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 Language Learning Forum : Learning Techniques, Methods & Strategies |  | |
| feanarosurion Senior Member Canada Joined 5309 days ago 217 posts - 316 votes  Speaks: English* Studies: Finnish, Norwegian | Message 1 of 10 24 August 2010 at 8:03am | IP Logged | ||
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I'm currently facing a dilemma with the texts I have at my disposal, specifically, which one I should tackle first. I just recently bought a number of Finnish books online, and they arrived a couple of weeks ago now. I've got 4 young adult books, two adult level thrillers, "Seitsemän Veljestä," a classic novel, and "Taru Sormusten Herrasta," The Lord of the Rings. Oh, and Kalevala. Now, at this point, I've sampled from the young adult books, the first in the series I have, and I've sampled from The Lord of the Rings as well. What strikes me immediately is that, first of all, I'm still looking up a number of words per paragraph in each book. I'm OK with that, and I'm fully prepared to begin reading intensively before reading extensively. On a grammar standpoint, I find that I'm comfortable with the constructs in the young adult book, but the language of the Lord of the Rings goes way over my head. In the first paragraph I read, there were at least 3 constructs that I couldn't figure out, even with the English translation as a guide. In the young adult book, some things I had to think about a little bit, but for the most part I could understand what was going on after looking up the unknown words. There's no English translation, but I think I'll be fine without one. Now, my dilemma stems from the fact that I desire very much to read The Lord of the Rings in Finnish. It's my favourite book by far, and I know the plot extremely well. I also have the books in English so I could use that to help me. However, the language is quite advanced for me at this point, so I'm considering reading the easier books first. However, they don't interest me nearly as much as The Lord of the Rings does. Therefore, I'm wondering whether I should tackle the easier books first, or dive right in with The Lord of the Rings. Any thoughts or opinions would be appreciated.
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| Faraday Senior Member United States Joined 6146 days ago 129 posts - 256 votes Speaks: German* | Message 2 of 10 24 August 2010 at 8:43am | IP Logged | ||
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Always aim for a level that is slightly challenging. Neither so hard as to be discouraging or hinder your progress, nor so easy as to be bereft of learning. Try to find audio recordings of books you're reading in your target language. A good reading can really bring a book to life.
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| schoenewaelder Diglot Senior Member Germany Joined 5588 days ago 759 posts - 1197 votes Speaks: English*, French Studies: German, Spanish, Dutch | Message 3 of 10 24 August 2010 at 12:12pm | IP Logged | ||
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The fact that you really like a book is normally a good incentive, but if you've had a look and it seems beyond you, then it could be demotivating.
My strategy would be to have a look at the first few pages of each, then start with the simplest, and work through them. I personally don't think there's such a thing as "too easy" when it comes to reading novels. I could happily read "Jack and Jill", and I expect I would notice and learn something new. If you get bogged down or bored, move on to the next one. Although young adult books or thrillers aren't necessarily easier, I think they tend to be a fairly regular level of difficulty, while with classics or contemporary fiction, it all depends on the author. Some write beautifully simply, while some write tortuously. The first book I "read" was a thriller, which I spent 3 or 4 months struggling through, but the next one I enjoyed much more, a "teen/young adult" book called "das Orangenmädchen (by Jostein Gaarder, "Appelsinpiken" in the original Norwegian) which is a kind of mild domestic mystery .(Not quite sure how to describe the genre. It's "mystery", but without the element of "thriller" or "adventure" that would normally go together with it.) Anything that is a "page turner" is a good idea. Obviously it will keep you reading, but also allows you to skip bits that you are finding heavy going. I think I would save Lord of the Rings until later, so you can actually enjoy it. A goal to aim for. Edited by schoenewaelder on 24 August 2010 at 12:15pm 2 persons have voted this message useful | |||
| galindo Bilingual Triglot Senior Member United States Joined 5235 days ago 142 posts - 248 votes Speaks: English*, Spanish*, Japanese Studies: Korean, Portuguese | Message 4 of 10 24 August 2010 at 1:18pm | IP Logged | ||
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When I was struggling with getting comfortable reading in Japanese, these posts helped me: http://www.alljapaneseallthetime.com/blog/why-how-we-read-su cks-and-how-to-fix-it-part-1
and http://www.alljapaneseallthetime.com/blog/why-how-we-read-su cks-and-how-to-fix-it-part-2 Basically, you can skip around and read whatever you can, without worrying too much about reading in the proper order or making sure you look up everything you don't know. Since you already know the plot very well, you definitely wouldn't be missing anything. The easier books that don't interest you could be tackled the same way. If you don't really care about the plot too much, there's no point in spending too much time looking up words. I notice that every time I read a book, there are always certain words and phrases that the author likes repeating, so after seeing those a few times I'm interested enough to look them up, and because they are repeated multiple times, I will have them memorized by the end of the book. That said, I'm not sure that the language used in The Lord of the Rings is going to show up too often in other works. 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Volte Tetraglot Senior Member Switzerland Joined 6467 days ago 4474 posts - 6726 votes Speaks: English*, Esperanto, German, Italian Studies: French, Finnish, Mandarin, Japanese | Message 5 of 10 24 August 2010 at 1:28pm | IP Logged | ||
Go for what's the most fun/interesting, given your current level of Finnish. If it's LOTR despite the difficulties, great; if it's something easier that you feel more comfortable and joyous reading, great. In your shoes, I'd search a bit and glance through a reference grammar to see if I could find the constructs I didn't understand, and regardless of the result of that, read a bit further, then decide. Referring to the English so that you can get the general sense of the meaning despite not knowing specific grammatical constructs, you're quite likely to pick up an understanding of the more common of the constructs you don't know yet. Whether you find this an enjoyable way to read is another question, and one only you can answer - reading without referring to the English much (sheer exposure will help a bit, aided further by how well you know the book), or reading something else are also options. 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| feanarosurion Senior Member Canada Joined 5309 days ago 217 posts - 316 votes Speaks: English* Studies: Finnish, Norwegian | Message 6 of 10 24 August 2010 at 9:37pm | IP Logged | ||
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Hmm, thanks for these great ideas! Well, if I'm going for what I'm going to enjoy, I might as well just dive in with The Lord of the Rings and try to pick everything up all at once. But if I'm going to go for something that's closer to my level, I'd go for the young adult series.
@Faraday: Very good advice! Now the only trouble is figuring out which one is closer to that level, or whether I really can handle something more advanced. I've tried to find some audio for these books, but I'm not actually sure if they match the editions of the texts I have, which would be an issue if they didn't. Either way though, thanks for your post! @Schoenewaelder: That's what I was thinking initially, but now I'm not so sure anymore. I think I'll always be looking to that far off goal, and wishing to dive back into it sooner than I should. Whereas if I dive right in, it might be a little bit above my level, but I'll love it. Thanks for your advice though! @Galindo: Good posts! I enjoyed reading them. However, unfortunately, that's just not the way I read, or the way I learn for that matter. I've never had any school method drilled into me, I've just read the way I wanted to read ever since I was 6. And I skip and skim all the time, but I don't enjoy it. I get the most fun and the most joy out of absorbing every single sentence. Every nuance. That might not be great in terms of quantity, but I love the quality of my reading sessions. So I think your advice was great, but it just wouldn't work for me. Thanks for pointing it out to me though! @Volte: I think that's definitely something worth exploring. I think I'll try a full chapter of each text, as opposed to a single paragraph. That might take a little while, but if one of them sticks better than the other, I'll just go with that. Thanks for the advice! 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| frenkeld Diglot Senior Member United States Joined 6971 days ago 2042 posts - 2719 votes Speaks: Russian*, English Studies: German | Message 7 of 10 24 August 2010 at 11:40pm | IP Logged | ||
You can try to read it for several pages and then decide. If the sentences which you can't decipher even with a dictionary are frequent, it may be best to come back to this book later. Otherwise, you should be able to handle it if you have a certain type of stamina and feel like exercising it. As an example of the type of stamina I am talking about, it is said that to read comfortably without a dictionary, one should know 95% of the words in the text, yet some people read without a dictionary even when they barely understand 80% of the words - they simply don't mind partial understanding until their language improves. You will be reading with a dictionary, with a translation on hand as well, so for you the percentage that is relevant is that of the sentences you can't decipher. 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| tracker465 Senior Member United States Joined 5380 days ago 355 posts - 496 votes Speaks: English* Studies: German, Spanish, Dutch | Message 8 of 10 31 August 2010 at 6:28am | IP Logged | ||
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I would probably aim for the easier book first. The first foreign language novel I read was a German novel, and I struggled through it. I constantly looked up words, as well as constructions here and there. In the end I felt a satisfaction, but it took me about a year to get through it, though that includes my busy times at school, months of not reading, etc.
Currently I am reading a German autobiography, and I find it immensley easy to understand. I do not understand all of the words, but I understand the majority. Anything that I find interesting I mark and then examine closer at a later date. This book is surely written on an easier level than a literary work, and as such, I find it much more enjoyable to read, and less of a chore. If you are someone who does not mind not getting all of the details in the text, then maybe I would go with LotR. I mean, you know the story well, and enjoy it, so that would be motivation. On the other hand, I find that some people tend to want to get all of the details, and in this case, it would quickly get old for you to look up every word/construction, on every page. It may not seem like a daunting task at first, but after a few chapters, it will either make or break. 2 persons have voted this message useful |
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