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Being forced to learn a minority language | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : General discussion |  | |
| hribecek Triglot Senior Member Czech Republic Joined 5340 days ago 1243 posts - 1458 votes  Speaks: English*, Czech, Spanish Studies: Italian, Polish, Slovak, Hungarian, Toki Pona, Russian | Message 1 of 42 25 May 2011 at 7:58pm | IP Logged |
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I have a new Russian acquaintance and I've been relishing the opportunity to find out lots of information about her homeland and languages. She's from the Komi Republic near the Ural mountains on the European side and she told me that there it's compulsory for all school-goers to learn Komi and has been for many years. There are 1 million people in the state and only 25% of them are Komis and a lot less of them are Komi native speakers but still everybody has to learn it even though most never get the opportunity to use it.
She said that there are national Komi language competitions for children, a TV channel and so on. She hates this law and says that most people do because Komi speakers only live 'in the forests near the mountains'. Personally I was very surprised to hear that Russia is so supportive of its minority languages. She says it's the same in most of Russia. I think it's great that so many languages are being supported and protected in such a big country, but I'm biased as a language lover and I completely understand her opinion too. Any opinions? Edited by hribecek on 26 May 2011 at 6:09pm 2 persons have voted this message useful | |
| Lianne Senior Member Canada thetoweringpile.blog Joined 5106 days ago 284 posts - 410 votes Speaks: English* Studies: Esperanto, Toki Pona, German, French | Message 2 of 42 25 May 2011 at 8:16pm | IP Logged |
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I think it's great to do anything possible to protect a language that could become endangered. The perspective I'm coming from is living in Canada, where there are many extinct or endangered Aboriginal languages. I'm not Aboriginal myself, but I know that many of them are worried about losing their languages, and from a language-lover's point of view I'm worried too. At some point I would like to learn one of them, but they are reeeeeally hard, and it can be difficult to find resources. So I think it would be cool if one were taught in schools here.
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| Chung Diglot Senior Member Joined 7147 days ago 4228 posts - 8259 votes 20 sounds Speaks: English*, French Studies: Polish, Slovak, Uzbek, Turkish, Korean, Finnish | Message 3 of 42 25 May 2011 at 8:38pm | IP Logged |
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This is very interesting. Up until now I've only heard that these minority languages are under societal or institutional pressure, and it's perfectly understandable to the point where I don't dump on the central government (in this case the Russian one) for favouring Russian over the other language even if this trend indirectly but slowly squeezes out the minority language.
I have mixed feelings about this since I'm more in favour of offering some choice in language instruction rather than rigid imposition thus leaving no choice for the prospective students. If I were running the show in Komi Republic, I would keep Russian as the primary language of instruction while being flexible in offering English or Komi and if the budget permits, one or two other major languages that I can't settle on at the moment (e.g. Arabic, French, German, Mandarin, Spanish). Your acquaintance's negative impression isn't good for the long-run but imposing instruction in a foreign language whose utility is questionable or highly dependent on location (i.e. she'd need to spend a good part of her life among Komis to get substantial benefits) is not the way to go. I'm also thinking of what I've seen in Canada (French lessons are mandatory for all Canadian pupils (it starts in primary school) even though you're more likely to hear a Chinese language rather than French on a randomly-chosen street in Canada outside Quebec), the USA (Spanish lessons for American students) and Finland (Finnish Finns get mandatory instruction in Swedish, even though Swedish Finns comprise about 5.5% of the population). In these instances proficiency in French, Spanish or Swedish varies widely (useless to professionally fluent) and not a few Canadians, Americans and Finns seem to come out with negative experiences in learning foreign languages generally because their big reference point was forced instruction for a "useless" language while living in a time when English is omnipresent or knowledge of the native language was substantially more applicable. 3 persons have voted this message useful | |
| Cainntear Pentaglot Senior Member Scotland linguafrankly.blogsp Joined 6002 days ago 4399 posts - 7687 votes Speaks: Lowland Scots, English*, French, Spanish, Scottish Gaelic Studies: Catalan, Italian, German, Irish, Welsh | Message 4 of 42 25 May 2011 at 9:54pm | IP Logged |
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The Russian Federation is at risk from nationalism in many of its territories (consider Chechnya etc), and language is often a vehicle for nationalism.
A central government that supports linguistic diversity diffuses the appeal of seperatism. And what's the downside? The Russians who live in the Komi Republic object, but there would be no logic in splitting off from Russia in order to speak Russian. Remember also that Russian speakers were planted there by the USSR in order form a majority and stabilise the area, preventing seperatism. Many of them may be settled, but as I understand it a substantial number of them were actually born in Russia proper. Nobody's asking them to leave, just to integrate with Komi society rather than force the Komi to integrate into Russian society. Surely it's only good manners? 9 persons have voted this message useful | |
| nway Senior Member United States youtube.com/user/Vic Joined 5406 days ago 574 posts - 1707 votes Speaks: English* Studies: Spanish, Mandarin, Japanese, Korean | Message 5 of 42 25 May 2011 at 10:01pm | IP Logged |
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It's indeed a fair tradeoff, given that one linguistically distinct cultural group (in this case, Russian) doesn't have much legitimacy to rule over the homeland of another linguistically distinct cultural group (in this case, Komi). It's the "price to pay" for Russia's geographic magnitude, so to speak.
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| kyssäkaali Diglot Senior Member United States Joined 5544 days ago 203 posts - 376 votes Speaks: English*, Finnish | Message 6 of 42 25 May 2011 at 11:04pm | IP Logged |
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Being forced to learn a language in this way though (in school) creates resentment for the language in question and achieves the opposite of what it was going for. The situation is the same in Finland, where Swedish is forced upon all children throughout the entire country despite Swedish only being spoken in a southwestern pocket of the country AND the fact that they all know Finnish too. Rather than churning out fluent Swedish speakers and a bilingual country, this Pakkoruotsi has produced incredible resentment and prejudice towards Swedish-speaking Finns and their language. It's really sad. I'd imagine it's quite the same in Russia, especially considering your friend in question who "hates" that she has to learn Komi and claims only bumpkins in the forest speak it. A huge problem in Finland is that students are never really given a clear reason for why they have to learn Swedish, so they basically spend years dragging themselves through the study of a language they couldn't possibly care less about. I'd be pissed too if I was forced to learn a language that I didn't want to. What a waste of time.
The best option is to offer the OPPORTUNITY to learn Komi, Swedish or whatever, advertise it well and give GOOD reasons for why it is a good idea to learn them, and people will come on their own accord. Offer the courses for free if you have to, and invite people of all ages... make it enjoyable. Just as languages shouldn't be forced into extinction, they shouldn't be forced out of/away from it either -- there are better and more effective ways to do this. It's nice and all that Russia isn't totally ignoring these little languages/pretending they don't exist, but I'm not happy to hear that this is the method they are using. Edited by kyssäkaali on 25 May 2011 at 11:07pm 9 persons have voted this message useful | |
| akprocks Senior Member United States Joined 5277 days ago 178 posts - 258 votes Speaks: English* Studies: German | Message 7 of 42 26 May 2011 at 12:42am | IP Logged |
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I support this plan entirely, as I hope to learn Russian sometime in the future and have always been interested in minority languages, maybe I can learn a Siberian one afterwards!
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| alang Diglot Senior Member Canada Joined 7212 days ago 563 posts - 757 votes Speaks: English*, Spanish | Message 8 of 42 26 May 2011 at 1:30am | IP Logged |
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I support this plan also, which is gaining knowledge, so it counts for something. Myself being from Canada and not of aboriginal descent, but a language lover this would be a nice program. One proposal in my province, was for anybody to work at a place that has anything to do with First Nations employment would be to speak any of the indigenous languages in the province. The proposal was rejected by the elders and the big reason believed by some people were the currently employed would have to learn the languages. This includes the elders who rejected the proposal, so learning something new to them was not appealing. 2 persons have voted this message useful |
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