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 Language Learning Forum : Language Learning Log |  | |
| g-bod Diglot Senior Member United KingdomRegistered users can see my Skype Name Joined 5973 days ago 1485 posts - 2002 votes  Speaks: English*, Japanese Studies: French, German | Message 9 of 27 11 September 2011 at 11:30pm | IP Logged |
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Yes, in terms of the political issue I want to make it clear that it is political in the sense that it relates to national identity, but I mean it in a very personal way (that is, how I define my own identity). I might have been born in England but I feel like I belong right here in Cardiff!
I have heard secondhand stories about negative attitudes from Welsh speakers (usually from monolingual English people who probably have their own political axe to grind) but my firsthand experience has been nothing but positive and I agree with you entirely on the goodwill thing. I think it will be interesting to see what happens with the Welsh language over the next couple of decades, as more and more people come through the school system, like yourself, able to speak and understand a bit of the language. I think the real flaw with compulsory language education in the UK is that expectations at GCSE level (in any subject, not just languages) are simply not high enough and then languages tend to get dropped when you join sixth form and are forced to specialise in a very small number of subjects. If you study a language to A level (and aren't quite as lazy a student as I was) you should come out with a reasonable intermediate ability. But most people walk away with their A grade GCSE, lamenting their poor ability and convincing themselves that actually they are no good at languages when the truth is they've never really tried. At my local branch library they had a stack of the Cwrs Mynediad/Cwrs Sylfaen textbooks. They seem to come with a warning that they should be used in a class, with a tutor (which is worrying for any textbook aimed at adults) and a flick through seemed like they were grammar light and vocabulary heavy. If I do take the plunge I think I will just go with Colloquial Welsh (sitting on my bookshelf already) and the BBC Catchphrase series to start with. But it might be nice if they have things like unabridged Welsh audiobooks and the like. 1 person has voted this message useful | |
| Alexander86 Tetraglot Senior Member United Kingdom alanguagediary.blogs Joined 4972 days ago 224 posts - 323 votes Speaks: English*, Spanish, German, Catalan Studies: Swedish | Message 10 of 27 12 September 2011 at 1:04pm | IP Logged |
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The heady mix of identity - politics - language. It is very much a personal issue.
On a side note, I feel less 'at home' here in Cardiff than where I grew up (North Wales, near Ruthin). The thing I find most strange is I hardly ever hear Welsh here! In the capital! But that's another matter, which doesn't exactly help us to learn a language when we see it but don't hear it. I think someone with an A level in the language should have basic fluency, we need to change expectations, have immersion classes (our French teachers explained French to us in English.. hmm...) and show people how easy languages can be with a bit of determination & innovation. I've look at the Mynediad courses too and I was taken aback to see that they were for class only... Not exactly a way to encourage Welsh learning for people who can't, or don't want to go to a course. As I said when I started this blog I'm going to start with the Colloquial Welsh, but there's a few audio things in the Cardiff Central Library that I will be using. One, for instance, is the 'Hands-free Welsh' course, which although extremely simple, let's you hear the language - which for me is paramount (I normally start my languages with MT). 1 person has voted this message useful | |
| g-bod Diglot Senior Member United KingdomRegistered users can see my Skype Name Joined 5973 days ago 1485 posts - 2002 votes Speaks: English*, Japanese Studies: French, German | Message 11 of 27 12 September 2011 at 1:53pm | IP Logged |
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I would expect someone with an A grade A level French to have some kind of basic fluency and I think this is reasonable. My French classes at A level generally involved the teacher explaining things first in French and then in English which I think is the best approach at this level as it increases exposure without the risk of misunderstanding fundamental points.
I am lucky to live in an area where Welsh speakers are a bit more concentrated. I get particularly excited when I hear kids using it with each other and I think this is a good sign of the health of a language. I think the real challenge for Welsh is the lack of materials, particularly for self study. I think I could use the cwrs mynediad as a supplement to mine for vocabulary but that's about it. I also don't like the way Welsh courses are organised here and they all seem to follow the same format. 1 person has voted this message useful | |
| Alexander86 Tetraglot Senior Member United Kingdom alanguagediary.blogs Joined 4972 days ago 224 posts - 323 votes Speaks: English*, Spanish, German, Catalan Studies: Swedish | Message 12 of 27 12 September 2011 at 7:30pm | IP Logged |
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Yeah, they have generalised Welsh classes in order to achieve harmonisation - but if it's
not the right course then that's pretty useless! I've looked at the ones on offer around Cardiff but they either seem to be too slow (7 years til fluency!) or too expensive. Which is why I'm going for the self-study route, at least for now. And in terms of my language learning today... I listened to Radio Cymru today which allowed me to hear words, verbs and such like which I could then remember. It's quite cool to have stopped studying Welsh at 16 and yet still retain a semblance of understanding - I'm looking forward to turning that understanding into something more profound. Gonna go pick up my Welsh materials tomorrow, and then it's all steam ahead! 1 person has voted this message useful | |
| Alexander86 Tetraglot Senior Member United Kingdom alanguagediary.blogs Joined 4972 days ago 224 posts - 323 votes Speaks: English*, Spanish, German, Catalan Studies: Swedish | Message 13 of 27 14 September 2011 at 11:26am | IP Logged |
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So did 30 minutes of Catalan yesterday and another 30 minutes today. I know my sessions could be longer, but I
want to do things as frequently as possible, and in short bite-size chunks too! It's going really well, I'm feeling good in Catalan and everything is making sense so far. I guess it'll only get more difficult when I actually start speaking it and move from passive to active, as I can already read pretty well in the language. Gonna start my Welsh tomorrow when I finally get a chance to go to the library... I know that my Welsh needs more work because it's such a different language to the other ones I speak - but that's all the more fun, right? Now I'm off to go cycle up Caerphilly Mountain and watch the Tour of Britain. Adéu! 1 person has voted this message useful | |
| Alexander86 Tetraglot Senior Member United Kingdom alanguagediary.blogs Joined 4972 days ago 224 posts - 323 votes Speaks: English*, Spanish, German, Catalan Studies: Swedish | Message 14 of 27 16 September 2011 at 11:35am | IP Logged |
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Note to self:
I've lived here too long not to speak the language. I cannot conceivably call myself Welsh if I do not make an extended effort to learn Welsh. All that I love about Wales is mostly synonymous with the areas where Welsh is most spoken. So yesterday I started the 'Colloquial Welsh' series, and it was a bit of a false start. I opened the book, started burning the CD's to my hard drive and... I don't know. I guess I realised the long hard slog that lay ahead? Or maybe I realised that I should have done this long ago. Anyway, I did little more than 20 minutes before closing the book, and turning to read something else... Not great... But then today, I opened the book, started again and went through 45 minutes of grammar, phrases, conversations and it felt much better. Although I think I'll have to tailor my Welsh learning to the interests I have and the use I want out of it (conversational and reading), I think I will make good progress. One issue is that although when I lived in North Wales I heard Welsh all the time, here I do not hear it at all. In the capital city!!! Not a word... It's strange, but that's history and if I learn it, then I am helping, in some small way. I'll do another 45 minutes this afternoon. The good thing is that it felt familiar, words came back to me from my classes at school and it didn't feel like starting Russian or Finnish would. But Welsh still isn't an 'easy' language. But then, who cares? I will learn it. Just as I have learnt Spanish and German. Hwyl nawr! 1 person has voted this message useful | |
| Alexander86 Tetraglot Senior Member United Kingdom alanguagediary.blogs Joined 4972 days ago 224 posts - 323 votes Speaks: English*, Spanish, German, Catalan Studies: Swedish | Message 15 of 27 16 September 2011 at 11:39am | IP Logged |
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Some of today's phrases:
Alex dw i. Beth ydy'ch gwaith chi? Pwy ydy hwn? Beth ydy hwn yn Gymraeg? (a very useful phrase!) S'mae? Iawn, diolch. Gweddol (sounds so good when you mix that double 'd'). Dim yn ddrwg... I'r amgueddfa. Gyda'r bara... Hwyl! 2 persons have voted this message useful | |
| g-bod Diglot Senior Member United KingdomRegistered users can see my Skype Name Joined 5973 days ago 1485 posts - 2002 votes Speaks: English*, Japanese Studies: French, German | Message 16 of 27 16 September 2011 at 1:48pm | IP Logged |
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There is Welsh in Cardiff but the distribution is not even. Broadly speaking if you head west there are more Welsh speakers. Much less Welsh in the eastern suburbs, the areas around the university and with a high student population (to be expected) and the areas to the south with large immigrant communities (also to be expected). Perhaps you should start hanging out in more Welsh speaking pubs like the Mochyn Du.
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