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I’m riding my bike around France in May | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : Language Learning Log |  | |
| Brun Ugle Diglot Senior Member Norway brunugle.wordpress.c Joined 6613 days ago 1292 posts - 1766 votes  Speaks: English*, NorwegianC1 Studies: Japanese, Esperanto, Spanish, Finnish | Message 9 of 32 16 January 2013 at 7:16am | IP Logged | |||||
With a giant chasm between 2 and 3. I seem to have fallen into the chasm for Japanese, but I'm starting to climb up the other side.
Why are you in Japan? Were you transferred there for work or something? I just ask because it sounds like the moving isn't your own decision. 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| Travis.H Triglot Groupie United States Joined 4449 days ago 59 posts - 91 votes Speaks: English*, Japanese, Sign Language Studies: French | Message 10 of 32 07 February 2013 at 7:00am | IP Logged | |||||
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@Brune Ugle:
Yeah it is a large gap between 2-3. I find that going from intermediate to advanced to sort of feel like that sudden switch from having huge holes in understanding and to evening out across the board. I put in a request to leave a few months earlier than my contract says months ago and found out right before Christmas that it would be alright to do so. --------------------------------- Even though things have been very busy here as I finish up in Japan, I’ve still managed to find time to really enjoy French. I’ve been continuing my daily march to and from the train in the morning and evening, shouting French both ways. I’ve noticed that my route has changed due to the increase in speed (walking swiftly) and because I don’t want to appear completely insane (speaking in a loud voice). The result has been a nice break from my routine walk to and from work. I’m currently at lesson 44 in the Assimil book and I’m plugging away. While I can’t get through a new lesson every day, I do look at previously studied lessons while looking ahead. Even though I’m at lesson 44 I still notice the benefits of blind shadowing unknown material. It helps me focus more on pronunciation and intonation instead of the meaning. There really is a benefit to repeating things and focusing on pronunciation, speed and rhythm before knowing what it is you’re saying. Things have a way of sticking in your head, creating hooks, and then when you do run into the meaning of a word or phrase it rewards you with an “ah-ha!” moment. Well, some of the time anyway. Friends who told me I was crazy to start with Assimil from no French at all have been surprised at my rapid improvement. To be fair, it’s not hard to improve when you start from nothing. My pronunciation is improving and I’m able to catch faster and faster French, even though I can’t really create original sentences yet. Compared to learning Japanese, I feel like I’m cheating with French. Don’t get me wrong, French is hard and I am in no way saying it’s a walk in the park. Speaking fluid, idiomatically correct French is most certainly an art that people could, and do spend their whole lives mastering. Japanese is the same way but it feels like it comes at it from two very completely different angles. The biggest difference I notice between French and Japanese is they feel like they use a completely different part of my brain. French sits somewhere near English while Japanese is off in some remote corner of my mind. Reading French news feels similar to English, and has a sense of being easier even though I comprehend way more and can read faster in Japanese than French. I finished a book on French culture called, French or Foe written by an American who lived in Paris for over 20 years. The book was amazing and as I read it I thought several times how similar some of my personality traits are to the French ones described in the book. Things that annoy many Americans such as showing up a little late to a meeting, or only smiling when you actually mean it instead of all the time really resonated with me. I also noticed similarities to Japanese culture; the main ones being a clearly defined hierarchy system and how important saving face is. Anyone who is French or has a good knowledge of French culture, please feel free to correct me. I would be very curious to hear your opinions on French culture. I’m particularly interested in what family life is like and how it differs to American culture. What stories do all French children know by heart? What poetry or poet does every French person know? I watched the diary of Ann Frank yesterday dubbed into French. I found a ton of whole movies that are dubbed into French that are on youtube. I’ll put some links up on the second page of this log if anyone is interested. Edited by Travis.H on 07 February 2013 at 7:06am 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| Brun Ugle Diglot Senior Member Norway brunugle.wordpress.c Joined 6613 days ago 1292 posts - 1766 votes Speaks: English*, NorwegianC1 Studies: Japanese, Esperanto, Spanish, Finnish | Message 11 of 32 07 February 2013 at 8:14am | IP Logged | |||||
That's one of the nice things about being a foreigner. Everyone expects them to be a little weird, so you can do all kinds of crazy things, and if someone asks, you just say, "Oh. That's the custom in my country. Everyone does it that way."
More of a walk to work I suppose... 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| Travis.H Triglot Groupie United States Joined 4449 days ago 59 posts - 91 votes Speaks: English*, Japanese, Sign Language Studies: French | Message 12 of 32 22 February 2013 at 3:05am | IP Logged | |||||
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Today I hit lesson 50 in Assimil and have started the productive stage. The first
lesson was quite easy and I feel like I'm reaching the point of study where the language just starts coming out. The other day one of my American friends ran into a French guy sitting in McDonalds and gave him my contact information. I was a little surprised to get an email in English and French from someone I didn't know, asking if I would be interested in getting a cafe. My friend called me later that day and told me that she told the guy I was interested in French and France and that he should contact me. So he did, and I told him that we should get together for a cafe sometime. Apparently he's from somewhere near Lyon which is a place I really want to go to. I've already started thinking of a million questions I want to ask. I know this sounds really weird, and maybe I've been in Japan too long, but I feel like I'm meeting a celebrity or something. My initial reaction when I found out was, "Wow, someone from France!? A native speaker!?". ...I really have been in Japan too long :S I watched a French movie with my Japanese friend called Rust and Bone. According to my friend the film was "Too much sexy". The film was fantastic and very moving even if it was a little too much sexy at times. I learned a lot about how words are mushed together in French. Which I love. After plowing through clearly articulated Assimil French, it was nice to know that people really do add their own flavor to the language. I noticed how guys say "oui" differently than girls, and how saying something like "Je ne sais pas" can be smushed into something like "Je sais pa-" with a hint of ne in there. I picked out a few other phrases from the movie and added them to my anki deck. I've also started reading the news in French at work when I have a little down time. I only get maybe 40% of the specific words in there, but it's enough to get the meaning and enjoy doing it so I find it beneficial. I LOVE how I can see words that I haven't learned yet but can guess the meaning. I remember getting that feeling in Japanese after I learned Kanji and really started reading things. In relation to Japanese, the school I worked at when I first came to Japan contacted me last week and asked me if I would be willing to give a 30 minute speech at "International day" this week. They said I could talk about whatever I wanted to so I chose to talk about the countries I've lived in and culture shock. I've done shorter presentations before in Japanese, 5-10 minutes mostly with small audiences (co- workers). This was the first time that I prepared a long speech completely in Japanese and presented completely in Japanese to speakers who don't know any English. I spent awhile the night before revising my outline, typing out explanations I wanted to give and brainstorming possible questions I might be asked. My preparation paid off and the speech went very well. People laughed at my jokes, were surprised as intended and asked very interesting questions at the end. After I finished, several teachers and students came up to me after and told me how interesting it was and asked me even more questions. I listened to the recording later and found some grammatical mistakes and one or two places where I tripped over my tongue and had to correct myself. But overall I felt very pleased with my accomplishments in Japanese and look forward to learning more. 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| Brun Ugle Diglot Senior Member Norway brunugle.wordpress.c Joined 6613 days ago 1292 posts - 1766 votes Speaks: English*, NorwegianC1 Studies: Japanese, Esperanto, Spanish, Finnish | Message 13 of 32 26 February 2013 at 11:32am | IP Logged | |||||
I can definitely understand that reaction. I'd feel the same way if I met a Japanese here.
To me, that sounds like an amazing accomplishment. I can't even imagine being good enough in Japanese to do that. I'm not much at public speaking either... 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| Travis.H Triglot Groupie United States Joined 4449 days ago 59 posts - 91 votes Speaks: English*, Japanese, Sign Language Studies: French | Message 14 of 32 05 March 2013 at 7:33am | IP Logged | |||||
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I discoveredTID=31338"> Emk's log about a month ago, read through the whole thing and was very
inspired.I'm really impressed with his dedication and organizational skills. I also found a lot of useful suggestions for French learning material which I've only begun to explore. In one of his early posts I picked up a rap artist named Mc Solaar who has changed my life. I bought his three latest albums off of Amazon and have been listening to them almost non-stop for about two weeks now. Today I had some downtime at work and decided to try and break one of his songs down so I could try shadowing it. My favorite song, titled RMI, didn't have any good English translations that I could find. So I wrote up my own translation using these two websites: Thing 1 Thing 2 The translation doesn't follow a specific pattern (i.e., literal / free etc) but is translated in a way that made sense to me. I also added interesting notes to help me better understand different references made throughout the song. The song is genius and even though I've researched it, I feel like I've only scratched the surface in terms the complexity of the lyrics, rhyme scheme and references. All of the notes about what certain words are referring to I took from the first website I listed. The song is sung by a deeper voiced version of Mc Solaar, and the normal, yet frustrated, voice of Mc Solaar. It creates an interesting dynamic by establishing a sort of inner dialogue about the theme of the song, money. I bolded one voice for ease of reading. If you have any corrections or suggestions leave me a comment and I’ll add it. RMI Que se passe-t-il ? What's up? Rien c'est personnel ! Nothing! It's personal! Une douleur éternelle que je ne partageais qu'avec le ciel (It's) eternal pain that I shared with the sky Le monstre aux yeux verts, synonyme de la jalousie The green eyed monster, a synonym of jealousy. Taxe l'eau du Sahel juste pour remplir son Jacuzzi takes taxes on Sahel's water just to fill his Jacuzzi Mais c'est comme ça que ça fonctionne... But that's (just) how things work (function) ...dans ce monde de taches ?? In this world of sports? Les gens les plus lâches jettent la pierre et ensuite ils se cachent The most cowardly people throw stones and then they hide C'est comme ordonné. Coordonné. Dieu ordonne de pardoner It is as ordered. Coordinated. God commands forgiveness. J'ai pardonné. Donné de l'amour que l'on ne m'a pas r'donné I have forgiven. I've given love that was never returned. (pun: pas r'donne sounds like pardonne, means you can hear two words at the same time "never returned" and "forgiven" ) Mais pourquoi ? But why? Pourquoi ? Parce que c'est la faute au biz ! Why? Because it's the businesses' fault! Aux biftons, fiston. Ton vice est devenu dicton For banknotes, son. (That's what) your flaws are saying. (biftons = banknotes, fiston = a nick name you'd use with a male younger than you) Ce millénaire est monétaire This millennium is (about) money Le peuple est impopulaire People are unpopular A croire que le Veau d'Or a une promo à l'échelle planétaire To believe that the Golden Calf was promoted on a global scale (The golden calf is a biblical reference to Moses and the creation of a golden calf used as an idol) Il justifie la traîtrise He justifies the betrayal La fourberie Deceit L'économie c'est toujours plus de loups dans la bergerie The economy is all wolves in sheep's clothing Est-ce les salauds qu'on adule ? Are (these) the bastards (we) adore? Des gosses des adultes The kids, the adults S'inculquent le nouveau culte et sur le globe le catapultent are teaching themselves a new cult, and spreading (it) around the globe [Refrain - Choeurs africains] [Couplet 2] Et même les leaders marginaux font vendre des casquettes And even marginal leaders are selling caps (casquettes are caps that cyclists use to wear – not as popular now that helmets are worn) Des baskets Sneakers Une religion de supermarket A supermarket religion Mes neurones se bousculent. Speedés tels des spermatos puis toncar My neurons are scrambled. Speed like sperm(?)then crash (toncar is verlan (slang), and therefore has to be read as carton, a carton is a hit, or a car accident ) Et dans la monospace c'était Ayrton Solaar and Arton Solaar was in the minivan (monospace, is the famous family van, Ayrton Sena is the famous Formula 1 driver ) Dans les bas-fonds on rêve des fonds du FMI (Fond monetaire international : International Monetary Fun ) In the slums people dream of IMF (International Monetary Funds) Mais au fond on sait qu'les familles sont souvent proches du RMI But deep down we know (those) families live (close to) on welfare (RMI, revenu minimum d'insertion, a form of social welfare) Les gosses pour des Pokémon taxent dans les portefeuilles The kids are taxing wallets for Pokemon L'époque est morne. Satan monte en bourse je vois pointer ses cornes Times are bleak. Satan is rising in the stocks, I can see his horns Mais vous parliez de millions... But you were talking about millions… De Saint-Emilion From St. Emilion (saint emilion, famous French champagne ) Mais comme on est des milliers combien seront humiliés But as we are, millions are going to be humiliated L'histoire de l'art a comme la couleur du dollar The history of art is tainted by the color of dollars Et comme dit Rico "Y a pas que des gens bons à la tête de l'Art." And like Rico said, “It’s not only good people at the head of Art”. (tete de l'art is a pun, with tete de lard : pigs head) Sinon quoi d'neuf ? So, what's new? Rien d'neuf. Rien qu'du bluff. J'suis veuf Nothing's new. Nothing (but) hot air. I'm widowed. Avec les meufs peut-être qu'il faut se la jouer rough and tough With these chicks, we might need to play rough and tough Donner des kiss et rester peace tel Jésus le Christ Give the kiss of peace and be like Jesus Christ (I think he's referring to Judas kissing Jesus in the garden, betraying him before his death.) Ou dégainer le kriss et l'6.6.6. nous glisse aux abysses Or draw the kriss and 666 while we slide (into) the abyss. Et la musique ? And the music? Moi j'l'aime ! Ils veulent l'emprisonner ! I like it! They want to imprison it! Imagine Cupidon lançant des flèches qui sont empoisonnées Imagine Cupid shooting poison arrows C'est un espace de liberté... It is a space of freedom… ...qu'on place dans un coin ! …relocated to a corner! Des clous. Des clones de Claude, des clowns, des clans de nains de jardin The nails. The clones of Claude, the clowns, the clans of garden gnomes (Claude François. Pas nécessairement une référence de la qualité musicale française. Pourtant la variété française d'aujourd'hui ne semble être faite que d'imitateurs de cette crécelle humaine. Claude M'Barali (MC Solaar), auquel cas Solaar décrie, comme on le fait souvent dans le rap, le fait que d'autres atteignent le succès en pompant le style de soi-même.) Voilà pourquoi je me place toujours face à Ponce Pilate That’s why I always put myself in front of Pontius Pilate Ricoche sur le beat comme sur de l'eau peut le faire la pierre plate Riccoche off the beat like a flat stone on the water Lance sourates et psaumes. Sur l'étendard du gnome Start (a) sura and (a) psalm on a gnome flag Sans chrome. Avec au cœur du baume Without chrome. With heart balm Boom dans leur home Boom in their homes Dans les bas-fonds on rêve des fonds du FMI In the slums people dream of IMF (International Monetary Funds) Mais au fond on sait qu'les familles sont souvent proches du RMI But deep down we know (those) families live (close to) on welfare Dans les bas-fonds on rêve des fonds du FMI Mais au fond on sait qu'les familles sont souvent proches du RMI [Refrain - Choeurs africains] [Outro - Murmure] Dans les bas-fonds on rêve des fonds du FMI Mais au fond on sait qu'les familles sont souvent proches du RMI Dans les bas-fonds on rêve des fonds du FMI Mais au fond on sait qu'les familles sont souvent proches du RMI Edited by Travis.H on 05 March 2013 at 3:14pm 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| Travis.H Triglot Groupie United States Joined 4449 days ago 59 posts - 91 votes Speaks: English*, Japanese, Sign Language Studies: French | Message 15 of 32 19 March 2013 at 6:24am | IP Logged | |||||
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Things have been crazy busy and are only going to get busier over the last few weeks.
I've been finishing up here in Japan, packing and getting ready to go home. I have still found time to keep up my Assimil which has been good. It's annoying to pump it out sometimes when I'm really busy, but I always feel good after I finish and think about what I learned. I'm on lesson 8 or 9 of the active phase. I have plans of uploading audio links of me speaking in French as a sort of check mark. What I've been doing in addition to what Assimil recommends for the active phase (translate from English into French) is I've been listening to the active phase and writing in my own pronunciation notes, then recording myself reading the conversation. I record once, listen to the audio once, and then record myself again trying to fix any errors I made the first time. I'm eager to plug it into here and get some feedback from some French speakers. Some of the techniques I've been applying with French I've found to be helpful in my study of Japanese. I tried doing reading some newspaper articles from www.fnn-news.com , trying to imitate the newscaster. I also tried doing a reverse translation from a Japanese article like how Assimil does in the "second phase". I picked an article I liked from http://wired.jp/ because they generally translate the Japanese from the English. I found however that when I looked at the English and translated into Japanese the vast amounts of idioms and jokes in the English article made my translation into Japanese very different and not nearly as good as the one they put up. Regardless I'm learning a lot about when to try and find a similar idiom in a language and when to just translate the meaning. Sometimes when I'm studying French I feel guilty about not studying Japanese instead. I've been really starting to consider what it means to create a Khatsumoto immersion environment with two or more languages. I know he does it with Cantonese, Mandarin and Japanese but I haven't quite figured out how exactly it'll work for me yet. I do know that English stuff will take a hit which I'm fine with. I'm looking forward to getting to a place in French where I can use more native materials to learn with. Khatsumoto Edited by Travis.H on 19 March 2013 at 6:26am 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| Travis.H Triglot Groupie United States Joined 4449 days ago 59 posts - 91 votes Speaks: English*, Japanese, Sign Language Studies: French | Message 16 of 32 28 April 2013 at 7:46am | IP Logged | |||||
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I'm still here! I'm still doing some French every day. I'm on lesson 74 in Assimil and
I've been listening to a lot of Mc Solaar. I'm particularly hooked on his Mach 6 album. I got to talk to a girl who came back from a year-long study in Paris. I couldn't say much but I was pleased in that I could understand everything she said to me. More later. I've moving again in a few days for a new job. It should be a little easier to get a routine going once I get working again. 1 person has voted this message useful |
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