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TAC 2011 Team あ g-bod and 日本語 | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : Language Learning Log |  | |
| g-bod Diglot Senior Member United KingdomRegistered users can see my Skype Name Joined 5980 days ago 1485 posts - 2002 votes  Speaks: English*, Japanese Studies: French, German | Message 1 of 82 22 December 2010 at 12:06am | IP Logged |
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I hope it's not premature to start my log before 27th December, but as I am currently a one-language-only person, I guess I will stay in Team あ
I have been studying Japanese for about two and a half years now. I fit this around working full time and doing a part time MSc (which I am due to finish December 2011) so this limits how much time and energy I have to devote to Japanese, particularly at certain times of the year. Overall, I would like to make the most of the time that I do have to devote to Japanese, in order to progress as well as possible within the constraints of real life, but at the same time make sure that I have fun with the language. I'm not very comfortable self-assessing using the CEFR levels but I have a bit more familiarity with the JLPT standards. I recently ran through the sample test questions for N4 and N3. I was very comfortable with N4 (apart from a stupid mistake on one listening question) but I felt stretched by N3, with marked weaknesses in the vocabulary and listening sections. I would like to finish 2011 feeling comfortable with N2 questions, although I have no aspirations to sit the exam this year as my dissertation submission date falls very close to the exam date and I don't want to feel compromised at this crucial time. Although I am referring to JLPT levels as a benchmark, I do not want to spend the year studying to pass the test; my intention is to spend the year improving my Japanese in a well-rounded way (not neglecting writing and speaking) to the extent that as a result, I feel comfortable answering test questions at that level. I will now set out some of the materials and strategies etc I am currently using or intend to use in the near future Kanji in Context I have switched to using this book to give a structured approach to learning to write and recognise the most common kanji. I have already worked through most of Basic Kanji Book, and can recognise and write around 450 kanji in around 2,300 words (well, that's what I have on Anki). Kanji in Context starts again from 一 but it has a lot more vocabulary. I have covered the first 202 kanji in the reference book to date. If I covered 5 a day I could have the whole lot done by Christmas next year, but I think then my focus would be too much kanji at the expense of other things. However, I think I should perhaps aim to get around 1,000 kanji covered, which would double my current level. Japanese for Busy People I bought books 2 and 3 when I was getting fed up with Genki last year, but in the end, after a few months of inertia, decided to plough on with Genki despite its weaknesses, so I could at least start to get to grips with things like respect language, passive and causative forms (and I'm so glad I did too - these forms pop up all the time and yet textbooks like to keep them until the very end). But as I have already picked up that I have a weakness in vocabulary and listening, I will work through these books to pick up new words and work through the listening passages, but will largely ignore the grammar and reading sections, unless I spot something interesting. Grammar - 完全マスター I have been dabbling with different ways of using the 完全マスター grammar book which I bought over a year ago for the old JLPT 3級 in order to reinforce the grammar I have already learned, and I haven't settled on a method I am happy with yet, but I will leave this here and update if there are any developments. Reading Thanks to my still narrow vocabulary, I haven't found many options for extensive reading apart from the manga よつばと and the Japanese Graded Readers series - I have just started looking at the Level 3 readers here - so I will carry on doing some extensive reading with these. Also, some articles on Yahoo Kids News I can read extensively (I'm not sure if it counts as extensive as it's only a paragraph) but this depends on the subject matter. I want to fit in more intensive reading (ie. using reading to pick up lots of vocabulary, which then gets turned into flashcards) but I find it quite tiring. For now I will stick to those articles on Yahoo Kids News that have too much unknown vocabulary in to catch the jist of, and the manga Nana, which I have been reading in English translation anyway, and I am about 5 pages in on the Japanese version. I also picked up the 実力アップ reading book for N3 which I will be doing some intensive reading with. Listening practice (or entertainment!) I will try to have contact with the spoken language on a regular basis. I watch Japanese TV dramas quite regularly now. I find watching with subtitles can be useful as long as I make the effort to pay attention to what I am hearing, rather than just the text on the screen. I will also try and listen to some Japanese radio on Keyhole TV and various podcasts. Writing I have neglected writing for quite some time and I think I need to adress this. Now, thanks to finishing Genki, I have a reasonable overview of the basic features of Japanese grammar, I need to make sure that I put my knowledge into practice on a regular basis. One of my exchange partners has made it very clear that he would be pleased to read and correct emails from me in Japanese so I should really start to take advantage of this. Also I think I should commit to using Lang-8 much more often - perhaps on a weekly basis. Speaking By far my weakest skill, although working on vocabulary and listening should surely help with this. I have finally found a couple of reliable skype partners who I meet with regularly online however their English is a lot better than my Japanese and therefore English tends to dominate the conversation. So I really need to make the effort to start using Japanese more. Having written quite a bit now about my good intentions, I don't want to spend more time logging than I am actually studying, but I will try to add an update every week or so and check in on how the rest of Team あ is doing. Edits 22 Jan 2011 - combined "Extensive Reading" and "Intensive Reading" into a single "Reading" section. Edited by g-bod on 22 January 2011 at 1:20pm 1 person has voted this message useful | |
| Arekkusu Hexaglot Senior Member Canada bit.ly/qc_10_lec Joined 5379 days ago 3971 posts - 7747 votes Speaks: English, French*, GermanC1, Spanish, Japanese, Esperanto Studies: Italian, Norwegian, Mandarin, Romanian, Estonian | Message 2 of 82 22 December 2010 at 1:24am | IP Logged |
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Hi g-bod!
I started Japanese in Aug. 2008, probably around the same time as you. I'm looking forward to seeing more entries from you! 1 person has voted this message useful | |
 budonoseito Pro Member United States budobeyondtechnRegistered users can see my Skype Name Joined 5803 days ago 261 posts - 344 votes Studies: French, Japanese Personal Language Map | Message 3 of 82 26 December 2010 at 6:09pm | IP Logged |
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Hi g-bod. Sounds like a good plan to get started.
1 person has voted this message useful | |
| g-bod Diglot Senior Member United KingdomRegistered users can see my Skype Name Joined 5980 days ago 1485 posts - 2002 votes Speaks: English*, Japanese Studies: French, German | Message 4 of 82 26 December 2010 at 11:31pm | IP Logged |
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Here is my first update since last Tuesday. Despite my desire to avoid 2011 becoming
the year of the kanji, that has been the focus of this week. I think perhaps I will keep to the headings in my original post to set out what I have been doing. Kanji in Context I have ploughed through Level 1 of the reference book, finishing adding the compounds to anki from it this evening, so now have the first 250 kanji covered (in 2425 words). So far this has only covered kanji I am already familiar with, so it is just a case of expanding my vocabulary a little, but flicking through to Level 2 it seems to be around a 50/50 mix between familiar and new kanji, so I think my rate of working through this will be somewhat slower. I have also given some thought to how best to use the workbooks which accompany the series - which basically consist of pages and pages of example sentences - but have yet to decide on the best approach. A few weeks ago I tried making flashcards with them but this was time consuming and reviewing the flashcards has not helped. I am thinking about perhaps doing a mix of translation and a scriptorium type approach but have yet to make a decision about this. Japanese for Busy People Grammar - 完全マスター Extensive Reading Intensive Reading Nothing to report on any of these this week! Listening Practice I watched a couple of episodes of the drama Bloody Monday but it's not really appealing to me, I think I tend to prefer comedies. I also listened to a couple of episodes of a podcast called Nana Life which seems to focus on lifestyle things for women - I've picked up a few bits about cookery and aromatherapy (I think). The podcasts are very short, which is the main reason I have listened to them and I think the presenter has quite a nice voice! Writing Nothing to report here Speaking Because of the time difference most of my language exchange happens at the weekend. Due to Christmas and New Year falling at the weekend this year I haven't made any arrangements to voice chat over the holidays - will be starting back with this in the new year! I have quite a substantial assignment for university due in the middle of January so I am not expecting to achieve very much with Japanese over the next couple of weeks. 1 person has voted this message useful | |
| Luai_lashire Diglot Senior Member United States luai-lashire.deviant Joined 5826 days ago 384 posts - 560 votes Speaks: English*, Esperanto Studies: Japanese, French | Message 5 of 82 27 December 2010 at 2:11am | IP Logged |
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Hi g-bod! I'm on team あ as well. :) I started Japanese in 2008 as well, but I was studying it in highschool so
perhaps didn't make as much progress as you may have.... I self-studied this year and I think have slightly higher listening skills/larger vocabulary than you but less reading ability, so we come out on around the same level! ;) I've heard good things about Kanji in Context. Do you think it would be valuable for me to work through it after finishing the first Heisig book? Good luck with your studies! :) 頑張ってね〜！ 1 person has voted this message useful | |
| g-bod Diglot Senior Member United KingdomRegistered users can see my Skype Name Joined 5980 days ago 1485 posts - 2002 votes Speaks: English*, Japanese Studies: French, German | Message 6 of 82 27 December 2010 at 2:03pm | IP Logged |
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Hi Luai_lashire - I know a couple of people who started Japanese at the same time as me
now and I always find it funny how our strengths and weaknesses are so different - I often think if only we could combine our strengths into one person we would be an ultimate Japanese learning champion! I have never used Heisig - a scan through his introduction and first couple of chapters was enough to put me off for good - so I'm not sure how well your current approach to kanji would integrate with Kanji in Context. Also, I don't think I've spent enough time with Kanji in Context myself to give it a fair assessment either way, but I will try to set out my impressions so far. Kanji in Context consists of three books - a reference book and two workbooks. The reference book basically sets out the kanji in the order that they think is best to learn them, grouped in chapters, gives the on and kun readings as set out in the jouyou kanji specification, and then gives you a word list for each kanji, including the reading and an English definition. Some words are marked out as specialist or advanced vocabulary. The workbooks are also grouped in chapters which match the chapters in the reference book. Most chapters fit onto two pages and are split into three sections. The first two sections give a few key vocabulary words and phrases that the authors think are particularly important to know (although they never tell you why - in some cases it is obvious, e.g. unusual readings, antonyms etc, but not always). The third section gives the example sentences showing the usage of words listed in the reference book (but this avoids the specialist or advanced words marked up in the reference book). There is no English and no translations of the material in the workbooks at all. How you use these books is completely up to you - there are no practice exercises or extended reading passages. Essentially all it gives you is a suggested order in which to learn the kanji and vocabulary and a substantial list of example sentences that you can use as you see fit. I already have a system which works for me for learning how to read and write compounds, so I am finding the reference book useful, but I still don't know what to do to make best use of the example sentences. I think the final and perhaps most important point is that Kanji in Context expects you to have some kanji knowledge and a thorough grounding in Japanese grammar before you start using it - which I think is roughly commensurate with the grammar/vocab/kanji expectations set out in the old specification for JLPT 3級. I think this is particularly important because the example sentences do not have translations, and things such as the passive, honorific/humble language, and some newspaper-style conventions, appear right from the beginning. A number of times I have had to ask my exchange partners for help in translating (or at least help understanding) the sentences - and even though their English is much stronger than my Japanese we still have difficulty with some of them! I'll finish with some of the example sentences I've looked at so far, from the first three chapters: 昔は、スポーツをして汗をかいた後でも水分 をとってはいけないと言われていた。 ただ今、来客中ですので、後ほどこちらから お電話さしあげます。 自分は偉いと思って人を見下しているとその うち逆に他の人から見下されるようになる。 公害問題でよく知られている水俣病は、水銀 が原因で起こった病気である。 1 person has voted this message useful | |
| g-bod Diglot Senior Member United KingdomRegistered users can see my Skype Name Joined 5980 days ago 1485 posts - 2002 votes Speaks: English*, Japanese Studies: French, German | Message 7 of 82 01 January 2011 at 8:27pm | IP Logged |
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A mixture of illness and sulking has left me behind on my Anki decks for the first time
in a long time - I skipped reviewing them on Thursday and Friday and when I loaded it up at lunchtime I had around 450 cards waiting for me! I keep the session limit on Anki to 50 cards or 10 minutes and although usually I just plough through until the end I have been breaking up the reviews across the afternoon today to make it more manageable. Kanji in Context I now have added compounds to Anki up to kanji no. 275. This week that has included learning to write 15 new kanji for me as well. I now have 2480 facts and 642 unique kanji in the deck. Japanese for Busy People Nothing to report Grammar - 完全マスター Nothing to report Extensive reading I finished reading Vol. 2 of よつばと. I read this once before, about 18 months ago and I think it's great for a beginner because it's all simple, every day scenarios and the story is quite obvious just from the pictures, but I'm pleased to see that I'm understanding much more from the text now. For each chapter I may need to turn to the dictionary, but only a few times and if I can't be bothered I don't seem to miss out. If only reading all manga was this easy! Intensive reading Nothing to report Listening practice This week I have watched quite a few episodes of Hanazakari no Kimitachi e. I get the impression that this was quite a popular drama but I think I am perhaps getting a bit old for high school romance now. I don't mind watching it, but I wouldn't have bothered if it wasn't in Japanese. I also listened to one of the JapanesePod101 podcasts. I am loosely following the Beginner Season 1, which after 100 or so episodes doesn't really feel like beginner level any more, although there is still too much English (and irritating self promotion) in the discussion. But I like listening to the dialogues as normally I can understand all but one or two words, which is both educational and morale-boosting. Writing Nothing to report Speaking Nothing to report 1 person has voted this message useful | |
| g-bod Diglot Senior Member United KingdomRegistered users can see my Skype Name Joined 5980 days ago 1485 posts - 2002 votes Speaks: English*, Japanese Studies: French, German | Message 8 of 82 08 January 2011 at 3:07pm | IP Logged |
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レポートの締め切りは来週の金曜日なので、 日本語の勉強のために時間がありません。My assignment is due next
Friday, so I don't have any time for studying Japanese right now (although I'm itching to do more - I always have my priorities wrong). I got up to kanji number 300 in KiC on the 4th Jan but haven't made any additions since. I have switched to "maintenance mode" - reviewing flashcards every day, reading a little bit of easy manga (but not much) and trying to remember to put the radio on via Keyhole TV when I'm studying at the computer, but that's it. It's only one week of my life though and once this assignment is done I can look forward to a few weeks with no responsibilities beyond the day job - time to make progress then. 1 person has voted this message useful |
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