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Italian and French at the same time | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : Advice Center |  | |
| Enrico Diglot Senior Member Russian Federation Joined 3735 days ago 162 posts - 207 votes  Speaks: Russian*, English Studies: Italian, Spanish, French | Message 9 of 34 31 August 2014 at 12:01am | IP Logged | ||
Do you think listening to songs and reading lyrics have anything useful for language learning? How far can it get me if I will study essential grammar and only will be listening songs and translating lyrics? It is of course an interesting idea to learn Italian actively and building comprehension ability of Spanish or French at the same time. My native language is Russian. Edited by Enrico on 31 August 2014 at 12:58am 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Serpent Octoglot Senior Member Russian Federation serpent-849.livejour Joined 6587 days ago 9753 posts - 15779 votes 4 sounds Speaks: Russian*, English, FinnishC1, Latin, German, Italian, Spanish, Portuguese Studies: Danish, Romanian, Polish, Belarusian, Ukrainian, Croatian, Slovenian, Catalan, Czech, Galician, Dutch, Swedish | Message 10 of 34 31 August 2014 at 2:45am | IP Logged | ||
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YMMV, but for me songs can be the easiest bridge to native materials. And they should be enough for "adapting" to a related language, so that you can understand how the grammar works in both languages despite learning it only in one. Well, this may depend on how thoroughly you know the grammar of the languages you already speak, Russian and English.
Also, I certainly meant that you need to add other native materials when you can, or semi-native ones like Destinos, GLOSS, French in action. Join twitter and get manageable chunks of L2. Read that post about the multitrack approach ;) In general, you seem torn between the appeal of (written) French and the usefulness of Spanish. In addition to Italian, that is. I'd say that eventually you should have no problems learning all three, but for now just don't actively look for opportunities to learn Spanish? But use the ones you do have, and consider SRS'ing the bits you do know to avoid forgetting them. So if you come across something in Spanish and you feel like deciphering it - go ahead, you don't need to officially add it to your list for that :) And listen to Spanish music too. Studying/not studying doesn't have to be binary. edit: oh and have you heard of LR and various other techniques? Edited by Serpent on 31 August 2014 at 2:51am 2 persons have voted this message useful | |||
| Enrico Diglot Senior Member Russian Federation Joined 3735 days ago 162 posts - 207 votes Speaks: Russian*, English Studies: Italian, Spanish, French | Message 11 of 34 31 August 2014 at 5:35am | IP Logged | ||
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Thank you for your answer Serpent.
I've tried Anki but I used it a little and then gave up, it's boring. Yes I have read those post about Multitrack approach several times. I honestly do not understand how music can help, especially as an exclusive source of learning language, if only in common with Essential Grammar Book or fast Michel Thomas Course. And what is an advantage of learning through lyrics to the learning using Assimil? Especially in simultaneous learning. Edited by Enrico on 31 August 2014 at 5:36am 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Serpent Octoglot Senior Member Russian Federation serpent-849.livejour Joined 6587 days ago 9753 posts - 15779 votes 4 sounds Speaks: Russian*, English, FinnishC1, Latin, German, Italian, Spanish, Portuguese Studies: Danish, Romanian, Polish, Belarusian, Ukrainian, Croatian, Slovenian, Catalan, Czech, Galician, Dutch, Swedish | Message 12 of 34 31 August 2014 at 10:36am | IP Logged | ||
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Anki is as fun as you make it. Single-word cards are certainly not for everyone, and some even think they might be harmful. I basically use it as a "fave" button, to save things I *want* to see again, like fun sentences.
As for music, have a look at this article, and consider getting the book "Language is music" too (it's not only about using music for learning). Basically, music is also as useful as you make it. Those who love it and live it will get better results for sure. Also, music is a fun way to turn words into "known unknowns", words that you can reproduce but don't know the meaning of. They're easier to learn than brand new words you've never seen. And music would not be your sole resource as long as you go through a course for a related language. Up to a certain point you'll understand roughly as much Spanish as Italian, regardless of which one you actually study. (this can be frustrating actually) And let me reiterate that I'm proposing a multi-track approach, where music is one of the easiest tools you can use when your brain still melts easily from L2 otherwise. One more tool is Ilya Frank's method. I love it. But unless you read with the accompanying audiobook, you need to learn the pronunciation first, and this is where music can help too. Your profile says you're still learning English. Consider using books like Spanish vocabulary: an etymological approach or You already know Italian to find out about the similarities between these languages and English, and learn some advanced English vocab. I like the Spanish book more, but I'm picky :) I guess I should say more explicitly that given your longer-term goals, it really doesn't matter much how exactly you divide your time between 2-3 Romance languages. Fool around as much as you want, shift your focus and have fun. Take advantage of the synergy. 3 persons have voted this message useful | |||
| tarvos Super Polyglot Winner TAC 2012 Senior Member China likeapolyglot.wordpr Joined 4697 days ago 5310 posts - 9399 votes Speaks: Dutch*, English, Swedish, French, Russian, German, Italian, Norwegian, Mandarin, Romanian, Afrikaans Studies: Greek, Modern Hebrew, Spanish, Portuguese, Czech, Korean, Esperanto, Finnish | Message 13 of 34 31 August 2014 at 12:54pm | IP Logged | ||
You can do two, but that means you need to have some serious time management skills. You can, I've done it before. Eventually I always end up focusing on one over the other though. I usually recommend 3 or 4 months, but 6 is also fine, as long as it's a long enough time which is enough to make good strides forward. The criterion is not that you have reached a certain level when you stop, you just stop when you've made significant progress that you can maintain at a certain level. 2 persons have voted this message useful | |||
| Serpent Octoglot Senior Member Russian Federation serpent-849.livejour Joined 6587 days ago 9753 posts - 15779 votes 4 sounds Speaks: Russian*, English, FinnishC1, Latin, German, Italian, Spanish, Portuguese Studies: Danish, Romanian, Polish, Belarusian, Ukrainian, Croatian, Slovenian, Catalan, Czech, Galician, Dutch, Swedish | Message 14 of 34 31 August 2014 at 2:05pm | IP Logged | ||
Avoiding boredom. I recommend you to start an Assimil course in your "main" language and do one lesson per day for two weeks, which would be two cycles of 6 audio-based lessons+1 book-based revision lesson. Then see whether you want to start one more Assimil course, and if so, how much time you can devote to it. Be realistic - if you know that more than, say, 4+2 lessons per week will be boring (4 Italian, 2 French, for example), don't force yourself to do more. Instead, use the multitrack approach to spend more time with the language and continue enjoying it. Your limit is not the free time you have but the time you can actually devote to a new language, and this one can be increased by introducing different activities, including music. Also, compared to going from Russian to English, I think you'll find the Romance languages surprisingly easy. This doesn't mean you can learn them effortlessly, but the words should be easier to remember, and the grammar is more similar to what you're used to in Russian. Edited by Serpent on 31 August 2014 at 2:06pm 2 persons have voted this message useful | |||
| iguanamon Pentaglot Senior Member Virgin Islands Speaks: Ladino Joined 5252 days ago 2241 posts - 6731 votes Speaks: English*, Spanish, Portuguese, Haitian Creole, Creole (French) | Message 15 of 34 31 August 2014 at 3:44pm | IP Logged | ||
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Enrico, at first your profile said you were in Italy. Now it says you are in the Virgin Islands, like me. Is that true? This place is very small, which island are you on?
1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Enrico Diglot Senior Member Russian Federation Joined 3735 days ago 162 posts - 207 votes Speaks: Russian*, English Studies: Italian, Spanish, French | Message 16 of 34 31 August 2014 at 5:34pm | IP Logged | ||
By the way, if you like Frank's method, there is the official application with soundtrack for iPhone at least, maybe they even have one for Android phones. I like their books for English and Italian where they made parallel books with anecdotes and jokes. Thank you for your detailed explanations and links I will check them out. 1 person has voted this message useful |
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