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The Ultimate Accelerated Learning Exp. ! | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : Learning Techniques, Methods & Strategies |  | |
| Abazid Diglot Newbie Egypt Joined 5017 days ago 16 posts - 23 votes Speaks: Arabic (Egyptian)*, English Studies: Russian | Message 113 of 200 22 April 2011 at 1:03am | IP Logged | |||||||||||
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Update :
I've been looking around & researching for the best memory techniques to use along with Photo-Reading in extra grammar & vocabulary acquisition . Note:I have to mention that PR doesn't give you photographic memory , It seems to make any form of information very familiar & easily understandable to process that when you try to read through or memorize it's very easy to perform so , And once you stop thinking & trust the process and shut down your constant left brain nagging ,You find many intuitive nudges related to your purpose surface subtly , Like where to look , what to read and the main ideas the book..etc , But even though it cuts down tremendously on memorization time if thats your aim , You STILL have to memorize in the activation process ,This is why I'm looking for the best memory techniques to use along . After researching around for a while , The best that came up was "Phenomenal Memory" and what was intriguing(Synchronicity at hand) was finding that there's a part about Language and it specifically had to do with "Russian" , I then went around all over the place to check the authenticity of the testimonials through the forum and many other places (Including this forum) ,And I was intrigued to find the incredible results of many people from 15 yr old teenagers to even an 80 year old student =D . After lots of research in what the difference between their methods and the other mainstream memory methods , I've found out that theirs was incredibly systematic, very flexible & practical in every aspect and by far complete , And the students found it hard especially at the first 12 intensive lessons and then after getting to the 24th lesson all was incredibly satisfied that they wished they learned it from a very long time(There's a test at the end of the 24 lesson that comprises all the blocks of information they memorized since the start which is a lot and it shows TRUE progress) , At the 59th lesson , Most say that they have WAY stronger visualization , concentration & focus and can start to memorize books word for word verbatim ,Even one of the graduates won the 129 position in the memory competition (I've seen his name and confirmed it myself) One of the graduated students that later on became an instructor claimed (inside the forum posts) he already has memorized about 12 books and learned to speak very good Italian in 2 intensive weeks (200 or more words per 4 hours a day)..etc . Intrigued by so many reports all over the place ,I wanted this for myself ,So I decided to test this for myself and go through the 60 lessons and see where would my Russian go with this as I go through it . So I downloaded the course , And I'm going to start reading the manual tonight before starting with the lessons , I'm basically going to work daily at it and I will post my results later . Edited by Abazid on 22 April 2011 at 1:12am 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||||||||
| hrhenry Octoglot Senior Member United States languagehopper.blogs Joined 5130 days ago 1871 posts - 3642 votes  Speaks: English*, SpanishC2, ItalianC2, Norwegian, Catalan, Galician, Turkish, Portuguese Studies: Polish, Indonesian, Ojibwe | Message 114 of 200 22 April 2011 at 3:42am | IP Logged | |||||||||||
I still maintain that what you did was in a vacuum. See, when you get too cocky, people will generally be more than willing to find your faults, because you're just cocky enough to ignore the faults. Sorry, but I can tell from your writing that you're not a native-like speaker. You're writing is quite good, don't get me wrong. But it doesn't have a native/native-like feel to it. I've not heard you speak English, but I'm willing to wager that I'd be able to hear non-native characteristics in your speech and accent, especially if you've not spoken with "One" native speaker. Now, back to your intensive Russian weekend. If you don't like the word "proof", then let's rephrase the request to asking for "results". If you've obtained the results you claim, you should have no trouble producing tangible evidence. Hell, if I obtained the results you claim to have obtained, I'd be pretty damn proud of it and show everyone I possibly could, not just talk about it. R. == Edited by hrhenry on 22 April 2011 at 3:50am 2 persons have voted this message useful | ||||||||||||
| aerozeplyn Senior Member United States Joined 5148 days ago 141 posts - 202 votes Speaks: English* Studies: Spanish, Mandarin | Message 115 of 200 22 April 2011 at 5:37am | IP Logged | |||||||||||
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Abazid,
ignore people like hrhenry; they're obviously no help anyways. who cares if what you did was in a vacuum? The point is, you attacked a large dataset of information, much of that is surely still in your short-term memory, and best of all, you can now continue your studies and experience many connections with the Russian language MUCH better with that larger dataset in your short-term memory. These connections will bring many positive results, which in-turn will have a deeper mark on your new self. Personally, I have a deep recommendation for you. You need to use everything activated in your short-term memory to experience positive language connections. The more fun and discovery you have--and the better re-enforcement of these new experiences--the less likely you will ever forget them. People forget random sets of data all the time (ie- the information you studied in your 3-day period); however, people seldom forget experiences. And your experience will ease your memory into all of the additional elements (words, phrases, etc) involved in the experience. This is why people use mnemonics. This is also why when people learn phrases or words in a particular order, they are better likely to recall those words and phrases when they work through the same or similar sequence. You have all experienced this; it should be no magical mystery. So in conclusion, I would strongly recommend that you use the valuable time you have left of your intensely activated study. Don't worry so much about acquiring more learning / memory techniques; however, focus on using this current language with native speakers. Also, this entire thread has inspired me to write a thread on rapid improvement. I've already written many articles on my computer here... and i'll just have to post them a little at a time. (It is far too much information to understand all at once.) Unfortunately for some people in this thread, when you are busy looking for faults, that leaves you with less focus to find the valuable information in someone's message. No communication is 100% correct; language is just too insignificant to explain the experience. With a site dedicated to studying languages, you would think that language learners would understand that.... 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||||||||
| Arekkusu Hexaglot Senior Member Canada bit.ly/qc_10_lec Joined 5381 days ago 3971 posts - 7747 votes Speaks: English, French*, GermanC1, Spanish, Japanese, Esperanto Studies: Italian, Norwegian, Mandarin, Romanian, Estonian | Message 116 of 200 22 April 2011 at 6:13am | IP Logged | |||||||||||
2 years ago? You wouldn't by any chance have had any contact with or introduction to the language during that time, would you?
I wouldn't be so quick to dismiss the "know-it-all armchair skeptics"; I'm sure you realize that many of them have studied way more languages than you, and tried out way more methods than you. As romantic as the idea of being the illuminated one against a crowd of closed-minded non-believers may seem, the general wisdom of other members shouldn't be ignored.
Because "uttering beliefs" is not proof. You make a claim, we react. That's what forums are. Would you prefer that only people who agree with you read this thread?
It seems armchair skeptics weren't all that wrong in the end. 2 persons have voted this message useful | ||||||||||||
| aerozeplyn Senior Member United States Joined 5148 days ago 141 posts - 202 votes Speaks: English* Studies: Spanish, Mandarin | Message 117 of 200 22 April 2011 at 6:59am | IP Logged | |||||||||||
yes, it is absolutely possible. Have you read Mike Mangini's book Rhythm Knowledge? I can't remember if it's Volume 1 or Volume 2 that talk more about the 90+ minute exercises, but I have experience with his improvement techniques. Some of my drumming friends--as well as many of my students--also have experience with these techniques. Personally, with the collective observation of many of my students, comparing with past students, some current students that don't find certain methods as something they want to practice, etc... I have realized that Mike Mangini's long-period exercises are indeed very very effective, and it is true when he says you DO continue to improve throughout the week even when you don't practice. I believe this is because your body is continuing to grow to accomidate the proper body for your recent actions. However, I have also realized that the process of doing a 90-minute (or 180-minute!) exercise does not need to be this long to be effective. During most of the time of the exercise, you are also putting your mind into a meditative state. As your muscles get tired and more relaxed, your body is also searching for ways to perform the same actions using less energy. The less energy you use on your technique, the more energy you have for many other tasks. This is also true with language: the less energy you use on your pronunciation or phrase making, the more energy you have for constructing other lines of communication. I have successfully--along with countless students of mine--received these improvements in a shorter period of time. The first 15 minutes are spent using a relaxation / oxygenating exercise, and the next 30 minutes are used for mindful, relaxed practice. This is exciting stuff, but YES it is completely possible to adapt Mike Mangini's method for language learning. You just need to find the most effective exercises and not give up. And the truth boils down to the fact that you just have to learn how to relax better, and instead of THINKING about how to do every rudimentary language element, you must REMEMBER. Memory takes much less energy than thinking, and memory is much more immediate.
Sure Abazid :) I will also let you all know when I have posted a thread on this. The "3 months in one session" thing involves improving on the language of drumming. Keep in mind that "3 months in one session" refers to old, traditional learning techniques that take about 3 months to acquire, when using the new methods only takes 1 session to acquire. This 1 session activates the information into your short term memory, and then you reinforce it with positive experiences into your long term. It is a long of fun and very fulfilling :) I have done this plenty of times for myself and ESPECIALLY plenty of times with my students. You see, it is really difficult to "prove" to someone that a method works, especially when this person is not going to try out the method for themselves. Basically, proving the method is a waste of time. Use that time on yourself, and let their skepticism limit their experience. I just want to mention that, because it is rare that you will have the opportunity to validate a method unless you are also experiencing the improvement of your students and comparing these improvements with other learning techniques. Abazid do you have Skype? I would much rather explain this method to you--and preferably other people at the same time--over voice than typing it out. I will show my students these methods over 4 weeks. These are mainly students who want to make their school drum line within 3-6 months and actually get a non-flag or non-bass position. (It takes a good chunk of time to understand the discipline of the method.) It is common if you're a drum teacher to get students who want to make drumline by the next school year (which is about 6 months away), but at the same time it used to be very uncommon to find a student to actually accomplish getting a snare or quad position with only 6-9 months of study. When using techniques based on relaxation and experiencing a large dataset of information related to the desired skill (such as drumming), it is common for me to coach students going into 9th or 10th grade for 1-3 months…and these students make significant positions in their school's drumline. The students who manage to acquire this experience by visiting me 4 times (one visit each week) are the students that I say, "Look, drumline try-outs are coming very soon. If you really want to accomplish this I can definitely help you, but you will need to do the methods exactly as I explain them. We'll also do them together. OK?" However, once you understand the method, you can easily apply it to your feet and then play the bass drum (with your feet) as if you would play the snare. This is one example where you realize the possibility of an 8 hour practice session accomplishing what takes others--using traditional improvement techniques--3 months or even a year! There's nothing magical about it; you just need the patience to understand that an array of new knowledge can be out there, and unfortunately, you must also accept that it probably won't take a 10 minute conversation for you to understand. Then again, it can also come easily depending on your experience :) Heck, it might even come easily like elementary knowledge. Anyhoo, for anyone who is interested: feel free to private message me with your Skype id. I will leave anymore talk about this in another thread, as really the subject matter of this thread should involve Abazid's journey :D And for now... time to work on my own practice :) Edited by aerozeplyn on 22 April 2011 at 7:05am 2 persons have voted this message useful | ||||||||||||
| HMS Senior Member England Joined 5107 days ago 143 posts - 256 votes Speaks: English* | Message 118 of 200 22 April 2011 at 8:52am | IP Logged | |||||||||||
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I detect animosity, and dare I say it - jealousy. Here we have somebody who has chosen to conduct an experiment and share the experience. There is no doubting there has to be some form of personal accomplishment achieved here. The original poster is not trying to claim something that he is not - he is merely trying to answer posed questions using the benchmarks set by the questioner. In this case which level he deems himself to be at.
This is rather like when a lottery winner moves house into an affluent area and they are regarded with suspicion, and denigrated as "new money" by those who consider themselves to have gained wealth "the proper way". Stop being so defensive just because somebody has had the temerity to put an alternative, unconventional method to the test and allude to some form of positive result. 8 persons have voted this message useful | ||||||||||||
| aerozeplyn Senior Member United States Joined 5148 days ago 141 posts - 202 votes Speaks: English* Studies: Spanish, Mandarin | Message 119 of 200 22 April 2011 at 9:51am | IP Logged | |||||||||||
i agree that there are some unreasonable negativities here. Abazid is sharing ideas and information...be calm. there are going to always be people who have a hard time accepting new information and techniques, especially when that item is not easily expressed with words, graphs, pictures, statistics, etc. Imagine the pioneers that led to the development of radio trying to share their ideas--with insignificant resources--on how radio waves could be used to control objects from a massive distance. oh well, some people just don't respect other people's information; they don't account for the fact that other people may have been fortunate enough to have experienced wildly different things compared to their own life; and they don't appreciate others trying to share something with them. it's just life. :) rapid learning is my PASSION. it is also something where i have had the opportunity to find many different techniques and methods proven to me time and time again. This has been proven to me through my own studies (compared with past studies), and from constant observation of my students. the point is: there is always room for building a better learning strategy and environment. you simply close your mind when you dismiss the smallest feature just because it doesn't make sense to you. demanding "proof" before you even consider what elements may make something possible will also only prevent your mind from opening further, as "proof" is not always readily available in the form of some dogmatic procedure that one assumes will qualify as proof. Besides, when you watch a science fiction movie, do you find yourself writing letters to the production company demanding for proof of the elements in the science fiction movie? Of course not; but the lack of proof--and the fact that you KNOW it is fiction--does not prevent you from discovering new ideas. For a semi-related example, what is the use trying to convince the individual in the 1500's that something such as "radio waves" exist and can be harnessed? If they only believe in what they can see, hear, smell, etc, then the idea of something invisibly moving objects makes no sense, especially when someone claims they might be able to do it! --unless maybe that 1500s individual is very religious, you may try suggesting to them that "radio" is a manifestation of their religion. hehe. These people will only limit their own mindset and discourage others from investigating into new possibilities. Thankfully, their attitude is a model and inspiration to help us improve ourselves, to help us respect others, and to help open our minds further. 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||||||||
| Volte Tetraglot Senior Member Switzerland Joined 6439 days ago 4474 posts - 6726 votes Speaks: English*, Esperanto, German, Italian Studies: French, Finnish, Mandarin, Japanese | Message 120 of 200 22 April 2011 at 12:36pm | IP Logged | |||||||||||
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I'm kind of puzzled about what the fuss is about. In the end, the original poster used MT, got the kinds of results you'd expect from investing dozens of hours into MT, and that's that. He was a bit short of sleep during, and crammed it into a short number of calender days, and he's clearly not deeply familiar with the CEFR, but on the whole, his results seem fairly reasonable.
Aside from that, this thread has mentioned a number of valuable techniques for accelerated learning (I don't consider every technique mentioned valuable, but several are). Abazid: congratulations on running your experiment. Those of you interested in intensive and rapid learning may want to look at Listening-reading. 3 persons have voted this message useful |
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