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Modern vs. classical Greek | ||
Tags: Dead Languages | Greek | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : Specific Languages |  | |
| JW Hexaglot Senior Member United States youtube.com/user/egw Joined 6121 days ago 1802 posts - 2011 votes  22 sounds Speaks: English*, German, Spanish, Ancient Greek, French, Biblical Hebrew Studies: Luxembourgish, Dutch, Greek, Italian | Message 49 of 65 06 October 2009 at 4:48pm | IP Logged | |||||
Very nice work. You certainly know your Ancient Greek. This is from Psalm 94:3-6 in the Septuagint (the translation of the Hebrew scriptures into Greek in the 4th century BC). Here how the New American Standard Bible translates it from the original Hebrew: For the LORD is a great God And a great King above all gods, In whose hand are the depths of the earth, The peaks of the mountains are His also. The sea is His, for it was He who made it, And His hands formed the dry land. Come, let us worship and bow down, Let us kneel before the LORD our Maker. The only substantive difference between your translation and this one is that ἐπὶ πᾶσαν τὴν γῆν is translated "above all gods". It seems to me that your translation is the correct one as γῆ means: world, land, ground, country, earth. For some reason the Septuagint translators chose to translate "'elohiym" in the original Hebrew as γῆν. It seems to me they should have translated it θεούς... Edited by JW on 07 October 2009 at 2:06pm 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| JW Hexaglot Senior Member United States youtube.com/user/egw Joined 6121 days ago 1802 posts - 2011 votes 22 sounds Speaks: English*, German, Spanish, Ancient Greek, French, Biblical Hebrew Studies: Luxembourgish, Dutch, Greek, Italian | Message 50 of 65 07 October 2009 at 2:06pm | IP Logged | |||||
Actually, in the very next Psalm (95:4) they translated: ὅτι μέγας Κύριος καὶ αἰνετὸς σφόδρα, φοβερός ἐστιν ὑπὲρ πάντας τοὺς θεούς· For great is the LORD and greatly to be praised; He is to be feared above all gods. Gods being again 'elohiym in the original Hebrew. Thus they appear to be saying that ἐπὶ πᾶσαν τὴν γῆν and ὑπὲρ πάντας τοὺς θεούς are equivalent... Edited by JW on 07 October 2009 at 2:13pm 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| psychicist Bilingual Octoglot Newbie Netherlands Joined 5567 days ago 9 posts - 9 votes Speaks: Dutch*, Hindi*, French, English, German, Spanish, Latin, Ancient Greek Studies: Greek, Persian, Sanskrit | Message 51 of 65 07 October 2009 at 2:50pm | IP Logged | |||||
This is what confused me so I tried to make sense of it, but the context you have provided makes things clearer to me. It looks like the translation in the New American Standard Bible is correct after all. Edited by psychicist on 07 October 2009 at 3:56pm 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| ggg Newbie United States Joined 5523 days ago 8 posts - 18 votes | Message 52 of 65 11 October 2009 at 12:30am | IP Logged | |||||
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The big problem in comparing Ancient and Modern Greek is the existence of Katharevousa, which was an attempt to introduce a sort of modernised version of Ancient Greek as the official language of the Greek state after the war of independence in the early 19th century. Although books, newspapers and official reports were written in this, even Greek schoolchildren had to learn how to use it as it was very different to the language they used at home. Katharevousa was in widespread use for official purposes right up to the early 1980's, and even today some ultra-conservative circles try to keep it going.
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| Theodisce Octoglot Senior Member Poland Joined 5885 days ago 127 posts - 167 votes Speaks: Polish*, Latin, Ancient Greek, Russian, Czech, French, English, German Studies: Italian, Spanish, Slovak, Ukrainian, Serbo-Croatian, Greek, Portuguese | Message 53 of 65 29 November 2009 at 11:00am | IP Logged | |||||
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Well, if I could add something to this very interesting discussion, I would recommend learning ancient Greek first.
I personally have very little experience with the modern language, but now, after somehow a year of study I see I'm making progress in ancient Greek. The main difficulty as in every dead language is vocabulary, but the more you read the more you can get from the context. I believe Homer isn't very hard, his syntax is very simple and his vocabulary homogeneous. There is a course in Greek based on Iliad and I believe it's the best thing to begin. The author's name's Clyde Pharr and you can download it at http://www.textkit.com/ . I thing learning Homeric dialect before Attic is better than what they usually offer at universities, that is Attic. But don't allow them to confuse you- there is no substantial difference between Homeric and Attic or even Koine Greek. You can learn NT after Homer or Homer after Plato, it's the same language. Homer is a spring from which all Greek literature flows and he is to Greeks what Bible is to the Western World. 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| Captain Haddock Diglot Senior Member Japan kanjicabinet.tumblr. Joined 6767 days ago 2282 posts - 2814 votes Speaks: English*, Japanese Studies: French, Korean, Ancient Greek | Message 54 of 65 29 November 2009 at 11:33am | IP Logged | |||||
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After finding some of the free books on Textkit unbearably dry, I tried out Athenaze, which seems to take a nice
piecemeal approach, letting you get used to grammar in small steps and actually read stories (albeit contrived ones) from the get-go. I am still quite daunted by all those verb and noun conjugations, though. It makes French look like a walk in the park. 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| Theodisce Octoglot Senior Member Poland Joined 5885 days ago 127 posts - 167 votes Speaks: Polish*, Latin, Ancient Greek, Russian, Czech, French, English, German Studies: Italian, Spanish, Slovak, Ukrainian, Serbo-Croatian, Greek, Portuguese | Message 55 of 65 29 November 2009 at 11:57am | IP Logged | |||||
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Verbal system is indeed a hard one. I wasn't able to learn the principles on my own, without a teacher. Now I'm reading New Testament to see how vocabulary actually works and I'm trying to follow Xenophon's "Anabasis", which I find more difficult.
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| JW Hexaglot Senior Member United States youtube.com/user/egw Joined 6121 days ago 1802 posts - 2011 votes 22 sounds Speaks: English*, German, Spanish, Ancient Greek, French, Biblical Hebrew Studies: Luxembourgish, Dutch, Greek, Italian | Message 56 of 65 29 November 2009 at 1:39pm | IP Logged | |||||
Have you used an interlinear system like the one in the link below? I find this fantastic for reading the New Testament. It allows you to read it, knowing the grammar principles and vocabulary, but not necessarily having memorized them. That was one thing I realized immediately with Ancient Greek--the sheer volume of verb tenses, voices, moods, noun declensions and other grammar rules (genitive absolute, dative of means, etc.) would make it impossible to memorize them--and not only the volume, but there are so many irregularities. I think the more prudent approach is to get a solid understanding of them through dedicated study (in my case, I also needed a teacher--one-on-one study with my Pastor) and then start to memorize them passively through reading. The interlinear system allows you to immediately access any information about each word with a click of the mouse: http://interlinearbible.org/john/1.htm 1 person has voted this message useful |
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