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Is Chinese going to be the lingua franca? | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : General discussion |  | |
| beano Diglot Senior Member United KingdomRegistered users can see my Skype Name Joined 4623 days ago 1049 posts - 2152 votes  Speaks: English*, German Studies: Russian, Serbian, Hungarian | Message 241 of 249 16 May 2013 at 12:05am | IP Logged | |||||
Yes, we live in the globalised internet age and even now there are plenty places in Europe where English won't get you very far. A classic mistake that people make when assessing the linguistic abilities of a nation (English or otherwise) is to focus only on the "educated" classes or those involved in international trade and tourism. But these people do not form the majority of a population. 2 persons have voted this message useful | ||||||
| shk00design Triglot Senior Member Canada Joined 4445 days ago 747 posts - 1123 votes Speaks: Cantonese*, English, Mandarin Studies: French | Message 242 of 249 16 May 2013 at 5:03pm | IP Logged | |||||
A good example of a place where both English and Mandarin is widely in use is in Hong Kong. Since the former British colony reverted to Chinese rule, there were many attempts for the Beijing government to bring HK closer to the motherland. The place has adopted a distinct status within the PRC. For more than 10 years have resisted any use of "Simplified" Chinese characters in public places including street signs, shops and restaurants. Although parents do enroll their children in Mandarin classes, these classes are being taught as "Mandarin as a second language". The rest of the curriculum is still entirely in Cantonese (the local dialect). Again there is a choice between English and Mandarin in school. Some parents would choose 1 over the other while others would choose both. On the street level there are Mainland Chinese and foreign visitors coming and going. A lot of Chinese shopkeepers and taxi drivers would try very hard to make themselves understood but only some are at at a fluent conversation level in either English or Mandarin. The level of English improved a lot since the 1980s because many HK residents lived abroad in the US or Canada for a few years to obtain a foreign passport which they are allowed to keep as a resident of HK (but not the Mainland). When I traveled there in 2009, the underground (subway) stations broadcast announcements in Cantonese, Mandarin & English. Back in the 1980s I've seen Taiwanese tourists in a department store trying to communicate in Mandarin and out of 5 people they found 1 able to communicate in Mandarin to do the translation. Edited by shk00design on 16 May 2013 at 5:07pm 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| Medulin Tetraglot Senior Member Croatia Joined 4669 days ago 1199 posts - 2192 votes Speaks: Croatian*, English, Spanish, Portuguese Studies: Norwegian, Hindi, Nepali | Message 243 of 249 17 May 2013 at 6:47am | IP Logged | |||||
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I like the compactness of Chinese written language.
English translations always end up having more text... 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| Duke100782 Bilingual Diglot Senior Member Philippines https://talktagalog.Registered users can see my Skype Name Joined 4489 days ago 172 posts - 240 votes Speaks: English*, Tagalog* Studies: Spanish, Mandarin | Message 244 of 249 19 September 2013 at 10:36am | IP Logged | |||||
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Mandarin as a world lingua franca? Not in the next two decades for sure.
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| I'm With Stupid Senior Member Vietnam Joined 4174 days ago 165 posts - 349 votes Speaks: English* Studies: German, Vietnamese | Message 245 of 249 19 September 2013 at 12:34pm | IP Logged | |||||
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Let's just assume that China is going to become the world's biggest economy (by no means a certainty), the world's biggest market and the world's biggest scientific community, how long did English-speaking countries enjoy a similar status before English became a global language? Britain was already a superpower, and as such, English would have already been useful, but it was in the 19th century that it unquestionably became the most powerful empire in the world (and imposed the language on vast areas of the world). Then Britain declined somewhat, and for the past 100 years, the USA has been pretty much the dominant economic power, crucially at a time when international communication and cooperation has exploded. From what I've read, it wasn't really until after WW1 and WW2 that you could genuinely say that it was the undisputed lingua franca, and much longer to get the sort of spread that it enjoys today. So yeah, it's taken at least 300 years to get to the stage it is today.
So I agree with what others have said. It might one day be a global language, and it might later be the global language, but when you think of all the things that have to fall into place for that to happen, I can't see it happening in our lifetime. I live in a country right next to China, and China is their biggest trading partner, and yet Chinese isn't routinely taught in schools. Perhaps a more telling statistic, however, would be to compare the number of English schools in China to the number of Chinese schools in any other country. 2 persons have voted this message useful | ||||||
| Medulin Tetraglot Senior Member Croatia Joined 4669 days ago 1199 posts - 2192 votes Speaks: Croatian*, English, Spanish, Portuguese Studies: Norwegian, Hindi, Nepali | Message 246 of 249 19 September 2013 at 6:16pm | IP Logged | |||||
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In many countries (like Spain, Italy, France, Brazil, Argentina, Mexico) pupils find even English difficult to learn, let alone Mandarin. :)
In Malaysia and Singapore, English (and Malay) are link languages and not Mandarin (large Chinese population notwithstanding). Will Mandarin be a lingua franca? Yes, it will. Where? In China. (50% of Chinese don't speak it, so they have a long way to go). In the future (200 years from now) there might be a clash between English and Mandarin, but I'm sure India will be there to defend the English language. English is one of those things that keeps India together, so I don't think they'll be switching to Mandarin anytime soon (and Indian ignoring or even hating China won't help that either). The most studied language (after English) in India is Spanish (and not Mandarin). So, the difficulty factor is important, no matter what sinophiles may say. Edited by Medulin on 19 September 2013 at 6:34pm 11 persons have voted this message useful | ||||||
| Papashaw Newbie Australia Joined 4104 days ago 28 posts - 32 votes Speaks: English* Studies: Mandarin | Message 247 of 249 23 September 2013 at 6:15pm | IP Logged | |||||
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It could, it may, yet it may not. If they start exporting Chinese movies and fast food chains, which I don't really
mind as long as it doesn't overtake too much, then Mandarin will be seen as chic or relevant enough to learn. The argument that it is too complex is either made by those who don't understand history, who haven't even looked at how average Chinese grammar is, or those who are conservative and prefer to tie the tongue to an ethnic identity. Tones are not impossible; and saying you are tone deaf is akin to saying you are claustrophobic and therefore are afraid of clowns or that you won't eat sweetbreads since you are on a low-carb diet. China would need to really improve their entertainment industry first. The US made many movies that were well received in China, but what have the Chinese put out? Something other than the usual restaurant chains may be nice; a xiaolongbao stand in every cheap mall! 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| Jarel Diglot Groupie Turkey Joined 4327 days ago 57 posts - 77 votes Speaks: Turkish*, English Studies: Italian, German | Message 248 of 249 26 September 2013 at 10:43am | IP Logged | |||||
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In addition to comments up; I would also like to add China overtaking western civilization as world dominating power is not a certainty. Can even be called an illusion. They are nowhere near close. They have far too few worldwide known brands, artists, singers, writers and scientists compared to their manufacturing power. What we are talking about here is a giant "developing" economy. Would take a giant "developed" economy to overtake status of west. At current rate of growth (which is very doubtful to continue) it would take two decades for China to get that status.
Also no matter what people say, it is for sure a very hard language to learn. For Mandarin to become lingua franca rest of the world needs to change the way they see the world. There aren't enough incentives to do so and i doubt there ever will be. 1 person has voted this message useful |
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