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How do you count words? | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : Learning Techniques, Methods & Strategies |  | |
| nway Senior Member United States youtube.com/user/Vic Joined 5350 days ago 574 posts - 1707 votes  Speaks: English* Studies: Spanish, Mandarin, Japanese, Korean | Message 9 of 19 06 January 2012 at 7:47pm | IP Logged | |||||
Well, I don't...
I don't do that either. I guess I just have a different mindset when it comes to language studies. Do native speakers, or their parents or teachers, track their word counts as children? I can't recall ever measuring my childhood English progress via word count, and my English turned out just fine, so I'll stick with what's worked for me in the past. :) Anyway, I can certainly see the utility of maintaining a list of vocabulary that one has studied, and I suppose deriving a word count from that is a natural outcome. That's fine. I've made some vocabulary lists of my own; I've just never bothered to take note of how many words were actually on them. Edited by nway on 06 January 2012 at 7:55pm 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| Flarioca Heptaglot Senior Member Brazil Joined 5817 days ago 635 posts - 816 votes Speaks: Portuguese*, Esperanto, French, EnglishC2, Spanish, German, Italian Studies: Catalan, Mandarin | Message 10 of 19 06 January 2012 at 9:10pm | IP Logged | |||||
There are many good reasons to keep track of word count. Of course, the more words you know, the merrier. But, unfortunatelly (or not) life is finite and we won't be able to learn all words in all languages. So it is a question of optimization. My English is far from perfect, as you can easily spot. However, instead of keep learning English, I decided to learn other languages, for in English I'm already able to read/listen to whatever interests me and even discuss complex subjects with native speakers, I hope. So, it is very helpful to really have a better idea about how many (and hopefully "which", if that could be possible) words one needs to have a reasonable comprehension of a given language. That will guide your efforts in a better way. Moreover, different methods and strategies will result in different learning speeds. We all, for sure, want to learn as fast as we can. So, if we realize which methods work for better for which kind of learner, than, again, we optimize the process. For "kind of learner" I mean any possible differences, including time available to study, distance from L1 to L2 etc. Edited by Flarioca on 06 January 2012 at 9:27pm 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| Flarioca Heptaglot Senior Member Brazil Joined 5817 days ago 635 posts - 816 votes Speaks: Portuguese*, Esperanto, French, EnglishC2, Spanish, German, Italian Studies: Catalan, Mandarin | Message 11 of 19 06 January 2012 at 9:14pm | IP Logged | |||||
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By the way, thanks Jeffers and Iversen. I'm reading that book right now and from my point of view, as said above, this should be considered as language learning time well spent.
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| Camundonguinho Triglot Senior Member Brazil Joined 4684 days ago 273 posts - 500 votes Speaks: Portuguese*, English, Spanish Studies: Swedish | Message 12 of 19 06 January 2012 at 9:24pm | IP Logged | |||||
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I get the dictionary and learn only words I don't know. It worked for my Spanish.
If a dictionary has 20 000 words, and I need to learn 5000 words, I'm good ;') Pocket dictionaries are good to do this vocabulary check. You shouldn't miss too many words in a 30 000 word dictionary if you're fluent in a language (B2/C1). Edited by Camundonguinho on 06 January 2012 at 9:45pm 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| nway Senior Member United States youtube.com/user/Vic Joined 5350 days ago 574 posts - 1707 votes Speaks: English* Studies: Spanish, Mandarin, Japanese, Korean | Message 13 of 19 06 January 2012 at 9:54pm | IP Logged | |||||
You don't need a word count to tell you how proficient you are at English. The discussion we're having right now demonstrates your English proficiency to me far more holistically than any word count ever could (not least of which, because native speakers have no idea what "word count" corresponds to what level of fluency, even in their own language).
A far more effective test would simply be to try reading something that interests you, and see how well you understand it, or attempt a conversation with someone, and see how well it goes. A word count cannot substitute the precise feedback of actual real-world engagement. Edited by nway on 06 January 2012 at 9:57pm 2 persons have voted this message useful | ||||||
| Flarioca Heptaglot Senior Member Brazil Joined 5817 days ago 635 posts - 816 votes Speaks: Portuguese*, Esperanto, French, EnglishC2, Spanish, German, Italian Studies: Catalan, Mandarin | Message 14 of 19 06 January 2012 at 10:19pm | IP Logged | |||||
I totally agree with both points. However: 1) Native speakers and native language acquisition are more useful here for comparison reasons. We all know that it is almost impossible to mimick the ideal learning conditions that a native learner has. 2) Word count is just another parameter, as well as inflation, GDP and whatever index you choose will not, alone, allow you a real understanding of a country's economy. Even less if you don't consider the time evolution of each of those parameter. The fisrt point here, I guess, is HOW do we count "known words"? The book mentioned by Jeffers and the many books from ISP Nation, among others, show how hard it is to estimate that. Even the definition of "word" is controversial and hard. The second point is how that might be an useful (not the ultimate) indicator of language proficiency? It helps to set goals, not more than that. I would add that, as I said before, if you could realize how to increase your word count (whatever it is, but hopefully more meaningful) faster, than you improve your method. 2 persons have voted this message useful | ||||||
| Flarioca Heptaglot Senior Member Brazil Joined 5817 days ago 635 posts - 816 votes Speaks: Portuguese*, Esperanto, French, EnglishC2, Spanish, German, Italian Studies: Catalan, Mandarin | Message 15 of 19 06 January 2012 at 10:29pm | IP Logged | |||||
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It is also very clear that those guys involved in these researches are also trying to point out how important vocabulary acquisition is. As you know, there are many "language teaching schools" and not all of them consider vocabulary acquisition so much important.
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| nway Senior Member United States youtube.com/user/Vic Joined 5350 days ago 574 posts - 1707 votes Speaks: English* Studies: Spanish, Mandarin, Japanese, Korean | Message 16 of 19 06 January 2012 at 10:37pm | IP Logged | |||||
Erm, maybe I'm misunderstanding you, but how could vocabulary acquisition not be considered important in language learning? o_O Edited by nway on 06 January 2012 at 10:38pm 1 person has voted this message useful |
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