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French: tacher and tâcher | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : Specific Languages |  | |
| anime Triglot Senior Member Sweden Joined 6361 days ago 161 posts - 207 votes  Speaks: Spanish, Swedish*, English Studies: German, Portuguese, French, Russian | Message 1 of 13 16 August 2013 at 3:33pm | IP Logged |
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So according to my dictionary there's supposed to be a pronunciation difference between tacher and tâcher. I
listened to the words in Forvo and I couldn't hear any difference in pronunciation. Is this possibly some dialectal trait? 1 person has voted this message useful | |
| tarvos Super Polyglot Winner TAC 2012 Senior Member China likeapolyglot.wordpr Joined 4708 days ago 5310 posts - 9399 votes Speaks: Dutch*, English, Swedish, French, Russian, German, Italian, Norwegian, Mandarin, Romanian, Afrikaans Studies: Greek, Modern Hebrew, Spanish, Portuguese, Czech, Korean, Esperanto, Finnish | Message 2 of 13 16 August 2013 at 4:03pm | IP Logged |
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Yes, there used to be a difference in the vowels between these two sounds. This is
because one of them is a front and the other one a back vowel (did some quick wiki research!) However I believe in France this difference isn't observed as strongly anymore. I think in Belgium the vowels are distinguished. Cannot speak for Africa, Quebec or Switzerland. Edited by tarvos on 16 August 2013 at 4:09pm 2 persons have voted this message useful | |
| umiak Groupie Poland Joined 4513 days ago 51 posts - 77 votes Speaks: Polish* | Message 3 of 13 16 August 2013 at 4:05pm | IP Logged |
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The difference between the back and front 'a', as in 'tâcher', 'pâte' vs. 'tacher', 'patte' respectively, is becoming less and less noticeable in French French. The front vowel is of preference. I think you can still hear it more in the south of France than more north, like in Paris. Other than that it's more a dialect thing in France.
Here you can listen to both (click ':: Présentation des voyelles ::') Edited by umiak on 16 August 2013 at 10:55pm 1 person has voted this message useful | |
| Arekkusu Hexaglot Senior Member Canada bit.ly/qc_10_lec Joined 5382 days ago 3971 posts - 7747 votes Speaks: English, French*, GermanC1, Spanish, Japanese, Esperanto Studies: Italian, Norwegian, Mandarin, Romanian, Estonian | Message 4 of 13 16 August 2013 at 5:04pm | IP Logged |
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While these words use two different vowels in standard French, the reality is that in most dialects (including the vast majority of European speakers), this difference no longer exists.
I can't speak for other countries, but in Québec, this distinction is still fully active. 1 person has voted this message useful | |
| tarvos Super Polyglot Winner TAC 2012 Senior Member China likeapolyglot.wordpr Joined 4708 days ago 5310 posts - 9399 votes Speaks: Dutch*, English, Swedish, French, Russian, German, Italian, Norwegian, Mandarin, Romanian, Afrikaans Studies: Greek, Modern Hebrew, Spanish, Portuguese, Czech, Korean, Esperanto, Finnish | Message 5 of 13 16 August 2013 at 5:08pm | IP Logged |
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The wiki says that in France this is indeed not really observed, it is in Quebec
obviously (as you stated). I think in Belgium the distinction is rather about length than front/back. At least that is what the wiki seems to indicate. What about in Switzerland? Edited by tarvos on 16 August 2013 at 5:08pm 1 person has voted this message useful | |
| FELlX Diglot Groupie France Joined 4771 days ago 94 posts - 149 votes Speaks: French*, English | Message 6 of 13 17 August 2013 at 10:49am | IP Logged |
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Indeed, my father, who is from Quebec, makes the distinction. I (Parisian) pronounce "tâcher" exactly like
"tacher". 1 person has voted this message useful | |
| Cabaire Senior Member Germany Joined 5600 days ago 725 posts - 1352 votes | Message 7 of 13 17 August 2013 at 12:30pm | IP Logged |
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I am only used to pronounce some words a bit longer, so tâche is [ta:ʃ], but this may be only a free variation.
The feature developed because of compensationary lenghtening of a vowel when a following consonant dropped: tâche descends from Greek τάξαι "to place, to put in order", Latin tax- [taks], the s dropped, therefore the circonflexe, and the vowel changed in compensation. PS. Is there a list for common words, as minimal pairs like rat ≠ ras are not always distinguish by the circonflexe (the s is still written there, you see)? Edited by Cabaire on 17 August 2013 at 12:31pm 1 person has voted this message useful | |
| Stelle Bilingual Triglot Senior Member Canada tobefluent.com Joined 4145 days ago 949 posts - 1686 votes Speaks: French*, English*, Spanish Studies: Tagalog | Message 8 of 13 17 August 2013 at 1:21pm | IP Logged |
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It's definitely different here in Canada!
"tacher" - a as in the English word "cat" "tacher" (errr...with an accent. New Mac, haven't figured them out yet.) - a more like the o in the English word "hot" 1 person has voted this message useful |
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