Spinchäeb Ape
Diglot
Senior Member
United States
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Speaks: English*, German
| Message 1 of 6 25 October 2013 at 1:02am | IP Logged |
I write absurd dialogues in French for Language 8. I make them as ridiculous as possible. My thinking is the crazier they are the more likely I'll remember from them. I'm not sure about a couple corrections from my most recent entry and wanted to run them past people who know French well.
Here's the first one.
I wrote:
Quote:
| Mais c'est facile de le voir. |
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It was corrected as:
Quote:
| Mais c'est facil de le voir. |
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At first I though I must have accidentally used a feminine adverb when a masculine one was required. However, I don't find “facil” in my French/English dictionary. Plus, LibreOffice Writer's French-language spell checker flags it as misspelled. I therefore think the French person who corrected my sentence might have been wrong. Was he?
Here's the second one.
I wrote:
Quote:
| J'ai te dit que j'aie voulu dévaliser le banque avec le AV-8B Harrier II jet et pas avec la boule de démolition. |
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It was corrected as:
Quote:
| Je t'ai dit que j'ai voulu dévaliser le banque avec le AV-8B Harrier II jet et pas avec la boule de démolition. |
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I think he's right to correct “J'ai te dit” to “Je t'ai dit,” but I'm not so sure about “que j'aie voulu” being corrected as “que j'ai voulu.” Doesn't a form of “avoir” following “que” require the subjunctive? Is his correction right or not?
I'm cut and pasting the full dialogue in French and English at the end of this post in case you want to see it. The version you're seeing is the one after corrections have been done (except the two I'm not sure about). It should be fairly clean at this point, but if see anything that's wrong, feel free to speak up.
Quote:
Andrew, Catherine et le flic
(L'histoire se passe un après-midi à Trottelstadt, au Nebraska, aux États-Unis d'Amérique. Andrew et Catherine se trouvent assis dans un parc. Un flic s'approche d'eux.)
Le Flic : Bonjour, j'aimerais échanger quelques mots avec vous.
Andrew (surpris) : Oui, Monsieur. Comment est-ce que je peux vous aider ?
Le Flic : Est-ce que vous connaissez cette banque là-bas ?
Catherine : Oui, bien sûr.
Andrew : Oui, le Groupe Caisse de Trottelstadt. J'ai un compte courant là-bas. Ils m'ont donné un grille-pain quand j'ai ouvert mon compte.
Le Flic : Je suis sûr que c'était passionnant.
Andrew : Ah, oui, c'est très important de posséder une telle chose. En avez-vous un ?
Le Flic : Je ne suis pas ici pour parler de ça.
Catherine : De quoi voulez-vous parler alors ?
Le Flic : Hier la banque a été volée.
Andrew : Ah bon ?
Catherine : Vraiment ? C'est terrible.
Andrew : Est-ce qu'ils ont volé tous les grille-pains ?
Le Flic : Non, non, bien sûr que non ! Ils ont volé tout l'argent. Les criminels ont volé tout l'argent, bien entendu !
Andrew (nerveux) : Non ! Comment c'est affreux !
Catherine : C'est horrible !
Andrew : C'était juste comme l'autre jour où j'ai dit, « Catherine, ma chérie, c'est terrible quand un criminel casse le mur d'une banque et vole tout l'argent. »
Catherine : Oui, oui … de casser le mur et voler tout l'argent d'une banque … oh là là … Quel genre de personne ferait ça?
Le Flic : Comment avez-vous su que quelqu'un a cassé le mur ?
Andrew (réagissant tout surpris) : Quelqu-un a cassé le mur ? Ooooohhhhh ! C'est très très très très mal ! Quel genre de personne ferait ça? Oooohhhh !
Catherine (feignant la surprise) : Oui, quel genre de personne …. C'est tout simplement ignoble.
Andrew : J'espère que vous réussirez à attraper le scélérat qui a fait cette mauvaise action.
Le Flic : Donc, vous saviez tous les deux que quelqu'un a cassé le mur. Je ne vous ai jamais dit cela. Alors comment saviez-vous que … ?
Andrew : Aahhhh …. Comment est-ce que les voleurs ont cassé le mur ?
Le Flic : Avec une boule de démolition mais vous le savez déjà, n'est-ce pas ?
Catherine : Mais c'est facile de le voir. Regardez tous là-bas. On peut voir d'ici que le mur est cassé. Regardez.
Andrew : Ouais, Monsieur. Elle a raison. Il serait difficile de ne pas le remarquer. Une boule de démolition provoque beaucoup de destruction. Le bâtiment est en ruine.
Catherine : J’espère que les grille-pains n'ont pas été endommagés.
Le Flic : Au diable les grille-pains stupides !
Andrew : On est très, très triste que la banque ait été braqué.
Le Flic : Bien sûr. Je sais que vous êtes coupable. Je ne peux pas le prouver mais je le sais.
Catherine : Mais non !
Andrew : Nous n'avons rien eu à voir là-dedans.
Catherine : Oui, rien ….
Le Flic : Fermez votre gueule.
Catherine : Oh la, c'était rude.
Le Flic : Quel dommage. Je vous surveillerai. Soyez prudent.
(Le flic part.)
Catherine : C'était très proche.
Andrew : Ouais. Je t'ai dit que j'aie voulu dévaliser le banque avec le AV-8B Harrier II jet et pas avec la boule de démolition.
Catherine : Ça aurait pu être mieux, mais tu n'étais pas en mesure de voler dans celui de l'Armée de l'Air.
Andrew : C'est vrai. |
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Quote:
Andrew, Catherine, and the Cop
(Trottelstadt, Nebraska, USA, afternoon. Andrew and Catherine are sitting in the park. A cop approaches them.)
Cop: Good day, I'd like to have a few words with you.
Andrew: (surprised) Yes, Sir. How can I help you?
Cop: Do you know the bank over there?
Catherine: Yes, of course.
Andrew: Yes, the Group Fund of Trottelstadt. I have a checking account there. They gave me a toaster when I opened my account.
Cop: I'm sure that was exciting.
Andrew: Oh, yes, it's very important to own such a thing. Do you have one?
Cop: I'm not here to talk about that.
Catherine: What do you want to talk about?
Cop: Yesterday the bank was robbed.
Andrew: Is that so?
Catherine: Really? That's terrible.
Andrew: Did they steal all the toasters?
Cop: No, no, of course not! They stole all the money. The criminals stole all the money, of course.
Andrew: (nervous) No! That's dreadful!
Catherine: That's horrible.
Andrew: It was just the other day when I said, “Catherine, my dear, it's terrible when a criminal breaks down the wall of a bank and steals all the money.”
Catherine: Yes, yes … to to break down the wall and steal all the money from a bank … oh, my … What kind of person would do such a thing?
Cop: How did you know someone broke down the wall?
Andrew: (acting surprised) Someone broke down the wall? Ooooohhhh! That was very very very very bad! What kind of person would do that? Oooohhh!
Catherine: (feigning surprise) Yes, what kind of person …. That's just despicable.
Andrew: I hope you can catch the villain who did this evil deed.
Cop: You both knew that someone broke down the wall. I did not tell you that. How did you know?
Andrew: Aahhh … How did the robbers break down the wall?
Cop: With a wrecking ball, but you already knew that, didn't you?
Catherine: But that's easy to see. Look over there. One can see that the wall is broken down. Look.
Andrew: Yes, Sir. She's right. It would be difficult not to notice. A wrecking ball causes a lot of destruction. The building is in ruins.
Catherine: I hope the toasters weren't damaged.
Cop: To hell with the stupid toasters!
Andrew: We're very, very sad that the bank was robbed.
Cop: Sure. I know you're guilty. I can't prove it, but I know that.
Catherine: But no!
Andrew: We had nothing to do with it.
Catherine: Yes, nothing ….
Cop: Shut up.
Catherine: Hey, that was rude.
Cop: Too bad. I'll be watching you. Be careful.
(The cop exits.)
Catherine: That was close.
Andrew: Yeah. I told you I wanted to rob the bank with the AV-8B Harrier II jet and not with the wrecking ball.
Catherine: That would have been better, but you were not able to steal one from the Air Force.
Andrew: That's true. |
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tastyonions
Triglot
Senior Member
United States
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1044 posts - 1823 votes
Speaks: English*, French, Spanish
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| Message 2 of 6 25 October 2013 at 1:14am | IP Logged |
The first one was right in the original.
It sounds better to my ear to write, "Je t'ai dit que je voulais" rather than "Je t'ai dit que j'ai voulu." I don't know if there's a rule for it, but the first just sounds right to me. But wait for the natives to weigh in. :-)
Quote:
| Doesn't a form of “avoir” following “que” require the subjunctive? |
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Not always, it depends on the context. I don't think ordinary reporting of speech (like here) requires it.
Edited by tastyonions on 25 October 2013 at 1:14am
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sctroyenne
Diglot
Senior Member
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Joined 5395 days ago
739 posts - 1312 votes
Speaks: English*, French
Studies: Spanish, Irish
| Message 3 of 6 25 October 2013 at 1:37am | IP Logged |
tastyonions wrote:
The first one was right in the original.
It sounds better to my ear to write, "Je t'ai dit que je voulais" rather than "Je t'ai
dit que j'ai voulu." I don't know if there's a rule for it, but the first just sounds
right to me. But wait for the natives to weigh in. :-) |
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Yes! It's indirect
speech. If you say "J'ai dit" basically all the other tenses "go back" one tense.
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Iversen
Super Polyglot
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| Message 4 of 6 25 October 2013 at 11:24am | IP Logged |
The only reason for keeping "j'ai voulu" (but not "j'aie voulu") instead of "je voulais" would be to emphasize that you had changed your mind and now wanted to rob the bank by more peaceful means.
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pushkin
Tetraglot
Groupie
France
Joined 5523 days ago
49 posts - 60 votes
Speaks: French*, Portuguese, Italian, Spanish
Studies: Russian, Arabic (Written), German, Modern Hebrew
| Message 5 of 6 01 November 2013 at 10:20am | IP Logged |
"J'ai te dit que j'aie voulu dévaliser le banque avec le AV-8B Harrier II jet et pas avec
la boule de démolition."
The correct sentence is : je t'ai dit que je voulais dévaliser LA banque avec le AV-8B
Harrier II Jet et NON pas avec la boule de démolition. It's better to add "NON".
"Facil" isn't correct, "facile" is both for masculine and feminine.
Edited by pushkin on 01 November 2013 at 10:25am
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pushkin
Tetraglot
Groupie
France
Joined 5523 days ago
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Speaks: French*, Portuguese, Italian, Spanish
Studies: Russian, Arabic (Written), German, Modern Hebrew
| Message 6 of 6 01 November 2013 at 10:57am | IP Logged |
Doesn't a form of “avoir” following “que” require the subjunctive? Is his correction
right or not? :
It depends of the verb used in the main clause. After this following verbs
aimer,approuver,attendre, avoir envie, craindre, défendre, demander, déplorer, désirer
douter, s'étonner, exiger, faire attention, falloir, importer, interdire, ordonner,
permettre, préférer, prendre garde, refuser, regretter, souhaiter, tenir à, vouloir, the
subjunctive is always used.
If you use the "passé composé" in the main clause with others verbs, you usually put the
verb of the subordonate clause into the "imparfait" .
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