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Iversen’s Multiconfused Log (see p.1!) | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : Language Learning Log |  | |
 Iversen Super Polyglot Moderator Denmark berejst.dk Joined 6702 days ago 9078 posts - 16473 votes  Speaks: Danish*, French, English, German, Italian, Spanish, Portuguese, Dutch, Swedish, Esperanto, Romanian, Catalan Studies: Afrikaans, Greek, Norwegian, Russian, Serbian, Icelandic, Latin, Irish, Lowland Scots, Indonesian, Polish, Croatian Personal Language Map | Message 1625 of 3959 09 January 2010 at 12:55pm | IP Logged | ||
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Well, I can't be not too happy about the results of this attempt to write in Russian, - though the number of gross grammatical errors is fortunately limited this time. The stylistic questions are interesting. I'm glad that my 'pixie' was accepted, but I did in fact intend to portray the pixies as small independent businessmen: in one of my first versions I had even made them into private craftsmen (on the basis that they delivered concrete services to farmers in exchange for porridge and housing). I changed it because they actually don't have a contract with the farmer and just do what they themselves chose to do. However I kept the general idea that they where self-employed minor business men, - and certainly not hired farmhands or (even worse) worksmen for Santa.
"Юлениссен" is taken directly from the list in Wikipedia ('Julenissen' in Danish, definite form, singular). If you have a pixie family at your farm then it will be the head of that family, but small farms might only have one pixie, and then it is him (if he is male). And in Christmas when he is wearing his red bonnet he is called 'the Christmas pixie'. But actually this bonnet - which is used even by big boss Santa - was once the usual bonnet of country people in Denmark , - just as the robe and 'ruff' (a complicated white collar) is a direct survival of the clothes worn by upper class people and clerics in the renaissance (around 1500). IT: E molto sorprendente, ma ho visto una serie di eccellenti programmi in lingua Italiana su Raiuno! Prima c'era un programma sulla salute ed il benessere, dove una striscia di professori e medici commentavano su vari tipi di problemi di salute - prevalentemente quelli che si sviluppano a poco a poco o che vengono preferenzialmente con l'età. Per esempio si ha parlato della sordità, che sarà un problema grave per le generazioni attuale che hanno ascoltato la musica troppo alta durante tutta la vita. Si e detto anche che oggi si da gli impiantati cochleari ai bimbi perché i primi anni sono così inmportanti per lo sviluppa della lingua - questo non può sorprendere nessuno qui, poiché abbiamo spesso discutato sull'importanza dei primi anni. Dare un impiantato a un bambino dopo i primi cinque anni vuol dire che questa persona rischerà di mai imparare la sua lingua nativa come un vero parlante nativo l'ha fatto. Poi ho visto un programma che trattava dello spaccio di monete false. Dato che l'Italia si trova nella zona di Euro, abbiamo visto come distinguere banconote false dai biglietti genuini: il filo di sicurezzo, l'olografia che cambia di colore, la "filigrana" ('watermark') nella zona bianca a destra e finalmente il trapezo con la superficie ruvida. Ma i falsificatori sono anche abili, è c'è una lotta continua tra loro e la legge. Infatti si può anche incontrare monete false. Ma le monete di 1 € e di 2 € hanno un segreto: la parte centrale e SOLO la parte centrale dev'essere magnetica, altremente la moneta è falsa. E peraltro le banconote false sone e più rare e più costose delle autentiche, - per esempio un certo biglietto falso di mille lire vale mille dollari sul mercato dei collezzionisti di moneta. --------- Against expectation Raiuno has had a long row of excelent programs today (right now a lot of children are trying to make "pollo thai con tagliatelle di riso e broccoli", - I don't think I have to translate that (I hate broccoli!)). But I started out with an hourlong program about wellness and health, first and foremost about those illnesses and weaknesses that develop gradually. And of course the consequences of the insane noise in our society was mentioned - it will be a true miracle if we don't get inundated by stonedeaf elderly people when those modern youngsters get old. It was also mentioned that cochlear implants are now made on babys of less than 18 months because any delay has serious consequences for the development of their native language. Afterwards I saw a program about false money, with very detailed and very precise information about the things you have to be aware of with your Euros: watermarks, security threads, a rough trapezioidal area and other features of genuine bills (and presumably also by the very best forgeries, which is why they don't get discovered)- I learnt at least one new thing, namely that the yellow central area of 1 and 2 Euro coins should be magnetic, but NOT the surrounding silver coloured ring. But how many people carry a miniature magnet around with them when they are shopping? And it is also winter in Italy, - it snows in the Northern half of the country. Edited by Iversen on 10 January 2010 at 3:16pm 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
 Fasulye Heptaglot Winner TAC 2012 Moderator Germany fasulyespolyglotblog Joined 5846 days ago 5460 posts - 6006 votes 1 sounds Speaks: German*, DutchC1, EnglishB2, French, Italian, Spanish, Esperanto Studies: Latin, Danish, Norwegian, Turkish Personal Language Map | Message 1626 of 3959 10 January 2010 at 2:38pm | IP Logged | ||
ITA: Nella Germania esiste sopratutto un problema con banconoti falsi di 50 EUR, per questo la maggioranza dei negozi controlla il biglietto per un pennarello bianco, quando pago con un biglietto di 50 EUR. Non ho saputo che vale la pena falsificare anche monete di 1 EUR o 2 EUR per i criminali. Non si legge niente di questo qui. Fasulye Edited by Fasulye on 10 January 2010 at 2:39pm 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Iversen Super Polyglot Moderator Denmark berejst.dk Joined 6702 days ago 9078 posts - 16473 votes Speaks: Danish*, French, English, German, Italian, Spanish, Portuguese, Dutch, Swedish, Esperanto, Romanian, Catalan Studies: Afrikaans, Greek, Norwegian, Russian, Serbian, Icelandic, Latin, Irish, Lowland Scots, Indonesian, Polish, Croatian Personal Language Map | Message 1627 of 3959 11 January 2010 at 3:43am | IP Logged | ||
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ZDF hat diese Nacht eine ganze Reihe von interessante Sendungen gezeigt: zuerst habe ich ein Programm über das alte Gilgamesh-Epos gesehen (und auf Video aufgenommen). Wir kennen es hauptsächlich in der Version eines Assyrischen Schreibers namens Sin-liqe-unninni, die im Bibliothek des Assyrerkönig Assurbanipal gefunden wurde. Tatsächlich hat man aber genug Hinweise and Bruchstücke älterer Versionen gefunden, um feststellen zu können, daß die Erzählungen viel älter sind. Die Version vom Herrn Unninni wurde vermutlichen zwischen 1300 und 1000 v.Chr. geschrieben, aber Gilgamesh wird tatsächlich auf einer einzigen Einschrift als Sumerischer König von Uruk erwähnt, was so was wie 2500-2700 v.Chr. bedeuten würde - also ganz am Anfang der Historischen Zeitalters.
Bekanntlich haben die Sumerer die Keilschrift erfunden, und sie wurde von Babylonier und Assyrier weitergeführt. Dabei hat das alte Sumerische Sprache eine ähnliche Stellung wie Latein im Europäischen Mittelalter erhalten, und alte Traditionen und alte Schriften konnten darum von Generation zu Generation weitergegeben werden. Danach kam eine Sendung über dem legendären Priesterkönigs Johannes, und jetzt geht eine Serie über dem Niebenlungenlied zu Ende, - ganz einfach weil fast alle Mitwirkende jetzt tot sind. Aber Hagen und ... neh, jetzt hat Kriemhild eigenhändigt den Hagen getötet. König Dietrich von 'Bern' lebt noch (er wird mit dem Gothenkönig Theoderic identifiziert, und 'Bern' ist in der Tat Verona in Italien). Neh, jetzt ist er auch tot... und Siegfried ist schon lange Tot. Aber noch gibt es Leute, die immer voller Ernst den Niebelungenschatz im Rhein suchen, wo Hagen ihn angeblich versenkt hätte vor so was wie 1600 Jahren (wo das Burgundenreich zugrunde gegangen sei). Die 'Schleife' an Gernsheim sollte das Favoritort der Schatzsucher sein. Ich würde doch sehr überrascht, wenn das Rheingold irgendwann wieder auftauchen sollte. Und im Norddeutschland gibt es Schneekaos im Kielwasser des Tiefes Daisy.. --- Oh. I nearly forgot the translation. I have been watching an uninterrupted string of interesting programs from the German public channel ZDF. The first one was about the Gilgamesh epic, which was found on12 Cuneiform tablets in the private library of the Assyrian king Assurbanipal. Actually it seems that Gilgamesh was a Sumerian king from around 1500-2700 BC, and the tablets were written by a scribe around 1300-1000 BC, but there are references and fragments that are much older, and on one inscription Gilgamesh is actually included in a list over kings of the Sumerian town Uruk. In one section of the poem Gilgamesh visits Utnapishtim, who survived the deluge at therefore became immortal. The arcehologist Leonard Wolley actually found a thick layer of clay from a deluge in another Sumerian town Ur, which in the Bible is named as Abraham's howntown. So it can not be too surprising that there also is a passage about the deluge in the Bible, - though it is debatable whether the Jews took their version directly from the Gilgamesh epic or from an older, now lost source. After Gilgamesh ZDF showed a program about the mythical 'Priester-king John' (or Johannes). At the time of Pope Alexander III and emperor Frederik Barbarossa a letter turned up that claimed that a strong Christian king somewhere in the East was ready to help the European powers against the Moslem, who at this time were systematically reconquering Palestina, including the holy town Yeruschalajim. In fact the letter was a forgery and there were no such strong Christian king in Asia, but it is not quite clear who made the forgery. After this a series of programs that told the whole of the Niebelungen lied, interspersed with psychological and literary interpretations plus a precious few historical details - I would have preferred a shorter program with just the historical background, which includes the moribund Burgund Kingdom (with its internal dynastical intrigues), the shortlived kingdom of Attila the Hun and the Gothic kingdom of Nortern Italy (Dietrich von Bern is allegedly Theoderic of Verona). For me the most interesting thing was the information near the end about certain treasure hunters, who in all earnest still search for the Niebelungen treasure, which was hidden at the bottom of the Rhine by Hagen. I'll be extremely surprised if this 'Rheingold' should happen to turn up again... Edited by Iversen on 11 January 2010 at 4:27pm 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Fasulye Heptaglot Winner TAC 2012 Moderator Germany fasulyespolyglotblog Joined 5846 days ago 5460 posts - 6006 votes 1 sounds Speaks: German*, DutchC1, EnglishB2, French, Italian, Spanish, Esperanto Studies: Latin, Danish, Norwegian, Turkish Personal Language Map | Message 1628 of 3959 11 January 2010 at 9:16am | IP Logged | ||
Meine Korrekturen: "der Tod" als Sustantiv, aber "tot" als Adjektiv oder Prädikatsnomen Daraus folgt: ... weil fast alle Mitwirkende jetzt tot sind. Nee, jetzt ist er auch tot. ... und Siegfried ist schon lange tot. Fasulye Edited by Fasulye on 11 January 2010 at 9:58am 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Fasulye Heptaglot Winner TAC 2012 Moderator Germany fasulyespolyglotblog Joined 5846 days ago 5460 posts - 6006 votes 1 sounds Speaks: German*, DutchC1, EnglishB2, French, Italian, Spanish, Esperanto Studies: Latin, Danish, Norwegian, Turkish Personal Language Map | Message 1629 of 3959 11 January 2010 at 12:43pm | IP Logged | ||
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DES EXCELLENTS PODCASTS DE L'ASTRONOMIE EN FRANÇAIS
Levi m'a donné une très bonne recommendation des podcasts du magazine "Ciel & Espace" sur beaucoup de thèmes importants de l'astronomie. J'ai déjà écouté quelques episodes et j'ai abonné le newsletter de "Ciel & Espace" Voici le link: http://www.cieletespaceradio.fr/index.php/2009/11/16/624-les -lecons-de-lastronome Fasulye 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Iversen Super Polyglot Moderator Denmark berejst.dk Joined 6702 days ago 9078 posts - 16473 votes Speaks: Danish*, French, English, German, Italian, Spanish, Portuguese, Dutch, Swedish, Esperanto, Romanian, Catalan Studies: Afrikaans, Greek, Norwegian, Russian, Serbian, Icelandic, Latin, Irish, Lowland Scots, Indonesian, Polish, Croatian Personal Language Map | Message 1630 of 3959 11 January 2010 at 4:36pm | IP Logged | ||
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Je vais écouter quelques leçons d'astronomie de ce site ce soir, - et c'est déjà un bon signe qu'il y a tant de leçons d'une telle longueur. J'ai vu qu'on peut les télécharger, si besoin est.
Und ich habe dreimal "tod" in "tot" im deutschen Text umgewandelt. Übrigens fuhr ZDF nach dem Niebelungenlied mit einer Sendung über 'Himmelmenschen' von Peru fort, aber um 4 Uhr mußte ich leider schlafen gehen. Edited by Iversen on 28 January 2010 at 3:22pm 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Iversen Super Polyglot Moderator Denmark berejst.dk Joined 6702 days ago 9078 posts - 16473 votes Speaks: Danish*, French, English, German, Italian, Spanish, Portuguese, Dutch, Swedish, Esperanto, Romanian, Catalan Studies: Afrikaans, Greek, Norwegian, Russian, Serbian, Icelandic, Latin, Irish, Lowland Scots, Indonesian, Polish, Croatian Personal Language Map | Message 1631 of 3959 12 January 2010 at 1:47am | IP Logged | ||
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FR: Je viens d'écouter une des causeries astronomiques en français du site indiqué par Fasulye. Et bien qu'il n'y a pas des images, je suis bien content d'avoir pris connaissance de cette source excéllente de savoir scientifique. L'enregistrement et la diction sont très clairs, et il ne faut pas être un spécialiste pour comprendre de quoi il s'ait - mais le contenu est aussi assez concret pour qu'on puisse vraiment apprendre quelque chose sur la science, au lieu d'avoir seulement vingt minutes de divertissement. Si besoin est, on peut télécharger ces leçons.
Le thème de cette première causerie a été une classe d'étoiles très lourdes et extrêmement lumineuses, appellées aussi des étoiles 'bleues' parce que leur lumière visible s'étend plus vers la coté bleue dans le spectre. Notre soleil, qui est catégorisé comme un nain jaune, va avoir une longue vie de plusieurs dizaines de milliards d'années, mais ces étoiles prodigeuses auront un vie courte, dans certains cas justement quelques millions d'années. Pourtant on connait un bon nombre d'elles parce qu'elles sont tellement visibles. Nous avons en danois l'expression "brænde sit lys i begge ender". Les français disent "brûler sa chandelle par les deux bouts", et c'est exactement ce que font ces étoiles. J'ai aussi étudié un texte russe sur le 'Père Hiver', mais j'ai déjà commenté abondamment sur ce thème, et maintenant que nous avons passé le jour des trois mages, il est aussi un peu trop tard pour encore des discours sur le noël russe. -------- I have been studying a Russian text about 'Father Winter', but I havge already written about this theme, and it is also a bit late for Christmas related themes now. However I have also listened to the first of the lectures about astronomy at the French site mentioned by Fasulye. And even without pictures it was very interesting: the recording is very clear, and it is not a problem to hear every single word that is said. The level of the content is fairly high, but without mathematics, - I would say that you really can learn something from this source instead of just being entertained. The theme was the blue superheavy stars, who can have a life as short as a few million years, whereas a yellow dwarf as our sun typically survive for tens of billions of years. It is not too much to say that these stars 'burn their candle at both ends' (similar expressions exist in both Danish and French). And finally I would like to mention that I have listened to the news about the Northern Irish prime minister who has had to resign from his post because his wife has had an affair with a 19 years old man. I could understand this if it was the prime minister himself who had had an affair with that person ... well, we shan't discuss moral or politics here. I just want to mention that several interviewees spoke English with a clear Irish accent, and hurray for that. We don't hear this accent often enough here in Denmark. Edited by Iversen on 12 January 2010 at 2:03am 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Iversen Super Polyglot Moderator Denmark berejst.dk Joined 6702 days ago 9078 posts - 16473 votes Speaks: Danish*, French, English, German, Italian, Spanish, Portuguese, Dutch, Swedish, Esperanto, Romanian, Catalan Studies: Afrikaans, Greek, Norwegian, Russian, Serbian, Icelandic, Latin, Irish, Lowland Scots, Indonesian, Polish, Croatian Personal Language Map | Message 1632 of 3959 14 January 2010 at 2:35pm | IP Logged | ||
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my my I didn't write in my log yesterday, and it has already sunk several pages - just because you people here are so extremely industrious. Kudos!
I was busy yesterday evening with other projects, but did find time to study some more of the quaint Irish grammar, and also to have a look at a genuine text with machine translation from the internet: the article about the Andromeda Galaxy in the Irish Wikipedia 'Vicipéid'. And that way I could also test my Collins dictionary. It didn't perform well faced with the expression "réaltra bíseach' = spiral galaxy (réaltra from "réal", star), where it tried to convince me that "bíseach" really just means 'improvement'. There were several other examples of this kind, but given the size of the dictionary I still got most of the information I needed, and I don't regret having bought it. As for the grammar, well - it has lots of information (and it was the only one they had at Foyle's in London), but the way it is organized isn't ideal. For instance the verbal forms are presented in one chapter per form, but the order is: Imperative, Preterite, Present, Future, Conditional, Imperfect. The prime position of the imperative can be justified insofar Irish verbs in a dictionary are cited in the imperative - but after that the logic breaks down - anyone but a specialist in Irish would have described the Present next, followed by either the two futuric or the two past tenses. Besides it would have been practical to have some semblance of a complete table in an appendix, if not in the text, and I can't see the logic in illustrating different forms with different verbs. But thanks to my printout from Wikipedia I can more or less grasp the whole system now. and once you know it you can use the details given in the grammar. And the system is funny. Verbs are inflected in person and number, but sometimes with an ending attached to the root, sometimes a 'neutral' verbform plus a free pronoun after the verb. Besides the imperfect and the conditional have lenition (which modifies the first consonant, e.g. b- --> bh- /v/) or other changes (d' before vowels and f). I have read some material from the Danish "Sprognævn" (which is an advisory board concerning our language), and here is a hyperliteral translation of a central passage: "Det viser sig at de unge især er negative over for de engelske lån It shows self that the young particularly are negative over for the English loans hvis der i forvejen er et tilsvarende dansk ord, if there in before-way is a till-answering (= corresponding) Danish word, eller hvis man meget let kan danne ét. Det gør sig fx [for eksempel] gældende ved et ord som serialkiller, or if man very easy can form one. It does self for instance valid(ing) with a word like serial killer, mens ord som downloade, chatte og stand-up-comedy accepteres og bruges af langt flere af de unge. while words like download, chat and stand-up comedy (stå-op-komedie) accepted(self) and used(self) by far more of the young, Ville de have coastere eller coasters, ville de foretrække interview eller interviewer eller det engelske interviews? Would they have coastere or coasters, would they prefer interview or interviewer or the English interviews? Det helt entydige resultat var at de adspurgte altid foretrak -s-formen. The wholly one-decoding result was that the to-asked always preferred -s-formThe. Mht. [med hensyn til] stavemåde foretrak de unge i vid udstrækning den engelske. With regard to spelling fore-dragged [=preferred] the young in wide extension the English (one). Disse præferencer må Sprognævnet tage med i sine overvejelser ved kommende udgaver af Retskrivningsordbogen." These preferences must Language-commitee-The take with in its over-weighings (=deliberations) at coming editions of the RightWritingWordbook. Edited by Iversen on 15 January 2010 at 1:49am 1 person has voted this message useful |
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