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When to Introduce Kana and Kanji | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : Specific Languages |  | |
| Shemtov Diglot Groupie United States Joined 4815 days ago 49 posts - 59 votes  Speaks: English*, Biblical Hebrew Studies: Mandarin, Japanese, Aramaic | Message 1 of 9 07 August 2012 at 8:25am | IP Logged |
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I am learning Japanese with Pimsleur. I plan to introduce a good grammar program once I find one I'm satisfied with. However, I want to start learning the written language. Should I learn the Kana right away or should I wait until I have a certain proficiency in the Spoken Language? How about Kanji?
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| ReQuest Tetraglot Senior Member Netherlands Joined 5033 days ago 200 posts - 228 votes Speaks: Dutch*, English, German, French Studies: Spanish | Message 2 of 9 07 August 2012 at 12:15pm | IP Logged |
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Kana: before you even start learning actual Japanese.
Kanji: before or during studying and MAKE USE OF RADICALS. (I study Japanese occasionally) 1 person has voted this message useful | |
 emk Diglot Moderator United States Joined 5533 days ago 2615 posts - 8806 votes Speaks: English*, FrenchB2 Studies: Spanish, Ancient Egyptian Personal Language Map | Message 3 of 9 07 August 2012 at 4:16pm | IP Logged |
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When I started learning Egyptian, I knew that I'd have to learn some hieroglyphs. I did
some research into how people learn the Kanji/Hanzi, and here's what I found. Hesig's Remembering the Kanji, volume 1. This book presents 2,042 common Kanji, starting with "building block" characters and building up to more common characters. Each character has an English-language keyword, and these keywords are combined to create memorable stories. Anki. If you can remember something until tomorrow, Anki can help you remember it indefinitely. If you have a smartphone, install the mobile Anki client, synchronize everything through AnkiWeb, and do your reviews whenever you can. Sharing mnemonic stories. There are great databases of really memorable mnemonic stories for the various kanji, including a very popular one at Koohii. Koohii stories My personal experience. I'm really glad that I learned the basic hieroglyphs before getting too deeply into Egyptian. When I look at a unfamiliar text, maybe 90% of the characters are already familiar. I don't necessarily know what anything means yet, but that's OK—since I already know the signs, I can devote almost all my attention to the words. It's like each sign forms an "anchor" in my head, to which I can easily attach more information. There's some theory behind this: You can remember roughly 7 things in your short-term memory at a time. Right now, if you look at Japanese text, that's maybe enough to remember all the strokes in one character. But if you start with the radicals and simple characters, you'll increase the size of the "chunks" that your brain is working with—instead of trying to remember 7 strokes, you can remember 7 radicals, or 7 characters. Based on my experience with Egyptian, I can say with some confidence that it feels really, really good to have the characters out of the way. I'm already working with nice, big chunks, and everything is much easier. Learning an ideographic alphabet is a big project, but it's definitely doable: If you did 20 characters from Hesig a day, and reviewed in Anki, you'd know the entire alphabet by Christmas. If you did 5 a day, you'd know them by the end of next summer. 7 persons have voted this message useful | |
| Tanizaki Triglot Newbie United States Joined 4801 days ago 21 posts - 44 votes Speaks: English*, Spanish, Japanese | Message 4 of 9 08 August 2012 at 5:51pm | IP Logged |
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I recommend learning kana immediately. It can be done in a week or less.
I agree to start with kanji right away as well. I am not a fan of Hesig. I recommend starting with Basic Kanji Book. Skritter.com is also a great resource. In general, when learning vocabulary, learn the kanji as well for those words that are usually written in kanji. 1 person has voted this message useful | |
| Heavyweight Diglot Newbie Sweden Joined 4566 days ago 12 posts - 19 votes Speaks: Swedish*, English Studies: Japanese | Message 5 of 9 08 August 2012 at 9:27pm | IP Logged |
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I studied Kana before I got to Japan. I think you should learn it as fast as you can as you can use more and more learning material in Japanses. And you might as well start learning Kanji from day 1 as well. Otherwise, you kind of have to learn the work again when you have to learn it's kanji. Edited by Heavyweight on 08 August 2012 at 9:27pm 1 person has voted this message useful | |
| Fiveonefive Diglot Groupie Japan Joined 5694 days ago 69 posts - 88 votes Speaks: English*, Japanese Studies: Swedish | Message 6 of 9 09 August 2012 at 1:03am | IP Logged |
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You can start learning the kana today. It's really not that hard and there are a ton of free resources on the internet teaching them. It only took me a few weeks to master them.
Kanji is a whole other game though. I personally like the Heisig system. And I say that as a learner who switched over to it after learning my first 800 or so kanji through brute force practice and radical memorization. Your milage may vary but I would definitely look into it. 3 persons have voted this message useful | |
| Tyr Senior Member Sweden Joined 5783 days ago 316 posts - 384 votes Speaks: English* Studies: Swedish | Message 7 of 9 09 August 2012 at 9:05am | IP Logged |
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Definitely, definitely, 100% from the start on kana.
Kana should be before you start on the real Japanese, romanji is the devil, you should try and learn using kana even if at first you have to keep going back to your kana sheet to check whats what. Kanji...you should try and learn it as you go along. Heisig is nice though it leads to a complete disconnet between the spoken and the written language, I can read a tonne of kanji's meaning though I don't know what they actually say. Its a wonderful feeling when you can just read a kanji in Japanese. I favour a bit of a hybrid heisig/traditional system. Learning using radicals as 'letters' is definitely the way to go though you should try and learn a word or two that use the key readings along with the kanji. The best learning resources are the likes of minna no nihongo where they give you natural japanese with the kanji but with plenty of furigana. Stuff which uses pure romanji...I just can't handle it, its difficult to read, it feels wrong. And pure hiragana tends to be both harder and doesnt help you with the kanji (e.g. japanese for busy people) 2 persons have voted this message useful | |
| mjhowie1992 Diglot Newbie AustraliaRegistered users can see my Skype Name Joined 5181 days ago 24 posts - 27 votes Speaks: English*, French Studies: Mandarin | Message 8 of 9 24 August 2012 at 3:00pm | IP Logged |
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I've been studying Japanese for almost 4 years, and am now doing it at University.
Learning kana is highly important, and should be done as soon as possible, as it helps you understand the rhythm and flow of the language, as well as differentiate between subtle pronunciation differences. That being said, kana is the most basic form of writing in Japan, and all childrens' books are written in it. As for kanji, only start learning them when you fully understand kana. Learn kanji in their context, and not just alone to begin with. Many kanji can be confused for one another, and it is almost guaranteed that one kanji can have several pronunciations, depending on what it's combined with, or sometimes which meaning you want. Try and start off with the basic kanji. Don't throw yourself into the deep end. I have a childrens' book on learning kanji, and it starts with the same easy kanji we're taught in the western world when studying Japanese, so they do it the same way. And don't forget to learn the stroke order! I don't always focus on studying the rules, as it comes to me much easier through practising writing kanji. Hope that helps somewhat! 1 person has voted this message useful |
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