Advancing Korean, Year 5/6: TAC15 東亞 (Language Learning Log) Language Learning Forum

Advancing Korean, Year 5/6: TAC15 東亞
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druckfehler
Triglot
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Germany
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Message 105 of 344

22 October 2012 at 9:32pm | IP Logged

I just wrote another Korean essay on the topic of the 26th TOPIK's writing assignment. It was easier than anticipated although it was admittedly an easy topic and I did double check with google and naver several times. I had to look up words like "believer, follower", "baha'i faith", "jewish orthodox" and - sadly - "tourist", "to dance" and "(emotionally) moving", which I should have known. Grammar-wise the last two sentences were fairly messed up in my original version. I also got some of the mid-sentence verb-connectors wrong and my use of 은/는 and 이/가 still seems to be problematic.

I'm posting the essay here to keep track of my development. It's the corrected version with an attempt at an English translation... (To be honest, translating the essay was almost as hard as writing it :D). My vocabulary and stylistic ability seem to have improved quite a bit lately. Most of this is thanks to my Anki deck of audio sentences and also to some degree to the picture-sentence-cards I'm making from the TOPIK Intermediate word list. Basically all noteworthy vocabulary and expressions I used are what I remember from those decks.

druckfehler (from lang8) wrote:

가장 기억에 남는 여행 My Most Memorable Travel

작년 4월에 이스라엘에 배낭여행하려고 갔다. 3주간 여러 곳에 다니면서 많은 훌륭한 사람들을 만났다. 그때 여행이 제일 인상 깊어서 가장 기억에 남는다.

Last April I went to Israel to do a backpacking trip. During three weeks I met many extraordinary people while I visited several places. That travel left the deepest impression, so it is the most memorable.

그런 긴 여행에 처음으로 혼자서 갔다. 텔아비브에서 사는 친구가 공항으로 마중 나오겠다고 약속헀는데도 약간 긴장했다. 다행히 다 잘 됐다. 그 친구의 공동 아파트에서 2박 3일 머무는 동안 텔아비브와 야파를 구경하며 사진도 많이 찍고 거리에서 만난 사람들과 얘기도 나누었다.

I went on such a long trip alone for the first time. Even though a friend who lives in Tel Aviv promised to meet me at the airport I was a little nervous. Luckily everything went well. While I stayed in that friend's shared flat for 2 nights and 3 days, I went sightseeing in Tel Aviv and Jaffa, took many pictures and talked to people I met on the street.

그 다음에는 하이파에서 사는 친구의 가정집을 방문했다. 친구와 함께 하루만 대학에 가서 그녀가 듣던 미술강의도 같이 들어봤다. 또한 퓨림 축일을 그 친구와 즐겁게 보냈다. 하이파에서 특이하고 신기한 여행자 여러 명을 만나게 됐다. 미국인 바하이교 신도도 있고 다큐멘터리를 촬영하고 싶었던 브라질인도 있었다.

After that I visited the family of a friends who lives in Haifa. For only one day I went to university with my friend and we listened to the art lecture she was taking together. I also happily spent the Purim festival with her. In Haifa I happened to meet some unique and fascinating travellers. There was an American Baha'i, as well as a Barzilian who wanted to shoot a documentary.

마지막으로 베르셰바에 갔다. 관광객들이 보통 안 가는 도시이지만 저는 베르셰바에서 다수의 흥미로운 경험을 했다. 그곳에서는 유대교도인 부부를 방문했다. 토요일에 함께 안식일을 지켰다. 금요일 밤이 안식일의 시작이라서 유대교 회당에서 기도한 후 온 가족과 저녁을 먹었다. 토요일날 다시 유대교 회당에 가자마자 하루종일 쉬어야 해서 얘기도 많이 나누고 산책도 했다. 안식일 끝에는 감동적인 춤을 함께 췄다.

Finally I went to Beer Sheba. It is a city where tourist usually don't go, but I had many interesting experiences in Beer Sheba. In that place I visited a Jewish-orthodox couple. On Saturday we observed the Sabbath together. Because Friday night is the beginning of the Sabbath, we had dinner with the whole family after praying at the Synagogue. On Saturday, after we went to the Synagogue again, we had to rest the whole day, so we shared many conversations and also went for a walk. At the end of the Sabbath we danced a moving dance together.

여행 할 때마다 관광지보다는 일상 생활에 훨씬 더 관심이 많아서 명소에 가는 것 보다는 사람들이 평소에 사는 모습을 보고 싶다. 이스라엘에서 친구 여러 명을 만나서 일상생활을 나누었던 그때의 기억은 나에게 있어 너무나도 소중하다.

Whenever I travel I'm much more interested in daily life than in sightseeing, so instead of going to the tourist attractions I wanted to see how people normally live. The memories of my time in Israel, where I met several friends and shared their everyday life are very precious to me.

Edited by druckfehler on 22 October 2012 at 10:32pm
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Ojorolla
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Message 106 of 344

23 October 2012 at 8:49am | IP Logged

druckfehler (from lang8) wrote:

가장 기억에 남는 여행 My Most Memorable Travel

작년 4월에 이스라엘에 배낭여행하려고 갔다. 3주간 여러 곳에 다니면서 많은 훌륭한 사람들을 만났다. 그때 여행이 제일 인상 깊어서 가장 기억에 남는다.
훌륭한 사람들을 많이 만났다 is better.

그런 긴 여행에 처음으로 혼자서 갔다. 텔아비브에서 사는 친구가 공항으로 마중 나오겠다고 약속헀는데도 약간 긴장했다.
텔아비브에 사는 친구가 is better.
다행히 다 잘 됐다. 그 친구의 공동 아파트에서 2박 3일 머무는 동안 텔아비브와 야파를 구경하며 사진도 많이 찍고 거리에서 만난 사람들과 얘기도 나누었다.
Again, 공동 아파트에 머무는 동안 is better.
그 다음에는 하이파에서 사는 친구의 가정집을 방문했다.
Idem. -> 하이파에

친구와 함께 하루만 대학에 가서 그녀가 듣던 미술강의도 같이 들어봤다.
Here 만 doesn't sound very natural. You could say 딱 하루 instead, but I think it's better to omit it and say just 하루.
또한 퓨림 축일을 그 친구와 즐겁게 보냈다. 하이파에서 특이하고 신기한 여행자 여러 명을 만나게 됐다. 미국인 바하이교 신도도 있고 다큐멘터리를 촬영하고 싶었던 브라질인도 있었다.
-> 싶어하던. You must say so in 3rd person.

마지막으로 베르셰바에 갔다. 관광객들이 보통 안 가는 도시이지만 저는 베르셰바에서 다수의 흥미로운 경험을 했다.
-> 나는. You can't say 저 in 반말.
그곳에서는 유대교도인 부부를 방문했다. 토요일에 함께 안식일을 지켰다. 금요일 밤이 안식일의 시작이라서 유대교 회당에서 기도한 후 온 가족과 저녁을 먹었다. 토요일날 다시 유대교 회당에 가자마자 하루종일 쉬어야 해서 얘기도 많이 나누고 산책도 했다.
-> 토요일날은 하루종일 쉬는 날이라서 다시 유대교 회당에 가서 얘기도 많이 나누고 산책도 했다.
You have to change the order of 가서 and 쉬는 날이라서 as corrected if you want the sentence to make sense. Also, I don't understand your use of ...자마자 and 쉬어야 해서
안식일 끝에는 감동적인 춤을 함께 췄다.
For some reason, 안식일 끝에 sounds awkard to me. I would say 안식일이 끝날 때 instead:
그리고 안식일이 끝날 때 감동적인 춤을 함께 췄다.

여행 할 때마다 관광지보다는 일상 생활에 훨씬 더 관심이 많아서 명소에 가는 것 보다는 사람들이 평소에 사는 모습을 보고 싶다.
관광지보다는 일상 생활에 훨씬 더 관심이 많다 make sense to me, but 여행 할 때마다 관광지보다는 일상 생활에 훨씬 더 관심이 많다 doesn't. I would obliterate 여행 할 때마다. - edit: Then again, your sentence could make sense if 여행할 때마다 garnishes 보고 싶다, and not 관심이 많다.
이스라엘에서 친구 여러 명을 만나서 일상생활을 나누었던 그때의 기억은 나에게 있어 너무나도 소중하다.
일상생활을 나누다 doesn't sound quite right to me. 일상생활을 하다 is a better alternative.

Hope this helps.

Edited by Ojorolla on 23 October 2012 at 9:05am
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druckfehler
Triglot
Senior Member
Germany
Joined 4866 days ago
1181 posts - 1912 votes

Speaks: German*, English^C2, Korean
Studies: Persian

Message 107 of 344

23 October 2012 at 2:04pm | IP Logged

Thank you so much for the correction! Of course it helps a lot! :) I didn't know that so many mistakes/awkward expressions were left even after I got the text corrected at lang-8.

Ojorolla wrote:

미국인 바하이교 신도도 있고 다큐멘터리를 촬영하고 싶었던 브라질인도 있었다.
-> 싶어하던. You must say so in 3rd person.

I understand that I have to use 싶어하다. But should I use 싶어하던 or 싶어했던? He only wanted to shoot a documentary this one time in Israel, so I wanted to use 싶어했던. Is it correct or should I use 싶어하던?

Ojorolla wrote:

여행 할 때마다 관광지보다는 일상 생활에 훨씬 더 관심이 많아서 명소에 가는 것 보다는 사람들이 평소에 사는 모습을 보고 싶다.
관광지보다는 일상 생활에 훨씬 더 관심이 많다 make sense to me, but 여행 할 때마다 관광지보다는 일상 생활에 훨씬 더 관심이 많다 doesn't. I would obliterate 여행 할 때마다. - edit: Then again, your sentence could make sense if 여행할 때마다 garnishes 보고 싶다, and not 관심이 많다.

Can I change the position of "여행할 때마다" like this? -> 관광지보다는 일상 생활에 훨씬 더 관심이 많아서 여행 할 때마다 명소에 가는 것 보다는 사람들이 평소에 사는 모습을 보고 싶다.

Edited by druckfehler on 23 October 2012 at 2:05pm
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Ojorolla
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Message 108 of 344

23 October 2012 at 4:04pm | IP Logged

싶어하던 & 싶어했던 sound both okay to me.

druckfehler wrote:

Can I change the position of "여행할 때마다" like this? -> 관광지보다는 일상 생활에 훨씬 더 관심이 많아서 여행 할 때마다 명소에 가는 것 보다는 사람들이 평소에 사는 모습을 보고 싶다.

Yes, you can. Your sentence sounds right.
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druckfehler
Triglot
Senior Member
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Speaks: German*, English^C2, Korean
Studies: Persian

Message 109 of 344

27 October 2012 at 8:00pm | IP Logged

The moment of truth has arrived. It's time to evaluate whether I met one of the two goals I set for the TAC. I had originally planned to take the Intermediate TOPIK today, only to find out that it's not held in Germany in October and that the next opportunity is only in April 2013. So I decided to take the newest available test (the 27th TOPIK) on my own to see if I could have met my goal. The answer is a resounding yes!

I was surprised how easily I took the test this time around. In February I hardly understood anything, in May I kind of knew what I was doing 70% of the time and now I only got a little lost in the second half of the listening section.

My Results:

Reading: 87
Writing: 59
Grammar & Expressions: 83
Listening: 75
Average: 76

For passing level 4 no section can be under 50 points and the average score must be over 70.

It's obvious that all the extensive and intensive reading of different types of texts has paid off. I was able to improve my Reading score again from 57 points in May to 87 points now. It's no surprise to me that reading has become my strongest section. This time there was no text I didn't understand and I was able to deduce almost all unknown vocabulary from context.

Writing is always a little difficult to evaluate, because it is the only section that doesn't completely rely on multiple choice questions. I evaluated the free writing sections strictly to make sure not to artificially inflate my score and only gave myself 10/30 points on the essay. I think it's realistic that I'd have gotten at least 10 points. I was very surprised that I got almost all other free writing questions either completely or partially right. Last time I was completely lost on them. I credit reading and the many sentences I'm repeating in Anki for this development.

The Grammar and Expressions section also surprised me. I didn't do any structured grammar study and still it was really easy. I guess I know a good bit of grammar passively by now (active grammar usage is more tricky). There were only a couple of questions where I didn't know several of the grammar patterns in the answer. I improved my score from 62 points in May to 83 points.

My Listening score almost remained the same. In May I got 71 points, this time I got 75. Overall comprehension got better, but not enough to affect the score. I still often couldn't reliably figure out both the written answers and the spoken text in the little available time.

I'm pretty sure I would have passed level 4 if I had taken the official test and that my score wouldn't change much with another test paper. So I'm counting this TAC goal as a success. I thought it was ambitious given my previous casual study habits, but I thought that it should be achievable and it proved true.

Edited by druckfehler on 27 October 2012 at 9:38pm
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druckfehler
Triglot
Senior Member
Germany
Joined 4866 days ago
1181 posts - 1912 votes

Speaks: German*, English^C2, Korean
Studies: Persian

Message 110 of 344

28 October 2012 at 10:36pm | IP Logged

Sunday, 28st of October - 40th week

vocabulary from list: 4 words
new audio cards: 17
extensive reading: 14 pages of 콩쥐팥쥐, 1 newspaper article
listening: 2 episodes of 차칸 남자, 1 TTMIK 이야기
speaking: self-talk
writing: 1 essay, 2 hours of text chatting

I don't have much to say for this week, or rather I've already said it. Despite hypothetically passing level 4 on test I took to gauge my level yesterday I'm going to continue making vocabulary cards from the TOPIK wordlist. The words they selected are quite useful and I'm happy if I can get a high percentage on the test in April.

Overall, I want to continue doing what I've been doing for the rest of the year. I'd also like to write a few more essays and get back to Hanja, but we'll see if that works out.
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Evita
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Latvia
learnlatvian.info
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Studies: Korean, Finnish

Message 111 of 344

29 October 2012 at 6:50am | IP Logged

druckfehler wrote:

Congratulations! It's really nice to get all your hard work validated this way. Do you plan to study for level 5 now?
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druckfehler
Triglot
Senior Member
Germany
Joined 4866 days ago
1181 posts - 1912 votes

Speaks: German*, English^C2, Korean
Studies: Persian

Message 112 of 344

29 October 2012 at 4:15pm | IP Logged

Thanks :) It's definitely motivating to see that my dedication to the TAC has paid off. I think it goes to show that working on a language continually will always bear results.

Evita wrote:

Do you plan to study for level 5 now?

TOPIK has a rather peculiar structure. Level 1&2, level 3&4 and level 5&6 are each evaluated in one test, the distinction of which level you pass is made by points. As a result, the climb between level 2 and 3 and between level 4 and 5 is quite steep. I looked at an Advanced test paper and I didn't understand much - I definitely didn't know how to answer any of the questions. So while I do want to write the Advanced test eventually, I'm going to just focus on level 4 for April.

My plans for next year include starting to study Chinese and/or taking up Persian again. At the start of this year's TAC I had decided to just focus on Korean and promised that I'd allow myself to start a new language if I could pass TOPIK level 4. I'll probably be a bit more relaxed about Korean study next year or study a little differently. I'll probably do less Anki and more reading and - hopefully, if I can motivate myself - also writing and speaking. I want to study less and live more in the language.

Edited by druckfehler on 29 October 2012 at 4:16pm

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