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Vós in regular speech (Portuguese) | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : Specific Languages |  | |
| umiak Groupie Poland Joined 4513 days ago 51 posts - 77 votes  Speaks: Polish* | Message 17 of 21 24 August 2013 at 12:53pm | IP Logged | ||
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I've also come across 'vosotros' verb forms in Spanish quite often. I had it in my studying materials: textbooks, newspaper articles, books, audioclips, movies, etc. I also remember my Spanish native speaker teachers use it while addressing us in class.
I didn't have 'vós' verb forms in my Portuguese studying materials. My Portuguese teachers didin't use it while calling us. One of them mentioned that they exist, but they have fallen out of use and we can come across them in old Portuguese texts. I'd hazzard a guess that the French passé simple and perhaps imparfait du subjonctif are relatively more frequent in French literature that 'vós' in Portuguese. The reason: they are mainly literary divices, whereas Portuguese 'vós' verb forms seem to be not only literary but also archaic. I base that on the following observation: I've read books by Stendhal, André Gide and Albert Camus -- they all used passé simple and imparfait du subjoncitf. I read some books by José Saramago, Eça de Queirós and José Luís Peixoto and don't recall that any of them used these forms. I've recently seen a copy of O nome da Rosa translated into Portuguese by M. C. Pinto, where these forms are very frequent (the language is stylised on purpose there, it's the same in the Polish translation). I'm wondering though if the reception of Portuguese 'vós' verb forms might be tantamount to the reception of the Spanish futuro de subjuntivo. Edited by umiak on 24 August 2013 at 8:15pm 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Medulin Tetraglot Senior Member Croatia Joined 4669 days ago 1199 posts - 2192 votes Speaks: Croatian*, English, Spanish, Portuguese Studies: Norwegian, Hindi, Nepali | Message 18 of 21 24 August 2013 at 4:05pm | IP Logged | ||
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In Brazil, VÓS means THOU, it's used for addressing God only, in catholic church/Bible.
In Portugal, as well as in Brazilian protestant churches, TU is used instead. Edited by Medulin on 24 August 2013 at 4:07pm 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| MarcoLeal Groupie Portugal Joined 4835 days ago 58 posts - 104 votes Speaks: Portuguese* | Message 19 of 21 26 August 2013 at 12:03am | IP Logged | ||
Actually in Portugal biblical characters use Tu to address each other but also use Vós to address God. 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Luso Hexaglot Senior Member Portugal Joined 6062 days ago 819 posts - 1812 votes Speaks: Portuguese*, French, EnglishC2, GermanB1, Italian, Spanish Studies: Sanskrit, Arabic (classical) | Message 20 of 21 27 August 2013 at 8:56pm | IP Logged | ||
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An interesting topic. I globally agree to what's been said (written).
I'd just like to add a couple of things: 1. The 2nd person plural is falling out of use; however, many persons from the Beira Alta region still use it (mainly older, but not only). 2. Due to the big wave of emigration in the 1960s and early 1970s (mainly to France, but also to a few other European countries), there are today sizeable communities of Portuguese descendants abroad (mainly in France and Luxembourg). The younger generation is integrated in the respective societies (similar religious and cultural backgrounds, etc.). That's the historical introduction. What is of interest here is the fact that these communities, being sizeable and tight-knit (a common reaction to adverse conditions), taught their descendants the exact version of the language they had learned (without regular contact with Portuguese TV, radio or newspapers). I worked for a couple of French corporations during a dozen of years, and flew to France regularly for meetings. I met locally some "luso-descendentes", who spoke good Portuguese (complete with regional accents), albeit seeming out of some documentary from the 60s. Sort of a time capsule. Just to give an example: I was addressed as "vossemecê" by a young woman. When I was a kid, this was already obsolete (except for some people in small towns or villages). An interesting phenomenon indeed. 5 persons have voted this message useful | |||
| MarcoLeal Groupie Portugal Joined 4835 days ago 58 posts - 104 votes Speaks: Portuguese* | Message 21 of 21 27 August 2013 at 9:59pm | IP Logged | ||
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Luso you raise an interesting point about emigrants. I would just like to add that it is especially amusing to hear these luso-descendentes, some of whom become highly educated people in the countries where they grow up, speak Portuguese with a provincial accent, make the same mistakes and use the same vocabulary that people from those rural areas do due to limited access to education.
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