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Must vs Must Not | ||
Tags: Verbs/Conjugation | English | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : Philological Room |  | |
| fanatic Octoglot Senior Member Australia speedmathematics.com Joined 7146 days ago 1152 posts - 1818 votes  Speaks: English*, German, French, Afrikaans, Italian, Spanish, Russian, Dutch Studies: Swedish, Norwegian, Polish, Modern Hebrew, Malay, Mandarin, Esperanto | Message 9 of 16 25 May 2006 at 7:00am | IP Logged | ||||||||
Where do you live?
That is interesting. I am sure I heard that said when I lived in Germany (not often) and, if so, I don't think I understood it as "have to." It is unfortunate that almost all of my German practice is passive now, either listening or reading. 1 person has voted this message useful | |||||||||
| fanatic Octoglot Senior Member Australia speedmathematics.com Joined 7146 days ago 1152 posts - 1818 votes Speaks: English*, German, French, Afrikaans, Italian, Spanish, Russian, Dutch Studies: Swedish, Norwegian, Polish, Modern Hebrew, Malay, Mandarin, Esperanto | Message 10 of 16 25 May 2006 at 7:22am | IP Logged | ||||||||
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Come to think of it, if I wanted to say, "You don't have to," I would have said, "Sie brauchen dass nicht zu tun."
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| hagen Triglot Senior Member Germany Joined 6960 days ago 171 posts - 179 votes 6 sounds Speaks: German*, English, Mandarin Studies: Korean | Message 11 of 16 25 May 2006 at 5:06pm | IP Logged | ||||||||
In the Bonn region, but I'm quite sure this use of "haben zu" is Standard German. By the way, it's also possible in the negation, and its meaning is parallel to the English form: "Er hat uns nicht zu kritisieren." ("He mustn't criticize us." / "He doesn't have the right to criticize us.")
Yes, in the negation you could use "nicht brauchen (zu)" or "nicht müssen", much like "don't need to" or "don't have to". - Hagen 1 person has voted this message useful | |||||||||
| awb Groupie United States Joined 6874 days ago 46 posts - 48 votes Speaks: English* Studies: German, Russian | Message 12 of 16 26 May 2006 at 10:28am | IP Logged | ||||||||
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Hmm, interesting.. I've seen haben zu, the way I've seen it is essentially "to have to" in English but not emphasized, so not like müssen.
E.g.: Sie haben, verdammt noch mal, die Wahrheit zu sagen! Goddamnit, you have the truth to tell me! E.g., the recipient of the message knows the truth and must tell it to whoever said it. Edit: I suppose it could mean "Sie sind gezwungen, die Wahrheit zu sagen!" But that's not how I interpreted it. Edited by awb on 26 May 2006 at 10:30am 1 person has voted this message useful | |||||||||
| Vespasian Bilingual Triglot Groupie Switzerland Joined 6919 days ago 55 posts - 55 votes Speaks: German*, Swiss-German*, English Studies: Italian | Message 13 of 16 06 June 2006 at 3:24pm | IP Logged | ||||||||
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You're absolutely right, Hagen. But to make it clear: You will practically never hear someone saying: "Ich habe es/das zu tun." In German you say: "Ich muss es tun." for "I have to do it.". But sometimes you can hear "Ich habe etwas zu tun." (I have to do something e.g. I don't have time at the moment.)
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| Vespasian Bilingual Triglot Groupie Switzerland Joined 6919 days ago 55 posts - 55 votes Speaks: German*, Swiss-German*, English Studies: Italian | Message 14 of 16 06 June 2006 at 3:32pm | IP Logged | ||||||||
It's hard to explain but it's something like: Goddamnit, you are to tell the truth! e.g. He is expected (from everyone, from the world) to tell the truth. 1 person has voted this message useful | |||||||||
| awb Groupie United States Joined 6874 days ago 46 posts - 48 votes Speaks: English* Studies: German, Russian | Message 15 of 16 06 June 2006 at 3:40pm | IP Logged | ||||||||
I would say that as I have something to do, which means I have something I need to do, and I guess you could stretch that to "I have to do something." or "Ich muss etwas tun."
It was a she and from a German film I saw, Sophie Scholl. But anyway, I interpreted it as something like "Sie haben die ganze Zeit herumgeredet, und davon habe ich die Nase voll! Hören Sie mal auf, zu lügnen, und sagen Sie mir die einfache Wahrheit, da ich weiss, dass Sie die wissen!" 1 person has voted this message useful | |||||||||
| Vespasian Bilingual Triglot Groupie Switzerland Joined 6919 days ago 55 posts - 55 votes Speaks: German*, Swiss-German*, English Studies: Italian | Message 16 of 16 06 June 2006 at 3:54pm | IP Logged | ||||||||
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Yes you can stretch it and it has probably the same roots but let's put it this way. Nowadays "müssen" works virtually always as a translation of "to have to". But "haben (zu)" does not.
He has to do it himself! Er muss es selber machen/tun! - correct Er hat es selber zu machen/tun! - comprehensible but weird Edited by Vespasian on 06 June 2006 at 3:58pm 1 person has voted this message useful |
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