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Assimil versus US language programs | ||
Tags: Learner type | Platiquemos | Pimsleur | Reading | Language Program | FSI | Assimil | Accent | Book | Grammar | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : Language Programs, Books & Tapes |  | |
| tuffy Triglot Senior Member Netherlands Joined 7037 days ago 1394 posts - 1412 votes  Speaks: Dutch*, English, German Studies: Spanish | Message 161 of 184 23 February 2006 at 5:09am | IP Logged | |||||
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That's worth more than 2 cents Andy! :)
Great to know they teach the same. I knew about the style differences but I was worried that if I would pick Assimil I would learn less than with Platiquemos but now I know that's not the case. They both get me at the same level of Spanish. (I only need to buy that other Assimil course too then.) Cool, so I can simply choose what I like most, what I find easier for me. And no matter which one I take, in 1 year from now I can finaly have meaningful(!) conversations with my girlfriend. I like what you say about 10 lessons Assimil versus 90 Pimsleur lessons. I also feel Pimsleur takes up a LOT of time but my progress isn't fantastic. Of course I also write my own transscripts which takes up extra time but still, in the end I got rather frustrated: 90 lessons and I still don't understand Spanish TV! Maybe Assimil is better for me. The first lesson taught me something new without much effort. On the other hand, I also learned some words from Platiquemos just by listening twice :) Maybe my expectations are too high but maybe I can surprise my girlfriend with much more rapid results from now on. Maybe in 1 month I can learn a lot more than I did thus far. Edited by tuffy on 23 February 2006 at 5:13am 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| frenkeld Diglot Senior Member United States Joined 6946 days ago 2042 posts - 2719 votes Speaks: Russian*, English Studies: German | Message 162 of 184 23 February 2006 at 6:58am | IP Logged | |||||
Andy, do you have a sense of how much vocabulary is covered in each of the two parts of Assimil Spanish? What about grammar, say verb tenses? 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| Andy E Triglot Senior Member United Kingdom Joined 7106 days ago 1651 posts - 1939 votes Speaks: English*, Spanish, French | Message 163 of 184 23 February 2006 at 7:30am | IP Logged | |||||
David, Regarding the amount of vocab, that's a difficult question for me to answer - I just have the sense that we're talking thousands as opposed to hundreds. One of the things I like about Assimil Spanish (I can't comment on other languages at the moment) is that there is very little of the "Here's my passport" and "Can I have the bill please?" Having completed the first wave of the first course, I've noticed a definite "rounding-out" of my ability to read Spanish without having to guess numbers of items from context (or indeed look them up as I try to avoid doing that). In fact, I estimate that before too long my Spanish reading ability will match my French and although that statement is meanlingless to you :¬), it will be a massive step-up. In terms of grammar and verb tenses, it's all there. Grammatical points are touched on as notes in the lessons and sometimes the lessons contain more detailed explanations. Every 7th lesson (Revisión y notas in "With Ease" and Repaso y especificaciones in "Using Spanish"), these areas are revised and examined in more detail and there are verb tables at the back of both books. Platiquemos, on the other hand, presents a pattern, drills a pattern and then discusses and explains a pattern - I've got no problem with either method, I simply mention this to contrast the approach. If there's one area where I, personally, would have to "step outside" the course as a beginner to address something, it would be verb forms - I have to stress here that this is solely a matter of my own personal learning style. I had to "drill" Spanish verb forms in the past through flash cards and I've discovered that my "knowledge" of stem changes is weaker than I'd hoped (i.e. I've forgotten a lot). I shall, therefore, go through the Platiquemos drills in these areas - there's after all no point in creating my own drills when someone has already done it and I've paid good money to purchase such. EDIT: Meant to add that I'm pretty sure that fanatic and John Farley came up with some figures for Assimil vocab on another thread along the lines of "number of new words per lesson" which would allow you to extrapolate total for a course. Andy. Edited by Andy E on 23 February 2006 at 7:34am 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| frenkeld Diglot Senior Member United States Joined 6946 days ago 2042 posts - 2719 votes Speaks: Russian*, English Studies: German | Message 164 of 184 23 February 2006 at 7:43am | IP Logged | |||||
Vocabulary can only be easy to judge if they have a dictionary at the end of the book which matches more or less what has been actually used in the lessons. In such cases, I do a word count on one dictionary page and mulitply by the number of pages. (I also do it with dictionaries these days, as publishers no longer like to give the number of head entires in each half, but talk about the number of definitions and the like instead, often adding up those from both parts of the dictionary for greater clarity to the buyer.) Regarding grammar, I was just curious which tenses are not yet covered by the end of part I, and if there are any such left by the end of part II. This is more to gauge what to expect for languages for which Assimil does not offer the 2nd part, or offers it in a base language I can't read. Edited by frenkeld on 23 February 2006 at 11:26am 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| frenkeld Diglot Senior Member United States Joined 6946 days ago 2042 posts - 2719 votes Speaks: Russian*, English Studies: German | Message 165 of 184 23 February 2006 at 7:50am | IP Logged | |||||
Stuff like this may be easiest to nail down by reading and writing, and those who like drills for memorization can use a workbook that offers written verb drills - there is a number of them on the market. I guess I am a bit of a skeptic when it comes to using audiocourses alone for learning a language. (I am not talking about reading authentic newspappers, but rather about the learning materials.) Edited by frenkeld on 23 February 2006 at 7:55am 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| Andy E Triglot Senior Member United Kingdom Joined 7106 days ago 1651 posts - 1939 votes Speaks: English*, Spanish, French | Message 166 of 184 23 February 2006 at 8:08am | IP Logged | |||||
My copy of Le Nouvel Espagnol sans Peine only has a very simplistic grammatical index. However, if memory serves, the French with Ease book has a "dictionary" at the back with the lesson number that the item was introduced in.
Now you've got me! Not being a beginner, I've not worried too much about some of the explanations - I've simply noted their presence. Having said that, I "believe" that certain compound tenses like, for example, the future perfect and conditional perfect are not covered in the beginner's course - that's not to say there aren't any examples in the text (someone can correct me if I am wrong about that). In addition, not all areas of tense agreement between clauses are discussed. For example, both forms of the imperfect subjunctive are presented but I cannot recall a discussion on when the tense should be used. Since I haven't completed the advanced course, this is pure supposition but I would be very surprised if the "missing" items were not covered by the end. It's worth remembering, however, that the courses may not be alike in terms of what's presented when - there may have been a deliberate decision to space the structure out where it's being presented over a beginner's and advanced course. That, of course, is of no help if you can't read the base language of the advanced course. Andy. 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| Farley Triglot Senior Member United States Joined 7095 days ago 681 posts - 739 votes 1 sounds Speaks: English*, GermanB1, French Studies: Spanish | Message 167 of 184 23 February 2006 at 10:38am | IP Logged | |||||
David, New French with Ease, has a two way dictionary, and from what I remember contains about 2200+ words; it averages about 25 words per lesson. It covers the basic verb tenses (present, passé composé, imperfect, future, present conditional and present subjunctive). That is similar to German with Ease. Using French covers the advanced and literary verb tenses, and I estimate about 4000-5000 words. If you like using work books then Assimil is an excellent course. Assimil introduces everything in context and once you have the sound in your head and the workbooks are much more meaningful.
It is the same with Assimil French or German, but Assimil slips those phrases into your active vocabulary almost unnoticed. I mentioned this in the link posted above, Assimil’s strength is vocabulary, and FSI’s is basic patterns such as verb conjugations. There is really no competition; they both will get the job done. Assimil will teach you what to say, and FSI will teach you how to say it. Just note that Assimil is a distilled immersion method. I tend to like the Assimil method better, but having said that I think there is value in giving “the drills” a once over to compliment the method, short of moving to the target country to practice the language. Taking my lessons learned from German and French, I think the ultimate way to cheat at language learning, short of total immersion, is to use both by their strengths. Passive wave: Listen to the Assimil dialogs and exercises Listen and repeat the FSI dialog drills Active wave: Listen, repeat and recreate the Assimil dialogs and exercises Cover the FSI dialogs once or twice, drilling only those hard to get items John Edited by Farley on 23 February 2006 at 10:43am 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| frenkeld Diglot Senior Member United States Joined 6946 days ago 2042 posts - 2719 votes Speaks: Russian*, English Studies: German | Message 168 of 184 23 February 2006 at 11:23am | IP Logged | |||||
Wow, even if 4000-5000 words are from both parts, and not in addition to the first one, this is still very impressive. P.S. As an aside, Assimil, I recall, started out in 1929. Were they just books then, or did they come with records from the very beginning? Being of book-only origin, if it were the case, might explain some of the strengths of the method. 1 person has voted this message useful |
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