Joined 5926 days ago 1335 posts - 1632 votes Speaks: English* Studies: Finnish Studies: Thai, Polish, Afrikaans, Hindi, Hungarian, Italian, Spanish, Swedish | Message 10 of 27 23 January 2010 at 11:33pm | IP Logged | ||
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I agree with Cordelia, it's better to study a few languages and learn them well rather than study many languages but learn them poorly.
I also think it's a good idea to come up with personal definitions for terms like basic, or advanced fluency as part of setting goals for how to make progress in learning a language. Everyone says "I want to be fluent", but few people even try to define it or can explain what that means and those who do explain or define fluency disagree on everything except that achieving fluency is a good goal. So I decided that I needed to try to make up my own definition that hopefully will work for me. I did start my TAC log this year with a vague explanation of what I think fluency means for me, but it will most likely be edited many times because English is still my strongest language. Edited by mick33 on 23 January 2010 at 11:43pm 5 persons have voted this message useful | |||
| cordelia0507 Senior Member United Kingdom Joined 5840 days ago 1473 posts - 2176 votes Speaks: Swedish* Studies: German, Russian | Message 11 of 27 23 January 2010 at 11:39pm | IP Logged | ||
Good point. 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Splog Diglot Senior Member Czech Republic anthonylauder.c Joined 5671 days ago 1062 posts - 3263 votes Speaks: English*, Czech Studies: Mandarin | Message 12 of 27 24 January 2010 at 12:02am | IP Logged | ||
Well, this comes up quite a lot, and the main issue is really why you want to learn those languages. There are a few languages I work hard on to become competent. At the same time, there are plenty of languages I just dabble with. My wife and I really enjoy travelling, and now that I am retired this has given us much more free time to do so. In the past couple of years we have been to: Cambodia, Tanzania, Bhutan, Costa Rica, Tibet, Nepal, and Thailand. Before going to each of these places, we spent a couple of weeks teaching ourselves the basics of the languages - so we could have simple conversations with the locals. We learned each of those languages very "poorly" - and had no interest in pursuing them further. Was this a waste of time? I don't think so - we certainly enjoyed it - and the locals seemed to appreciate it. So, I really do have to disagree with you that it is better to learn a few languages well. Although I am doing exactly that, it is also equally beneficial(at least to me and my wife) to learn a bunch of languages you are interested in at whatever level suits you. 3 persons have voted this message useful | |||
| cordelia0507 Senior Member United Kingdom Joined 5840 days ago 1473 posts - 2176 votes Speaks: Swedish* Studies: German, Russian | Message 13 of 27 24 January 2010 at 1:04am | IP Logged | ||
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Personally I don't usually enjoy talking with people who cannot really understand me if I deviate from Berlitz/Pimsleur; who have such strange pronounciation that I can hardly hear what they are saying and who make lots of grammatical and vocabulary mistakes. It's just too frustrating!
And I don't necessarily expect anyone to have patience with me when I am the one who struggles.. Other than of course service situations when I am a potential customer. I have had some terrible language moments in several different European countries as I've tried to make myself understood and the shop assistant simply isn't interested. I'd only make an exception and chat with learners I happened to be related to, or "friends of friends" just as a courteousy. But chatting with a "learner" at a party or a club? Hardly! I don't have the patience. If Thai and Nepalese people are friendly or curious enough to chat with people on a Pimsleur skill level then I am impressed at their hospitality and courteousness. It seems much more likely that they'd be interested in an opportunity to practice English. 3 persons have voted this message useful | |||
| TixhiiDon Tetraglot Senior Member Japan Joined 5466 days ago 772 posts - 1474 votes Speaks: English*, Japanese, German, Russian Studies: Georgian | Message 14 of 27 24 January 2010 at 1:14am | IP Logged | ||
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I think you are being a little disingenuous here, Cordelia. Surely you must have been in plenty of situations on vacation when you have ordered a beer or a meal, or said "Thank you" and "Goodbye" in a shop, or said "It's nice weather today" to a taxi driver, and been met with a smile or a compliment. This is human interaction at its most basic and its most pleasant. We are not talking here about indepth discussion but routine pleasantries. If, as a guest of the country, you can make the effort to learn these simple words and phrases and put them into use, I can't see anyone other than the most curmudgeonly waiters and salespeople being displeased or annoyed.
4 persons have voted this message useful | |||
| cordelia0507 Senior Member United Kingdom Joined 5840 days ago 1473 posts - 2176 votes Speaks: Swedish* Studies: German, Russian | Message 15 of 27 24 January 2010 at 1:38am | IP Logged | ||
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If it is a one way conversation and I happen to know the word, then sure!
In Western Europe it's a fairly established convention that unless you know the local language to a good standard, you speak slow and clear English and hope for the best - usually no problems at all. I can speak a few European languages well enough to get around town, shop and order food... I judge each situation for which language seems more appropriate and I don't care which language I speak as long as it's possible to be understood. Nowadays English tends to work ok and some people really enjoy the opportunity to practice. My family lived in Japan for a while and I spent a lot of time there -step mum is japanese. Sure I used phrases there but this was because I spent quite a lot of time there. Anything else would have been very rude. I learnt it enough to get around town, be polite and answer simple questions. But I would never subject a Japanese person to my apalling Japanese for conversation and I never made a serious effort with this language since I couldn't see myself living in Japan in the future. I learnt only to be polite and not force a situation where people might feel pressured into speaking English with me against their will. Also to please my step mother. I have travelled in places like Vietnam, Indonesia, Malaysia, Korea etc for holidays and other trips lasting a week or so. It never ocurred to me to try to learn an Asian language for such a trip! Any more than I'd expect a Japanese person who went on a tour to Sweden to learn Swedish phrases. The languages are too different. Smiles and English gets you by just fine. If I was going to stay for an extended period I'd make an effort. 2 persons have voted this message useful | |||
| datsunking1 Diglot Senior Member United States Joined 5587 days ago 1014 posts - 1533 votes Speaks: English*, Spanish Studies: German, Russian, Dutch, French | Message 16 of 27 24 January 2010 at 2:18am | IP Logged | ||
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I've studied many languages just to show how open minded I am and try to receive visitors to the US with open arms and a warm welcome. I try to go against the "America is a bunch of monolingual morons" view :D
I think I have the plan of learning a couple languages to advanced fluency because I know I will use them, and the others to a level where I can call upon them and improve very quickly if needed. 5 persons have voted this message useful |
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