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Serpent’s cyclic log: César, Sleipnir,adv | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : Language Learning Log |  | |
| BAnna Triglot Senior Member United States Joined 4621 days ago 409 posts - 616 votes  Speaks: English*, German, Spanish Studies: Russian, Turkish | Message 225 of 264 23 February 2015 at 5:59pm | IP Logged | ||
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I am not a native Spanish speaker, but my husband is (from Central America, so it's the Latin American variety). He uses "creo" all the time to mean different things ranging from: I definitely think so, probably yes, I believe, I sort of think, I'm pretty sure, I'm not so sure or I don't believe so (creo que no ..), my opinion is ...a lot depends on the context and tone.
I don't know Italian, so cannot help there on the influence of credere. Hopefully a native or advanced Spanish speaker with a good knowledge of Italian will weigh in on this. 2 persons have voted this message useful | |||
| Serpent Octoglot Senior Member Russian Federation serpent-849.livejour Joined 6596 days ago 9753 posts - 15779 votes 4 sounds Speaks: Russian*, English, FinnishC1, Latin, German, Italian, Spanish, Portuguese Studies: Danish, Romanian, Polish, Belarusian, Ukrainian, Croatian, Slovenian, Catalan, Czech, Galician, Dutch, Swedish | Message 226 of 264 23 February 2015 at 6:33pm | IP Logged | ||
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Thanks for your comment! I agree that it depends on the tone etc and that's why I even posted the video on the previous page. The way he said it definitely sounded strange to me. Maybe he just accidentally put too much emphasis on creo because he spoke quite slowly. Or maybe I'm indeed reading too much into it :P (or actually listening)
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| Serpent Octoglot Senior Member Russian Federation serpent-849.livejour Joined 6596 days ago 9753 posts - 15779 votes 4 sounds Speaks: Russian*, English, FinnishC1, Latin, German, Italian, Spanish, Portuguese Studies: Danish, Romanian, Polish, Belarusian, Ukrainian, Croatian, Slovenian, Catalan, Czech, Galician, Dutch, Swedish | Message 227 of 264 11 March 2015 at 4:27pm | IP Logged | ||
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I finally got the golden activity badge for the first time!!! So happy :)))) also because I got it by watching a very special match ♥ It was Real-Schalke04 Luka Modrić is back after being out for 114 days. And Cristiano scored two, so I was really happy I happened to be watching in Portuguese because of the badge. OMG, I might have watched in German otherwise. Ouch, I'm glad I didn't.
I've recently, eh, cruised through "Death on the Nile" by Agatha Christie (thanks to Criminal Case). I expected to get the badge yesterday morning but realized I hadn't watched enough football in Portuguese :D OMG this badge is *hard* to get, at least if you learn several languages but probably also if you learn one. I'm so impressed by everyone who has it, really. Also got the third star. Portuguese probably won't remain my best SC language for long, but this is nice anyway. 
4 persons have voted this message useful | |||
| Cavesa Triglot Senior Member Czech Republic Joined 5008 days ago 3277 posts - 6779 votes Speaks: Czech*, FrenchC2, EnglishC1 Studies: Spanish, German, Italian | Message 228 of 264 12 March 2015 at 3:02pm | IP Logged | ||
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Congratulations, Serpent! I really admire your dedication to learning so many languages
so actively at once. By the way, I accidentally found a lyrics training clone but it is dedicated to the same languages (perhaps one more, not sure now). But have you found others for you "obscure" languages, please? Swedish, Polish and so on appear to go unnoticed by lyrics training totally. 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| 1e4e6 Octoglot Senior Member United Kingdom Joined 4289 days ago 1013 posts - 1588 votes Speaks: English*, French, Spanish, Portuguese, Norwegian, Dutch, Swedish, Italian Studies: German, Danish, Russian, Catalan | Message 229 of 264 12 March 2015 at 8:48pm | IP Logged | ||
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"creer" and "credere" are used in this same purpose in both Spanish and Italian.
Almost always do I use "creer que" and "credere che" regardless of the degree of possibility. If you want to introduce less certainty, "creo que es posible que [subjuntivo]" is natural. The same analogy can be used in Italian. The big difference is in the subordinate clause, like suzukaze mentioned, Spanish uses indicative after "creo que...", whilst Italian uses the subjunctive after "credo che". But both take the subjunctive if you negate them. There are some constructions that can take either subjunctive or indicative based on degree of possibility, but "creer que" is not one of them, neither are others like "suponer que", "pensar que", "calcular que", etc. Quizás venga Quizás viene are both correct, but creo que venga is completely wrong. Not even in informal language nor dialect can this be used, because "creer que" is a "non-negotiable" unless you negate it. About Ancelotti's Spanish, I have heard quite a few interviews of him in Spanish, and he speaks quite well. The grammar is basically correct overall. His speed is more Italian though, as in slower, but most languages sound slower compared to Spanish anyway. Regarding "lesser known languages", in 1993 when I started school, when I came home I used to read through a phrasebook that my mother bought in the mid 1980s. It was for travel to the USSR and Warsaw Pact countries, so I tried to learn the Cyrillic alphabet and some Czech phrases. I still remember saying "dobrý deň" to people to greet them although I lived in an Anglophone country. Edited by 1e4e6 on 12 March 2015 at 10:13pm 2 persons have voted this message useful | |||
| Expugnator Hexaglot Senior Member Brazil Joined 5165 days ago 3335 posts - 4349 votes Speaks: Portuguese*, Norwegian, French, English, Italian, Papiamento Studies: Mandarin, Georgian, Russian | Message 230 of 264 12 March 2015 at 9:40pm | IP Logged | ||
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Just don't use them in Portuguese (but that I guess you already know). Use 'eu acho' informally and "Eu acredito", "Eu entendo" or *nothing* in formal contexts.
Serpent, I liked your reports on your Spanish learning and I expect to read more and more qualitative rather than quantitative/competitive reports ;) What did this batch make for your learning and for your understanding of the lusophone culture? 2 persons have voted this message useful | |||
| Serpent Octoglot Senior Member Russian Federation serpent-849.livejour Joined 6596 days ago 9753 posts - 15779 votes 4 sounds Speaks: Russian*, English, FinnishC1, Latin, German, Italian, Spanish, Portuguese Studies: Danish, Romanian, Polish, Belarusian, Ukrainian, Croatian, Slovenian, Catalan, Czech, Galician, Dutch, Swedish | Message 231 of 264 12 March 2015 at 10:42pm | IP Logged | ||
edit: I really doubt that some languages are objectively spoken faster than others. And purely subjectively Italian and Spanish are equally fast to me. But yeah the intonation and emphasis vary a lot depending on the speed, and in my opinion if Ancelotti wanted to sound calm and confident, he wasn't very convincing. How do you deal with the Spanish tener hecho structure btw? If you use it, do people ever take it as interference from your other Romance languages? @Expugnator, that was mostly what emk described as consolidation [and cheating] :) I'm on my way to advanced fluency, although my grammar is definitely nowhere near good enough. Progress is slower at this stage... I liked the expression "um jogo de grande cartaz" for example. in Russian I would use something with the word вывеска btw :) Thanks for pointing it out about crer btw. I've never thought of it explicitly but if someone used it, this would sound like a direct translation from English to me. So it can also be Portunhol then. What exactly would you want to know? basically Spanish is like a sunny Mediterranean vacation. (European) Portuguese is like standing on the edge of Cabo da Roca and trying not to fall, and then finding a safe path towards the cool majestic ocean. Guess which one is more fun ;) Lol I've not done either thing really, sorry for the cheesy comparison. I'm mostly referring to the shortage of materials and the sometimes excessive prescriptivism. But no other Romance language resonates like that with me. Or maybe it's just that there's only one Moonspell. Edited by Serpent on 12 March 2015 at 10:57pm 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| 1e4e6 Octoglot Senior Member United Kingdom Joined 4289 days ago 1013 posts - 1588 votes Speaks: English*, French, Spanish, Portuguese, Norwegian, Dutch, Swedish, Italian Studies: German, Danish, Russian, Catalan | Message 232 of 264 12 March 2015 at 11:17pm | IP Logged | ||
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In which context is "tener hecho" used? It is a Spanish construction, but it is used
for very specific cases. "tener + [participio pasado]" refers to something usually done and/or ready. For example, A: Y la paella, ¿la has empezado a preparar? B: Sí, y además, ya la tengo hecha which means that the paella is ready and done. It does not refer to the action of preparing it. But if you mean that you are using it like a presente de perfecto like "he hecho" and you say "Tengo hecho una buena sopa de mariscos" as a direct substitution for "He hecho una buena sopa de mariscos", then that is incorrect, and would most likely be taken as interefence from a language that uses "tener" instead, like Portuguese, or even Gallego. Edited by 1e4e6 on 12 March 2015 at 11:23pm 1 person has voted this message useful |
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