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I Hate Michel Thomas | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : Language Programs, Books & Tapes |  | |
| ellasevia Super Polyglot Winner TAC 2011 Senior Member Germany Joined 6141 days ago 2150 posts - 3229 votes  Speaks: English*, German, Croatian, Greek, French, Spanish, Russian, Swedish, Portuguese, Turkish, Italian Studies: Catalan, Persian, Mandarin, Japanese, Romanian, Ukrainian | Message 25 of 61 18 April 2010 at 1:35am | IP Logged | ||
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I have completed the Michel Thomas courses for Italian, German, and Japanese, and am currently working through the Polish one too. I don't have any real complaints about the course and think that it's a really nice and entertaining way to get into a language. In fact, it's a nice way to be able to study when you're on the go or don't have access to the computer or books (if you put it on an MP3 player, which is what I do). The only thing I might bring up is that some of the mistakes that certain students make over and over get a bit annoying (but this can't be helped), and the teacher in the Advanced Japanese course has a really annoying voice.
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| Kugel Senior Member United States Joined 6537 days ago 497 posts - 555 votes Speaks: English* | Message 26 of 61 18 April 2010 at 5:47am | IP Logged | ||
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Transcripts embedded with audio, containing prompts where one can type and/or pronounce the answer, are
needed for transparency regarding effectiveness of the material. Even more, such a method would allow future courses and vocab to be compounded onto each other, making a comprehensive language program viable. The 8 CD and 4 CD sets might be good for making money, but not so for genuine language learning. Just think of all the wasted time and money that goes into marketing and packaging for sometime as little as 4 or 8 hours of instruction. Madrigal's famous Spanish language book is more clever in its way of teaching Spanish than MT's, but it wasn't done via audio with prompts. Other language books share the same problem. Really, the MT content isn't mind-blowing stuff if you really look at the big picture and see the transcripts laid out in front of you. Edited by Kugel on 18 April 2010 at 5:50am 3 persons have voted this message useful | |||
| Cainntear Pentaglot Senior Member Scotland linguafrankly.blogsp Joined 6010 days ago 4399 posts - 7687 votes Speaks: Lowland Scots, English*, French, Spanish, Scottish Gaelic Studies: Catalan, Italian, German, Irish, Welsh | Message 27 of 61 18 April 2010 at 12:19pm | IP Logged | ||
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Kugel, I completely disagree with you. Once you give a student printed material you lose control of the learning process. I firmly believe that at an early stage of learning, the teacher should be in full control to allow the student to start with a firm and unambiguous grounding in the language.
The Thomas course is designed to replicate and replace a language class, not a language textbook. 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Kugel Senior Member United States Joined 6537 days ago 497 posts - 555 votes Speaks: English* | Message 28 of 61 18 April 2010 at 7:54pm | IP Logged | ||
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Caintear, until someone does a study comparing the two methods, can we really say which one is better? We can all
provide reasons for our arguments until the cows come home, but will it really mean anything at the end of the day? The owners of the MT method are the only ones who are allowed to move the content to a web based prompt/answer format, which ideally would be full of audio and transcripts. The same goes for Pimsleur or any audio based program. And why does it matter if the MT course replicates a class or a book? Both are inferior because class lectures often don't amount to anything when it comes to activities like languages or Math, as both are meant to be done by the learner, not the teacher/professor/lecturer. The 2 student:1 teacher ratio just isn't allowed at an educational institute, at least not a public one. And as for a book, it doesn't allow active participation. 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Cainntear Pentaglot Senior Member Scotland linguafrankly.blogsp Joined 6010 days ago 4399 posts - 7687 votes Speaks: Lowland Scots, English*, French, Spanish, Scottish Gaelic Studies: Catalan, Italian, German, Irish, Welsh | Message 29 of 61 18 April 2010 at 9:44pm | IP Logged | ||
Go for it. Give a reason. 3 persons have voted this message useful | |||
| josht Diglot Senior Member United States Joined 6445 days ago 635 posts - 857 votes Speaks: English*, German Studies: French, Spanish, Russian, Dutch | Message 30 of 61 18 April 2010 at 10:04pm | IP Logged | ||
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I wonder if there is a formula somewhere which shows just how long it takes Cainntear to go on the offensive once "Michel Thomas" shows up in a thread. Beat that poor horse; beat it until it is good and mushy.
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| William Camden Hexaglot Senior Member United Kingdom Joined 6271 days ago 1936 posts - 2333 votes Speaks: English*, German, Spanish, Russian, Turkish, French | Message 31 of 61 19 April 2010 at 1:37pm | IP Logged | ||
FSI covers a lot of material and does use native speakers. As to the boredom, I don't think anyone learned a language or any other intellectual discipline without a certain amount of grim tedium being got through first. I only have limited experience of MT and was not impressed, but that is perhaps unfair. In the UK at least, MT is marketed at people who don't like writing stuff down, whereas I am a near-obsessive keeper of notebooks etc. 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Spanky Senior Member Canada Joined 5955 days ago 1021 posts - 1714 votes Studies: French | Message 32 of 61 20 April 2010 at 5:22am | IP Logged | ||
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I am a fan of the Michel Thomas courses I have worked through (French and German). In saying this, I include pronunciation issues, which is something that tends to be disparaged concerning Thomas on this board.
I have read a number of comments over the last two years that Thomas may not have as good an accent in various of his languages as the speakers in other audio-based courses like Pimsleur. However, I found it very helpful hearing Thomas correct his student's mispronunciations, as it is a better prompt (for me at least) to question whether I am getting the pronunciation right, especially with the German courses. There is a bit of this in FSI Basic French, where right and wrong pronunciations are presented for contrast in some of the drills, but generally this is not a feature of audio-based courses like Pimsleur. Edited by Spanky on 20 April 2010 at 5:22am 2 persons have voted this message useful |
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