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Fr.: Pronunciation of vin, bien, vingt | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : Questions About Your Target Languages |  | |
| Footnoted Newbie United States Joined 4858 days ago 35 posts - 42 votes Speaks: English* Studies: French | Message 9 of 14 15 February 2012 at 12:59pm | IP Logged | |||||
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Thank you for the replies. I want to reiterate that I am not mistaking one word for another. These are
sentences, or portions thereof, the translation of which is given right after a pause, e.g., " Je voudrais un verre de vin". You then hear "I would like a glass of wine." Edited by Footnoted on 16 February 2012 at 2:56am 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| Arekkusu Hexaglot Senior Member Canada bit.ly/qc_10_lec Joined 5382 days ago 3971 posts - 7747 votes  Speaks: English, French*, GermanC1, Spanish, Japanese, Esperanto Studies: Italian, Norwegian, Mandarin, Romanian, Estonian | Message 10 of 14 15 February 2012 at 3:24pm | IP Logged | |||||
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As you can see, we can't really help you without hearing the recording. Yes, there are regional differences, especially comparing France and Québec, but it's highly unlikely the speaker on Pimsleur was Québécois, so it's really hard to say what you heard exactly.
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| PillowRock Groupie United States Joined 4735 days ago 87 posts - 151 votes Speaks: English* Studies: Spanish | Message 11 of 14 15 February 2012 at 6:21pm | IP Logged | |||||
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When I was in college I had French teachers from Paris, French speaking Northern Africa, and Belgium (well, an American who had spent several years of her childhood there), plus a couple of fellow students from Quebecois families. Even to my ear at the time, those were all noticeably different accents. However, it was so long ago that I couldn't really characterize the differences in their vowels.
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| LaughingChimp Senior Member Czech Republic Joined 4700 days ago 346 posts - 594 votes Speaks: Czech* | Message 12 of 14 16 February 2012 at 1:45am | IP Logged | |||||
Yes, it's /ɛ̃/ (the phoneme), but [æ̃] (the sound itself. /ɛ̃/ is usually pronounced more open in France.
The problem is there are no shortcuts for learning the sound system. Listening to the language is the only way that actually works. 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| Medulin Tetraglot Senior Member Croatia Joined 4669 days ago 1199 posts - 2192 votes Speaks: Croatian*, English, Spanish, Portuguese Studies: Norwegian, Hindi, Nepali | Message 13 of 14 05 March 2012 at 4:29am | IP Logged | |||||
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To me ears, most people in Northern France and Belgium pronounce BIEN
as [bjã] (a = low front unrounded vowel; as in modern standard British English trAp). Luciano Canepari (professor of phonetics at the University of Venice) calls this pronunciation ''middle class suburban Parisian''. I'm not familiar with the phonology of French, but I'm familiar with general phonetics, I can write down everything I hear, by using IPA symbols. The pronunciation given in French dictionaries is not the PHONETIC pronunciation of current Parisian French, but PHONEMIC/PHONOLOGICAL pronunciation of the Parisian French in 1920ies (when IPA was established), which hasn't changed since. But the PHONETIC Parisian pronunciation of today and the one in 1920 sound nothing alike. Edited by Medulin on 05 March 2012 at 4:35am 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| Medulin Tetraglot Senior Member Croatia Joined 4669 days ago 1199 posts - 2192 votes Speaks: Croatian*, English, Spanish, Portuguese Studies: Norwegian, Hindi, Nepali | Message 14 of 14 05 March 2012 at 4:39am | IP Logged | |||||
This is what is is phonetically. Phonologically, people will keep using old symbols since phonology is more like philosophy. Phonetics is about measured frequencies, sounds and not about how one thinks a sound should be pronounced. ;) The French pronunciation at FORVO.com is [bjã] http://www.forvo.com/word/bien/#fr (copy and paste) Edited by Medulin on 05 March 2012 at 5:13am 1 person has voted this message useful |
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