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 Language Learning Forum : General discussion |  | |
| Raye Diglot Newbie United States Joined 5158 days ago 37 posts - 51 votes  Speaks: English*, Spanish Studies: DutchB1 | Message 41 of 62 19 March 2011 at 6:13pm | IP Logged | |||||
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You can pick up things like word order, rhythm and euphony from reading a little bit beyond your skill level. Perhaps my biggest breakthrough period in Dutch came after I spent several weeks re-reading my intermediate grammar book, which was written in Dutch, for “pleasure.” The form and content intermingled in my mind, and I found myself thinking in verb-final sentences, just like the ones I was (1) reading, and (2) reading about.
Children’s books, where the skill level is just challenging enough for you to work a little and enjoy the reward, are great. At the other extreme, I recently tried to read an academic journal article about, I dunno, Middle Dutch sound shifts or something more arcane than I expected, and have become thoroughly bummed by all the advanced vocabulary. Now it’s textbook and dictionary time – no shortcuts. 3 persons have voted this message useful | ||||||
| amethyst32 Diglot Senior Member United Kingdom Joined 5653 days ago 118 posts - 198 votes Speaks: English*, Spanish Studies: Portuguese, French | Message 42 of 62 19 March 2011 at 8:25pm | IP Logged | |||||
I realise that what I did isn't the same as pure L/R. However, this person earlier made a point about it being "masochism" for beginners to L/R material that they don't understand. Incomprehensible is still incomprehensible regardless of any other methods being used, and personally I didn't find it torture or a waste of time engaging with materials that were way beyond my abilities. That and the fact that since it was asked - yes I *would* recommend it to a beginner with the caveat they have to be able to accept they won't understand much - if anything at all at first. If they can't appreciate it without comprehension then I agree the student would only find it frustrating and discouraging. Edited by amethyst32 on 19 March 2011 at 8:27pm 2 persons have voted this message useful | ||||||
| Sunja Diglot Senior Member Germany Joined 6089 days ago 2020 posts - 2295 votes 1 sounds Speaks: English*, German Studies: French, Mandarin | Message 43 of 62 19 March 2011 at 9:19pm | IP Logged | |||||
I have a pretty good grasp of the pronunciation of French and I'm used to reading beginner books (200-1000 words). If I switch to the advanced stuff (material for native speakers) and really push through it for a time, I may not catch everything, but I do get a lot of practice with words and sentence structure. If I then switch back to the easy stuff -- I feel like I've made a measurable leap in progress. It's like jumping into the deepend when you're not ready. You're in over your head, but it sure does make the shallow-end look pretty mild afterwards. 2 persons have voted this message useful | ||||||
| CaucusWolf Senior Member United States Joined 5276 days ago 191 posts - 234 votes Speaks: English* Studies: Arabic (Written), Japanese | Message 44 of 62 19 March 2011 at 9:58pm | IP Logged | |||||
I have to dissagree with this assessment.(at least in regards to the Arabic MWA course) While FSI teaches grammar in the first book, it isn't grammar intensive. The grammar in the first MWA book even with the grammar explainations, forces you to figure out syntatic patterns on your own. In the second MWA book there is no grammar explanations, rather there is grammar references for a grammar book if you're still unsure about something. Edited by CaucusWolf on 19 March 2011 at 10:07pm 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| s_allard Triglot Senior Member Canada Joined 5434 days ago 2704 posts - 5425 votes Speaks: French*, English, Spanish Studies: Polish | Message 45 of 62 19 March 2011 at 11:57pm | IP Logged | |||||
There's something wrong with this picture. You've been studying Finnish 6 hours a day for 6-7 months. That's about 180 hours a month or over 1,200 hours. If you cannot get the basic gist of most childrens's books after all that time, I think that some questions have to be answered in terms of method or learning strategy. I am of the opinion that 700 hours of study, preferably in the target country of course but not necessarily, should give a solid grounding in the workings of most languages. This is pretty much in line with estimates by most organizations such as the U.S. state department. Mind you, that does not mean you can chat away fluently in the language. But you certainly should be able to read simple texts. 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| Rennon Newbie Finland Joined 5007 days ago 8 posts - 8 votes Speaks: English* Studies: Swedish, Finnish | Message 46 of 62 20 March 2011 at 12:19am | IP Logged | |||||
Yeah, well while this is a little different than the topic, it confuses me too... I just don't know what's wrong since I study so hard yet I just can't seem to digest things well at all. I'm really not that smart but I want to learn more than anything so I don't know why this is so difficult for me. I suppose my studying is rather "all over the place" though, I just don't know how to systematically go about it, I'm here and there and my listening comprehension has been almost nothing up until a few weeks ago (I'm not really an "aspiring polyglot" or anything, so language learning is extremely new territory for me). But yeah, I'm not sure what I'm doing "wrong" or where to correct my ways or what to do to "properly learn", you know? 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| Gorgoll2 Senior Member Brazil veritassword.blogspo Joined 5150 days ago 159 posts - 192 votes Speaks: Portuguese* | Message 47 of 62 20 March 2011 at 1:02am | IP Logged | |||||
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Gorgoll2 wrote: I´m suffering this problem. I´m able to read English well, but my understanding is quite weak. I´ve Asperger, therefore, I don´t get hear well sounds. Which things have you read? I havne't Asperger, but sometimes I have problems with read as well, then I chose the things which are in very short paragraphs, and a veyr interesting subject therefore I can concentrate little bit better. If it's my school work then I use some highlighters in pink (my favourite colour), yellow, green and blue. This is for the key words, and it's very helpful when I read the infos the second time, then it's possible understand better as well. Have you a text to speech in your school? In my school we've this, and sometimes it's great as well if you can't read because of for example concentration or some annoying distractions. Dear Kulientje, The brazilian education isn´t like Europe or US. And I´m from Northeast, the most poor Brazil´s sector - Almost all the brazilian user in this forum are southern, the richest part. And I´m at a very high level in Asperger. Even in Portuguese my hearing skills are low. Thank you very much. 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| lingoleng Senior Member Germany Joined 5302 days ago 605 posts - 1290 votes | Message 48 of 62 20 March 2011 at 1:30am | IP Logged | |||||
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edit: removed verbose gossip Edited by lingoleng on 20 March 2011 at 4:22pm 1 person has voted this message useful |
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