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Two questions about German Dative | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : Specific Languages |  | |
| Tollpatchig Senior Member United States Joined 4007 days ago 161 posts - 210 votes  Speaks: English* Studies: German, Maltese | Message 1 of 5 16 March 2014 at 7:12pm | IP Logged | |||||
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In my Grammar book there are two uses of the Dative that I don't quite understand how t
use or what they really are. The Benefactive Dative which the book says that it can indicate a person on whose behalf the action is done. I understand this part and the examples given Sie schreib mir seine Adresse auf. Ich habe ihr die Tuer geoeffnet. What I dont understand is this one. The book says: In this benefactive sense a dative reflexive pronoun is common in idiomatic coll speech if a physical action is involved The example given is: 'Ich will mir das Buch anschauen." I want to go and look at that book. I don't really see where the 'to go' part comes from and how the sentence conveys that. Another use it talks about is the 'dative of disadvantage' which it describes as indicating a person who is affected by something undesirable happening to the person or thing which is the subject of the direct object of the verb. The example given is: 'Mir is Grossmutters Vase kaputtgegangen.' Grandmother's vase broke on me. I don't get the concept at all and the translation isn't clear to me. Does the speaker mean the vase literally broke on him as in landing on his head and shattering or does it mean 'broke on me' in the sense of 'I was moving it, accidentally bumped it on the table and the damn thing broke on me!' 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| tarvos Super Polyglot Winner TAC 2012 Senior Member China likeapolyglot.wordpr Joined 4707 days ago 5310 posts - 9399 votes Speaks: Dutch*, English, Swedish, French, Russian, German, Italian, Norwegian, Mandarin, Romanian, Afrikaans Studies: Greek, Modern Hebrew, Spanish, Portuguese, Czech, Korean, Esperanto, Finnish | Message 2 of 5 16 March 2014 at 8:41pm | IP Logged | |||||
Phrases with will, although they are a present tense construction, often imply a future. In German you can often replace a future with a present tense without much ado. Actually, you can do that in practically all Germanic languages. The English translation requires "to go" to more accurately reflect that nuance. Verbs with "want" often imply a future anyways because something you want is something you haven't done yet.
It means it broke while I was handling it. It has nothing to do with physically breaking on someone's head. Edited by tarvos on 16 March 2014 at 8:42pm 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| Cabaire Senior Member Germany Joined 5599 days ago 725 posts - 1352 votes | Message 3 of 5 16 March 2014 at 11:24pm | IP Logged | |||||
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"Mir ist Großmutters Vase kaputtgegangen" means "It happened to me" (and it was to my disadvantage) "that granny's vase broke".
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| Doitsujin Diglot Senior Member Germany Joined 5320 days ago 1256 posts - 2363 votes Speaks: German*, English | Message 4 of 5 16 March 2014 at 11:45pm | IP Logged | |||||
IMHO, the explanation given in your book is too complicated and "to go and look" is an overtranslation. The equivalent English sentence is more something like "I'd really like to have a look at that book." (German "will" is actually more like English "must.") Basically, all you have to know is that some German verbs require a dummy reflexive pronoun that you can ignore when translating from German to English. BTW, this structure also exists in English: "I'm going to buy me a new PC." 3 persons have voted this message useful | ||||||
| Cabaire Senior Member Germany Joined 5599 days ago 725 posts - 1352 votes | Message 5 of 5 17 March 2014 at 1:05am | IP Logged | |||||
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If I think about it, you can use the "Mir ist (noun) (participle)" construction for nearly every woeful incident in your life:
Mir ist die Mutter gestorben. Mir ist das Haus abgebrannt. Mir ist der Hund abgehauen. Mir ist der Freund durchgebrannt. Mir ist das Auto kaputtgegangen. Mir ist die Waschmaschine ausgelaufen. Mir ist das Essen angebrannt. Mir ist die Katze verhungert. Mir ist das Geld ausgegangen. But rarely for good things: Mir ist das Gemälde gelungen. 3 persons have voted this message useful |
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