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2nd person plural and 2nd polite forms | ||
Tags: Polite/Informal Forms | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : Philological Room |  | |
| jalcalde Bilingual Heptaglot Newbie Spain Joined 6876 days ago 28 posts - 28 votes Speaks: Spanish*, Catalan*, Portuguese, Esperanto, FrenchC2, English, ItalianC2 | Message 25 of 32 30 January 2006 at 10:34am | IP Logged | ||
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About portuguese, I've found an important difference between Portugal and Brasil. Whereas it is true that the use of the third person is the sign of politeness in Portugal, in Brasil it is so common that the sign of politeness has become the use of "o senhor". Is there any Brazilian that can confirm my impression?
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| Alijsh Tetraglot Senior Member Iran jahanshiri.ir/ Joined 6622 days ago 149 posts - 167 votes  1 sounds Speaks: Persian*, Spanish, French, English Studies: German, Italian | Message 26 of 32 10 October 2006 at 3:26am | IP Logged | ||
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In Persian:
informal singular you: to (Fr, It, Es: tu; De: du) formal singular you: shomâ plural form for both: shomâhâ As in French, all of them are conjugated with second person. to with singular and shomâ & shomâhâ with plural. * We have also a very polite form for plural 3rd person: ishân * mâ (we) was also used instead of man (I) by people of high rank e.g. Kings Edited by Alijsh on 12 October 2006 at 4:23am 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| bohy1b Newbie Australia Joined 6612 days ago 14 posts - 14 votes | Message 27 of 32 20 October 2006 at 1:11am | IP Logged | ||
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I thought that shoma could be both plural and singular. As in you can say both shoma or shomaha for 2nd person plural.
Also ma (we) is still used in quite a few places in Iran and Afghanistan. 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Valentine Lytv Triglot Groupie Ukraine Joined 6643 days ago 53 posts - 56 votes Speaks: Ukrainian, Russian*, English | Message 28 of 32 21 October 2006 at 2:15pm | IP Logged | ||
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In Russian
The phrases «I ask you…» are for both cases (a group and a person) homophone but they are not homograph: «Я прошу вас…» - for a group «Я прошу Вас…» - for a person 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| iieee Groupie United States dreaminginturkish.bl Joined 6587 days ago 78 posts - 80 votes Speaks: English* Studies: Turkish, German | Message 29 of 32 24 March 2007 at 1:31pm | IP Logged | ||
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I know this is an old thread, but I had to add that this is true in Turkish as well.
Sen-- you singular, informal Siz-- you plural and formal singular So it's not just an indo-European trait. 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| annierooney Groupie United States Joined 6701 days ago 48 posts - 48 votes Studies: Spanish | Message 30 of 32 23 May 2007 at 6:39pm | IP Logged | ||
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I haven't read the books, but when "All Creatures Great and Small" was shown in the US on PBS, people in Yorkshire were still using thee, thou and thine. I think the events took place between and after the World Wars. I don't know if it's still the case.
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| peterlin Tetraglot Groupie Poland peterlin.jzn.pl Joined 6415 days ago 54 posts - 58 votes Speaks: Polish*, Persian, English, Russian | Message 31 of 32 04 June 2007 at 8:58am | IP Logged | ||
AFAIK: 1. Technically, "shomaha" is probably "incorrect". I don't think I've ever seen it written, the "correct" form for 2nd pers. pl. being "shoma" 2. However, in modern colloquial Persian, "shoma" has practicaly became a 2nd pers. sg. pronoun, up to the point of often taking 2nd pers. sg. verbs; eg. shoma miduni 'you know', shoma bia 'come!' It's hardly ever used with reference to more than one person. 3. As alijsh wrote, "shomaha" is the unmarked 2nd pers. pl. pronoun in modern colloquial Persian. 4. In some Persoid lects spoken in Afghanistan "ma" IS the 1st. sg. pronoun (the 1st. pl. being eg. "ema") 5. The funny thing about the substitution of "ma" for "man" in modern standard Persian is that while it can serve as pluralis maiestatis, it is also used to downplay your importance as a sign of politeness. 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| telephos Triglot Newbie Canada Joined 6267 days ago 29 posts - 31 votes Speaks: French*, EnglishC2, Russian Studies: Norwegian, Ancient Greek | Message 32 of 32 28 September 2007 at 6:29pm | IP Logged | ||
I don't think so. Neither Classical Latin nor Ancient Greek knows this distinction. 1 person has voted this message useful |
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