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Platiquemos versus Barrons FSI | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : Language Programs, Books & Tapes |  | |
| Sir Nigel Senior Member United States Joined 7110 days ago 1126 posts - 1102 votes  2 sounds | Message 41 of 51 05 January 2006 at 11:18pm | IP Logged | ||
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No I don't think it's really worth the money. I was suggesting that with the implication that someday, someone posts the FSI Spanish course online for free.
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| frenkeld Diglot Senior Member United States Joined 6949 days ago 2042 posts - 2719 votes Speaks: Russian*, English Studies: German | Message 42 of 51 06 January 2006 at 10:18am | IP Logged | ||
The last two levels of the original FSI Spanish used to be and probably still are available from Learning Spanish Like Crazy as part of their US$97 download-only package, so it is not quite hundreds more. Whether it is worth getting that instead of levels 5-8 of Platiquemos is another story - the opinions in this forum seem somewhat divided on that. It is doubtful, however, that it is worth paying for *both*. 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| luke Diglot Senior Member United States Joined 7211 days ago 3133 posts - 4351 votes Speaks: English*, Spanish Studies: Esperanto, French | Message 43 of 51 06 January 2006 at 4:25pm | IP Logged | ||
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I've heard bits of LSLC's FSI level 3 and 4 and it is head and shoulders above foreignserviceinstitute.com (fsicom) and the non-re-recorded portions of Platiquemos in terms of sound quality. fsicom should definitely be avoided. As discussed above, Platiquemos re-recorded some of the drills (more in the earlier part of the course than in the later, it seems). I'm disappointed with the non-recorded portions of Platiquemos and fsicom. I'm 45, and was in a rock band, so my hearing isn't perfect, though I'm not deaf by any stretch. Having said that, a good bit of fsicom and Platiquemos audio sounds like you're listening to a conversation through a door - muffled. That's a huge disappointment for a language like Spanish where the final 'n' or 's' on a verb are critical keys to what is being said. When I'm listening while commuting, i.e. no book, I may hear three sentences before I can tell for sure they are speaking in the imperative, for instance. (was that ending 'an' or 'en'?) I feel like cussing at the quality of some of the recordings.
LSLC's level 3 and 4 sound very clear and have me excited about the rest of the course. The pdf books are not very easy to read. Summary: Platiquemos has easy to read books, but there are a lot of typos. Some of the audio (say 35%) was recorded by Platiquemos and isn't too bad. Platiquemos has extended recordings of the conversation stimulus, which no one else has. Platiquemos cuts out a few drills and exercises, perhaps 10% of them. Some Platiquemos drills have prompts which are missing in original recordings. This means that the original recordings would need the book to provide a prompt. The recorded dialogs and illustrations have an English translation, which I've found helpful when studying away from the book. foreignserviceinstitute.com is a waste for Spanish. LSLC has FSI levels 3 and 4 and the audio quality is very good. The pdfs are scans of typewritten texts and are difficult to read. LSLC levels 1 and 2 are Programmatic Spanish, rather than FSI Basic Spanish. Only Barrons split up level 1 into many short tracks. I like short tracks. Most tracks are a two or three minutes. Platiquemos tracks are typically 5 - 15 minutes, 6 is about average. fsicom tracks are about 30 minutes long. LSLC tracks may be 30-40 minutes long. So, one unit from each vendor would have approximately: Barrons: 30 tracks fsicom: 2 tracks Platiquemos: 10 tracks LSLC: 1.5 tracks. (some tracks have parts of 2 units). luke edits: 55 tracks If I was to describe where the recordings for the vendors came from, and I'm just making this up: Barrons: Decent recordings, played a bit fast. fsicom: Garage sale. Platiquemos: take home recordings from when the author took the course in the 60s. Stored in a shoe box for 20 years. LSLC: NTIS or possibly audioforum. As far as the source of the recordings, fsicom has a narrator who mentions, "this is the end of unit 30 reel 2", which suggest it's a copy of some form of reel to reel tape, which would be appropriate technology when the course was created. That narrator isn't heard on Barrons, LSLC FSI, or Platiquemos. LSLC FSI tracks are typically 40 minutes or so, suggesting one side of a 90 minute cassette. The narrator will say things like, "This is Basic Spanish advanced level part A and is a continuation of unit 34". This narrator is only heard on LSLC (of the 4 vendors mentioned in this post). Perhaps someone who's heard the audioforum or multilingual books can comment if those courses have the same narrator for the beginning of each tape. This is primarily in the interest of finding where the recordings originated. Platiquemos deleted the portion with the FSI narrator who describes what grammar point each "illustration" covers. That probably saves 20 seconds of recording time per illustration. I find the reminder of what point is being covered helpful when reviewing. One additional note on the speed of the speakers. The first 1/2 of FSI Basic Spanish has one extremely fast speaker. Oddly, he isn't in the second half of the course. Levels 3 and 4 have another speaker who speaks slower and has a tendency to pause for a quarter second or so in the middle of each response. The level 1 and 2 speaker who speaks so fast seldom pauses. So, it's odd that one speaker in the first half of FSI Basic Spanish doesn't pause for commas, and one speaker in the second half of the course pauses when there is no comma. The only decent place to hear the super fast speaker is Barrons FSI. I believe Platiquemos slowed down some of the audio from the original recordings on purpose because "it was too fast". The second edition of level 1 from Barrons was primarily converting the audio to CD and dramatic improvements in book typesetting. The book is still reduced from 8.5x11 to 7x9, but is clearer than the "first" (tape) edition. Does anyone know if the textbooks from audioforum were re-typeset, or are they photocopies as well? I have a used copy of the 2nd Programmatic Spanish book from the US Government printing office that doesn't look too bad, but it's in typewriter font. Edited by luke on 25 January 2006 at 3:48am 2 persons have voted this message useful | |||
| luke Diglot Senior Member United States Joined 7211 days ago 3133 posts - 4351 votes Speaks: English*, Spanish Studies: Esperanto, French | Message 44 of 51 25 January 2006 at 3:42am | IP Logged | ||
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Two of the FSI Spanish books from foreignserviceinstitute.com that I received were bound along the wrong edge. Imagine a normal book that isn't bound along the left hand side, but rather along the top. Each time you turn a page, you have to flip the book over to read it right side up. I took the books to kinkos to have them rebound.
Level 2 book was like Barrons level 2 book, but 8.5 x 11 rather than 7 x 9. The small type is still somewhat blury, but readable. This one had to be rebound. Level 3 book has a lot less of the very small type, and overall is pretty readable. Kinkos may have screwed up when they rebound this book, because units 44 and 45 and part of 43 are missing. fsicom definitely screwed up in having the book bound wrong in the first place. Level 4 book was bound correctly and is not difficult to read. fsicom's website mentions 60 units in the course, but there are only 55. Edited by luke on 25 January 2006 at 3:49am 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| luke Diglot Senior Member United States Joined 7211 days ago 3133 posts - 4351 votes Speaks: English*, Spanish Studies: Esperanto, French | Message 45 of 51 17 April 2006 at 9:13pm | IP Logged | ||
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There's one very odd thing in unit 32. It's a lesson on days and dates. Many of the dates never existed. The original FSI had this problem and Platiquemos kept it. For instance:
Sunday the 17th of January 1986 Sunday the 18th of January 1986 Clear logical errors are all over the date exercises and it's blatantly bothersome. You'd think they would have consulted a calendar. Barring that, at least make things consistent. This is particularly annoying because it's part of a substitution drill, which normally implies you change everything that needs to change. The exercise goes: Sunday the 17th of January 1986 18th You'd expect "Monday", but they use Sunday over which doesn't make any sense. By the way, the 17th and 18th of January 1986 was actually a Friday and Saturday. Edited by luke on 17 April 2006 at 9:17pm 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| crylant Groupie United States cjrylantwealthmanage Joined 7203 days ago 85 posts - 85 votes Speaks: English* Studies: Spanish | Message 46 of 51 19 April 2006 at 5:21pm | IP Logged | ||
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I am working through levels 1 and 2 of FSI Programmatic Spanish from LSLC. I already own levels 3 and 4 of the Basic FSI course from LSLC. My question to you all is, should I purchase and study levels 1-4 of the basic course from Platiquemos before I proceed to levels 3 and 4 of the basic FSI course. Will the Programmatic levels 1 and 2 provide a good enough base to allow me to use use the Basic levels 3 and 4. I have also completed Pimsleur 1 - 3.
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| Sir Nigel Senior Member United States Joined 7110 days ago 1126 posts - 1102 votes 2 sounds | Message 47 of 51 19 April 2006 at 9:09pm | IP Logged | ||
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You should get the extra materials (Platiquemos 1-4). From what I understand there isn't much relation between the Basic and Programmatic courses.
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| Chiboi1983 Groupie United States myspace.com/jaguar98 Joined 6913 days ago 61 posts - 61 votes Speaks: English* Studies: Spanish | Message 48 of 51 29 April 2006 at 9:44pm | IP Logged | ||
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I think I'm about to order Platiquemos from ebay with all levels! I have Barron's level 1 but some of the audio is just to fast for more to comprehend. I guess all programs have positives and negatives! I think I will use and finish Platiquemos then after that order Pimsluer which I hear good things about!
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