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Crippling effect of technology | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : General discussion |  | |
 Iversen Super Polyglot Moderator Denmark berejst.dk Joined 6703 days ago 9078 posts - 16473 votes  Speaks: Danish*, French, English, German, Italian, Spanish, Portuguese, Dutch, Swedish, Esperanto, Romanian, Catalan Studies: Afrikaans, Greek, Norwegian, Russian, Serbian, Icelandic, Latin, Irish, Lowland Scots, Indonesian, Polish, Croatian Personal Language Map | Message 9 of 36 12 October 2011 at 12:36pm | IP Logged | ||||||||
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SRS is basically a control mechanism - the repetition is there and it comes into play when you fail a test and get the correct answer, but you are tested before you get the correction. This is true both for the digital solutions and for oldfashioned cards, and I find it slightly superfluous because every genuine text I read or speech I listen to will test me.
So instead I do wordlists, using my three-column layout. Could these lists be made digital? Probably, and I have followed a couple of attempts, but I still don't see the point. I only need a source for the words, a piece of paper, two pens with different colour, a table and some calm surroundings, then I'm up and running. When I say I prefer writing them by hand it can of course be my age that shines through, but I simply remember better when I have written something on paper with a pen. And as an added bonus the sheer physical aspect of a word in my own handwriting can be used as memory hook. I copy texts by hand for similar reasons. The real value of the internet is that we have got instant access to a cornucopia of written and spoken sources, we have got fast dictionaries and translation sites, and even - though I don't use it myself - Skype is also worth mentioning. For people on the run MP3 players and tablets are the best possible solution to two age old problems - how to 'stretch' your study time and how to listen enough to your target languages. So I do think that modern technology is a gift to language learners. But there are just some things that function at least as well or better using oldfashioned methods. Edited by Iversen on 13 October 2011 at 3:19pm 5 persons have voted this message useful | |||||||||
| Wompi Triglot Groupie Germany Joined 4956 days ago 56 posts - 64 votes Speaks: German*, Spanish, English Studies: Czech | Message 10 of 36 12 October 2011 at 1:00pm | IP Logged | ||||||||
For me it is almost the same. But even if I use computers for the most time in my current life and work I can not really learn actively with them. I tried but for me it is also too uncomfortable doing e.g. SRS or typing texts into Word. But this doesn´t mean that I don´t use technology to help improving my quality of learning. I still use my mp3 player for listening, create e-books with parallel texts, use Google translate or other online dictionaries and reading blogs etc. Because with the help of technology I can improve the quality when I am learning without technologies. And I think we are always trying to improve our skills so why shouldn´t new technologies be helpful with that. Edited by Wompi on 12 October 2011 at 1:08pm 1 person has voted this message useful | |||||||||
| Arekkusu Hexaglot Senior Member Canada bit.ly/qc_10_lec Joined 5381 days ago 3971 posts - 7747 votes Speaks: English, French*, GermanC1, Spanish, Japanese, Esperanto Studies: Italian, Norwegian, Mandarin, Romanian, Estonian | Message 11 of 36 12 October 2011 at 3:39pm | IP Logged | ||||||||
This was pretty the bulk of my argument. I think I felt so comfortable with technology that I expected to be able to use it for everything, when I find that I retain things better if I use a pen and paper. Perhaps this is because I can use more creativity and I'm not limited. My point was that this might not be the case for the younger generation who grew up expressing their creativity through technological media. Of course, Internet is an awesome tool and I never meant otherwise. I use my iPad all the time. At the same time, we learned languages just fine before those things came along. I simply wanted to acknowledge that as a human being, there are still things I learn better when done the old-fashioned way. 4 persons have voted this message useful | |||||||||
| montmorency Diglot Senior Member United Kingdom Joined 4828 days ago 2371 posts - 3676 votes Speaks: English*, German Studies: Danish, Welsh | Message 12 of 36 12 October 2011 at 5:10pm | IP Logged | ||||||||
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I don't know about "crippling", but I do have a few concerns.
1. I was listening to a discussion today (on a computer, from an MP3 ironically enough), and they were discussing the wider effects of the internet and new technology. Although we have more and more means of communication nowadays, it is mostly indirect communication, and they feared that this might lead to a gradual alienation of people from another, on a personal level. 2. Although young people have a great advantage today in all this technology, I also fear that they also have a lot of distractions, from this same technology. I fear that their attention spans will decrease, and that this generation may never really learn to absorb a subject, any subject, really deeply. Instead, they may flit, like butterflies, from subject to subject. Butterflies are beautiful, but you don't ask them to build your bridges. 3. I think of the best of the old-time language teachers I have known, fully conversant in their subject and good teachers to boot. Probably the highest technology they had available to them when they were learning was the gramophone record, the slide- projector, and the reel-to-reel tape recorder. It makes me worry that no matter how much technology you throw at a subject, there are limits to what you can achieve. 4 persons have voted this message useful | |||||||||
| Zwlth Super Polyglot Senior Member United States Joined 5226 days ago 154 posts - 320 votes Speaks: English*, German, Italian, Spanish, Russian, Arabic (Written), Dutch, Swedish, Portuguese, Latin, French, Persian, Greek | Message 13 of 36 12 October 2011 at 10:11pm | IP Logged | ||||||||
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I know I'll sound like a Luddite, but I think the most important thing is studying is focus and concentration, and as computers, smart phones, etc., are inherently multitasking devices, I do not believe it is possible to study as efficiently on them as it is to study on "dedicated" paper. People who have either grown up on technology or succumbed utterly to it are not really in a position to judge nor, I suppose, are cellphone refuseniks. All I can really say is I'm certainly IT savvy, but when it comes to reading or studying, I know I do it better with books. I seriously think it would make a good scientific research project to objectively compare the results of studying in the same fashion (e.g., flashcards and Anki) on and off line.
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 jeff_lindqvist Diglot Moderator SwedenRegistered users can see my Skype Name Joined 6909 days ago 4250 posts - 5711 votes Speaks: Swedish*, English Studies: German, Spanish, Russian, Dutch, Mandarin, Esperanto, Irish, French Personal Language Map | Message 14 of 36 12 October 2011 at 11:21pm | IP Logged | ||||||||
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Textbook, mp3 player, grammar book, pen and paper, dictionary, internet - any tool has its merits. I'm not connected to "internet" while taking a walk, but I can listen to something on my mp3 player. When I'm working on the computer, there's no room for textbooks. I don't learn to write Chinese characters better than trying them out for "real" with a pen and paper. And so on. People have learned languages way before computers were as common as they are today (I know people around here whose German or French they learned some 50 years ago is more accurate than the average youth's English - how about that!).
Somewhat related topic: Language studies in the past 3 persons have voted this message useful | |||||||||
| jerrypettit Groupie United States Joined 6026 days ago 79 posts - 103 votes Speaks: English* | Message 15 of 36 14 October 2011 at 2:12am | IP Logged | ||||||||
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60-year-old here.
I discovered SRS's 5 or 6 years ago (I use Supermemo and Anki), and they changed my life. Unlike others' experiences, they actually make drill more "entertaining"--part of that coming from my knowledge that this is a more efficient way to learn. My drills are mostly "audio", which also makes it more interesting than just word lists. I have chopped up Pimsleur phrases and sentences and have the SRS "speak" to me every day. I've also chopped up books in L2, along with translations into my native English, and imported them into the SRS. For me, SRS's keep things interesting, in the absence of an immersion program. 1 person has voted this message useful | |||||||||
| tricoteuse Pentaglot Senior Member Norway littlang.blogspot.co Joined 6678 days ago 745 posts - 845 votes Speaks: Swedish*, Norwegian, EnglishC1, Russian, French Studies: Ukrainian, Bulgarian | Message 16 of 36 14 October 2011 at 8:37am | IP Logged | ||||||||
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I am always surprised at how many people dislike flashcards. They boosted my Russian vocabulary immensely, and without them I would never have learned as my words as I did. However, I read a lot, so I combine flashcards with reading (and writing - adding words I realize I need for the things I want to say). Doing 10 minutes of flashcards on my way to Uni also makes me feel like I haven't neglected my language completely that day, which is very much the case with Old Norse ^^ (which is honestly quite boring)
I like to write thing down both with a pen and on the computer, but I don't feel that either one helps me more. 2 persons have voted this message useful |
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