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French or Arabic for North Africa | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : Specific Languages |  | |
| Travis.H Triglot Groupie United States Joined 4459 days ago 59 posts - 91 votes  Speaks: English*, Japanese, Sign Language Studies: French | Message 1 of 26 30 October 2012 at 5:32am | IP Logged | ||
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I'm planning on visiting a few north African countries for about 3 months or so next
summer and I'm trying to decide which language would be better to study, French or Arabic. I realize that the official language of that area is Arabic (dialects differing depending on region), but the more I read about it, the more I see how much French is used. In addition, French words are thrown into local spoken Arabic and appears to be a language of the educated. Considering I have no French, would it be better to go through Assimil French before starting MSA and then finally doing a dialect? 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| kanewai Triglot Senior Member United States justpaste.it/kanewai Joined 4892 days ago 1386 posts - 3054 votes Speaks: English*, French, Marshallese Studies: Italian, Spanish | Message 2 of 26 30 October 2012 at 6:48am | IP Logged | ||
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I spent ten days in Tunisia this past fall, and used French almost exclusively. I made
an attempt at learning 'derja' (Tunisian Arabic) before going, but the only resources I could find were in French anyways. I think someone who was fluent in MSA might be able to code-switch and adapt to Derja, but for a beginner it's almost impossible. For what it's worth: the trip was wonderful for my French skills! People were patient, and English wasn't common, so I had to make the effort. Also, everyone seemed to know French, even in the rural areas - it wasn't just the educated or elite. I think Algeria is similar, and I'm not sure about Morocco. edit: Of course if you have the time you should 100% study some Arabic, especially since you have three months in the region! It will help, especially if you can read a bit. I just would plan on using French day-to-day & so keep most of your focus here Edited by kanewai on 30 October 2012 at 8:09am 4 persons have voted this message useful | |||
| AnneNedjma Newbie Norway Joined 5702 days ago 9 posts - 10 votes Speaks: English Studies: Spanish | Message 3 of 26 30 October 2012 at 11:26am | IP Logged | ||
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kanewai is right, you can get by very well in Algeria by using French. I have spent a few holidays in Annaba,Algeria, where the average citizen speaks French very well. Young people now learn English at school, but can hold a conversation in English. I tried a few words in MSA, but that made people laugh out loud, and they kept on answering in French.
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| Ari Heptaglot Senior Member Norway Joined 6585 days ago 2314 posts - 5695 votes Speaks: Swedish*, English, French, Spanish, Portuguese, Mandarin, Cantonese Studies: Czech, Latin, German | Message 4 of 26 30 October 2012 at 11:36am | IP Logged | ||
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And if you're going next summer you can get a pretty respectable level of French in that time, but you'd likely not get past the basics in Arabic, especially a dialect. For a native English speaker, closely related French with thousands of loan words is in a completely different league from unrelated, notoriously difficult, hard-to-read, diglossic Arabic. Just sayin'.
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| AnneNedjma Newbie Norway Joined 5702 days ago 9 posts - 10 votes Speaks: English Studies: Spanish | Message 5 of 26 30 October 2012 at 2:23pm | IP Logged | ||
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I meant "few can hold a conversation in English"
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| Jappy58 Bilingual Super Polyglot Senior Member United States Joined 4641 days ago 200 posts - 413 votes Speaks: Spanish*, Guarani*, Arabic (Levantine), Arabic (Egyptian), Arabic (Maghribi), Arabic (Written), French, English, Persian, Quechua, Portuguese Studies: Modern Hebrew | Message 6 of 26 31 October 2012 at 12:25am | IP Logged | ||
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Considering that you seem to have time between now and the next summer, I'd opt for French.
I've spent time in Morocco, Algeria, and Tunisia, and in each of these countries, French was usually well understood by the natives, especially in urban areas. I didn't know much French at the time, so I used my knowledge of MSA and the Moroccan dialect to get by, and I was very successful. However, most foreigners who visited did just fine with French. As someone earlier stated, French will be more accessible for you - more cognates, and a more familiar grammar. For the record, Arabic is not really hard to read - learning the script can be done in days, and comprehending texts that would be used for travel would not take much time either - so that is not a reason I'd stay away from Arabic. The main issue with Arabic is that there are few resources for Maghrebi dialects, and even less for those who don't have at least an intermediate knowledge of Arabic. Diglossia definitely plays a role here, especially with the Maghrebi dialects (due to their relatively very distinct pronunciation in relation to MSA and other dialects), and it would take more time than French. In more "ideal" situations, I'd be recommending Arabic. Although French is generally well understood and spoken, it is Arabic that dominates the domestic sphere. In your case, however, I'd recommend French. More accessible and doable in this particular time span. EDIT: I'd like to add that you should still definitely learn some handy Arabic phrases, especially of the dialects. Edited by Jappy58 on 31 October 2012 at 12:26am 2 persons have voted this message useful | |||
| liddytime Pentaglot Senior Member United States mainlymagyar.wordpre Joined 6232 days ago 693 posts - 1328 votes Speaks: English*, Spanish, Italian, Portuguese, Galician Studies: Hungarian, Vietnamese, Modern Hebrew, Norwegian, Persian, Arabic (Written) | Message 7 of 26 31 October 2012 at 2:14am | IP Logged | ||
True. If you really want to try Arabic, do not learn MSA; learn darija. A good friend of mine spent a summer studying in Tunisia and she too told me she was laughed at every time she tried to speak MSA. Also, if you start now you could be at a high level of French by next summer. On the contrary, if you attempt to learn Arabic, I think you could only reach High Beginner/Low Intermediate tops! 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| hrhenry Octoglot Senior Member United States languagehopper.blogs Joined 5133 days ago 1871 posts - 3642 votes Speaks: English*, SpanishC2, ItalianC2, Norwegian, Catalan, Galician, Turkish, Portuguese Studies: Polish, Indonesian, Ojibwe | Message 8 of 26 31 October 2012 at 2:31am | IP Logged | ||
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I've only been to Morocco in North Africa. At the time (in 2007), everything that I
could see as a tourist was done in French first, then, if they were comfortable (not often), in English. The only Arabic I ever heard was between local Moroccans. Even if there was, say, a foreigner that spoke Arabic, when it came to the locals, it reverted to French. I'd definitely go for French, but, as Jappy58 suggested, there's no reason you can't also learn a few pleasantries in the local Arab variant. I think that would be appreciated, but I think they'd probably prefer to speak to you in French, provided you new it. Also, at least in Moroccan cities, the general population is quite well educated. They'll all have had many years of schooling in French. R. == 1 person has voted this message useful |
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