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10,000 hours of Spanish/Castellano | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : Language Learning Log |  | |
| Alanjazz Triglot Groupie United States Joined 4821 days ago 65 posts - 129 votes  Speaks: English*, Spanish, French Studies: Portuguese | Message 9 of 18 13 March 2013 at 1:58am | IP Logged | ||
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11 de marzo 2013 - Film/película: Una mujer sin amor. dir. Luis Buñuel. 1h25m
12 de marzo 2013 - Reading/lectura: El Principito. por Antoine Saint-Exupéry, traducido por L. Salda. 1h25m Total: 21h55m Pages/paginas: 330 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Alanjazz Triglot Groupie United States Joined 4821 days ago 65 posts - 129 votes Speaks: English*, Spanish, French Studies: Portuguese | Message 10 of 18 17 March 2013 at 5:05pm | IP Logged | ||
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13 de marzo 2013: Reading/lectura: El Principito. 55m.
Film/película: La leonera, dir. por Pablo Trapero. 2h 16 de marzo 2013: Reading/lectura: El Laberinto de la Soledad, por Octavio Paz. 40m. Film/película: El ángel exterminador, dir. Luis Buñuel, 1h30m. Writing/escritura: Comentario en Lang-8 sobre 'El Cairo nuevo" por Mahfuz 1h Speaking/conversación: Skype con un amigo español 30m Tiempo total a añadir: 6h35m Paginas a añadir: 60 Total: 28h30m Paginas: 390 Alright! About .3% finished with my goal! Making strides, though not keeping up enough here. Ever had the issue of trying to decide which order to learn foreign languages in? I sat down yesterday and finally wrote it all out: a set of criterion that I scaled from 1-10 in order to determine the order I would go in. They were: 1) Interest in language itself 2) Interest in the culture(s) of the language 3) a. access to jobs, (5) b. countries for working abroad (5) 4) Cinema, literature 5) Romantic possibilities 6) Likelihood of getting to use the language locally 7) Likelihood of getting to use the language in the future (travel, work abroad) 8) Resources currently available for learning the language 9) Internet access 10) Food And as an end result, I wound up with: 1. Italian 75 2. Arabic 72 3. Mandarin 71 4. Russian 69 5. Portuguese 68 6. German 67 7. Cantonese 64 8. Swedish 62 9. Thai 61 10. Hindi/Korean 59 11. Swahili 52 12. Hungarian 51 Castellano ¡Vale! Estoy al .03% con mi meta. Ando avanzando, pero no lo noto aquí tanto como debería. ¿Usted ha tenido nunca el problema de escoger la órden en que iba a aprender los idiomas? Me asenté ayer y inventé este sistema para hacerlo. Cada categoría puede haber hasta 10 puntos, hasta un total de 100. 1) Interés en el idioma mismo 2) Interés en las culturas del idioma 3) a. Acceso a trabajos b. Paises donde podría trabajar 4) Cinema, literatura 5) Posibilidades románticas 6) Oportunidad local que tendré para usar el idioma 7) Oportunidad que tendré para usar el idioma en el futuro 8) Rescursos disponibles actualmente para aprender el idioma 9) Acceso en la red 10) Comida Como resultado final, obtuve: 1. Italiano 75 2. Árabe 72 3. Chino mandarin 71 4. Ruso 69 5. Portugués 68 6. Alemán 67 7. Cantonés 64 8. Sueco 62 9. Tailandés 61 10. Hindi/Coreano 59 11. Suajili 52 12. Húngaro 51 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Bakunin Diglot Senior Member Switzerland outerkhmer.blogspot. Joined 5136 days ago 531 posts - 1126 votes Speaks: German*, Thai Studies: Khmer | Message 11 of 18 17 March 2013 at 6:16pm | IP Logged | ||
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I don't think 10'000 hours is crazy in order to really master a language, counting, of course, all activities and not only what you would consider 'study'. To be really proficient or native-like, as stated as your goal, you need not only be familiar with the language at a very high level but also with the cultural and historical background of the country or region, it's literature, cinema, music, religion, food etc. If you get there after 5'000 hours, good on you, but I doubt that 1'000 hours will be enough.
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| Alanjazz Triglot Groupie United States Joined 4821 days ago 65 posts - 129 votes Speaks: English*, Spanish, French Studies: Portuguese | Message 12 of 18 02 April 2013 at 2:47pm | IP Logged | ||
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How fast time passes when you're busy! Here are my recent Spanish activities:
¡Qué rápido pasa el tiempo cuando estás ocupado! Aquí ves mis actividades recientes en castellano: 3/17/13: Podcasts: Notes in Spanish Gold and History of Spain 40m Reading: El laberinto de la soledad, de Paz 45m Film: Todo sobre mi madre, de Almodóvar 1h30m 3/18/13: Reading: El laberinto de soledad, de Paz, 1h15m, 40p total Film: El extraño viaje, de Buñuel, 1h20m 3/23/13: Reading: 2666 de Bolaño, 6h, 145p. 3/25/13: Reading: 2666 de Bolaño, 3h 210p total 3/27/13: Reading, 2666, 15m &nb sp; Film: Monseñor - el último viaje de M. Romero 1h25m 4/1/13: Film: Vacas, de Julio Medem 1h30m Reading: 2666, 30m, 266p total Podcasts: Notes in Spanish Gold 40m Music: 40m, various artists ; ; Time total: 48h Page total: 696 Edited by Alanjazz on 02 April 2013 at 2:48pm 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Alanjazz Triglot Groupie United States Joined 4821 days ago 65 posts - 129 votes Speaks: English*, Spanish, French Studies: Portuguese | Message 13 of 18 06 May 2013 at 4:45am | IP Logged | ||
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Pasó un mes. Sin embargo he continuado con mis estudios. Aquí escribiré lo que he hecho durante ese tiempo.
4/8 música - 45m, notas - 45m, película - El Secreto de sus ojos 1h10m, escritura 30m = 2h55m 4/10 conversación 2h, película - El Secreto de sus ojos 1h lectura 2666, 20m = 3h20m 4/15 película - La piel que habito - 2h 4/16 lectura: 2666 1h 4/17 lectura: 2666 2h30, conversación 2h 4/20 lecciones: Spanish Beyond the Basics (Living Language course) 1h 4/21 película: Hoy y Mañana 1h20m 4/22 lectura: 2666 30m 4/23 lecciones: Spanish Beyond the Basics 3h 4/24 conversación: 2h, 2666 1h 4/25 lectura 30m, jerga española y colombiana 30m 4/26 2666 1h 4/27 SBTB 1h 4/28 ¡Mi cumpleaños! Conversación: 1h30m, película: Caracas - amor a muerte 1h30 4/29 película: Vidas privadas 1h40m 4/30 película: Amores perros 2h30m 5/1 película: Voy a explotar 1h45m, conversación: 2h 5/5 conversación: 4h película: Yo, la peor de todas 1h45m +39h45m Horas: 87h45m Paginas: 926 Estoy seguro que he estudiado un poco más, es que no tomé muy buenas notas de todo lo que he hecho. En todo caso, espero cumplir más horas en mayo que en abril, y aprender mucho más. Gracias por leer, y por favor dame sugerencias de películas. Quiero ver todas que valgan la pena. Edited by Alanjazz on 06 May 2013 at 4:49am 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Avid Learner Diglot Senior Member Canada Joined 4668 days ago 100 posts - 156 votes Speaks: French*, English Studies: German | Message 14 of 18 06 May 2013 at 6:33am | IP Logged | ||
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Wow, you're still very dedicated! :D Keep going! I'm doing about an hour a day.
I know you've revised your goal to 1000, but your title is what made me open this topic, so I can't refrain from commenting. ;) 10 000 hours is needed to become an olympic champion, for example. This is where the number comes from, by comparing to the elite in a sport or activity. To make a valid comparison, that would mean something like winning a Spanish spelling contest or becoming a critically acclaimed writer in Spanish. Edited by Avid Learner on 06 May 2013 at 6:33am 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| casamata Senior Member Joined 4268 days ago 237 posts - 377 votes Studies: Portuguese | Message 15 of 18 06 May 2013 at 9:26am | IP Logged | ||
Hmm, sorry but I think it takes a more than 10,000 hours of dedicated study, speaking, and listening to reach that near-native level (C2) in a language related to your native one. I estimated about 6,100 hours for my Spanish in the last 13 years and I am always aware of my limitations. (For each day I was living abroad, I was conservative and counted eight hours a day because I'm not thinking all the time!) I personally kind of slowed down in my progress after about 5,000 hours and after 9 months living 100% in the language, abroad. After 5,000 hours I felt like a very solid C1. But maybe that is because I am more demanding than others. My friends that have moved to the US and learned English (and are C2 speakers now) told me it took them 10 years living abroad until they were pretty much natives. At a conservative 8 hours a day, that would be 29,200 hours. I personally think that 5 years of 100% immersion is enough for a C2 if the language is close to your starting language, yielding 14,600. The 10,000 rule is not meant to say that you are an "expert" at exactly 10,000 obviously. It may be at 9,000 or 12,000 that you reach that high level, for example. For "sports", maybe archery or a skill sport, but not something that is mostly physical. Not everybody is capable of bench pressing 800 pounds, for example. :) Not trying to be a jerk here, just trying to add some realism to check unrealistic expectations. You can definitely reach an intermediate level relatively quickly in Spanish but I felt like a B2 after 1,000 hours and then C1 at 5,000 but it really slows down after 1,000 hours, I think. Good luck and keep on talking, reading, listening, writing! I recommend the Real Academia Espanola grammar books if you want or wordreference forums for grammar. If you haven't, I recommend these books: El coronel no tiene quien le escriba, la familia de pascual duarte, cien años de soledad (really hard, even for natives. Don't try until you have thousands of hours in), Nada, veinte poemas de amor (poems), escuadra hacia la muerte... I'm not a big fan of the late Carlos Fuentes (mexican) but he's very well-regarded. Music(Mostly pop, alternative, but some rap and jazz): Reik, Julieta venegas, Motel, control machete, calle 13, la quinta estación, la oreja de van gogh, aleks syntek, aventura, Bacilos, Camila, Jesse and Joy, Juanes, Los enanitos verdes, Maná, olga román, EARLY Shakira music, Rubén Blades. Edit: I see that you watched "Amores Perros". I watched it at about 1,000 hours before going abroad, and I understood the basics. After coming back to the US, at 5,000 hours, it was as if a veil was lifted and I could hear everything and understand *almost* every word/sentence. It is hard-core, urban Mexican Spanish, so it should take a long time to fully understand. Analogy: B2 would be like making your HS basketball team. C1: making a good Division 1 basketball team. C2: NBA, takes a LOT more effort than going from A1-B2 or B2 to C1. "I think that even 1000 hours would be a great accomplishment, and I would probably speak Spanish at a C2 level at that point." First off, this is absolutely not going to happen. Let's say that you count 10 hours of daily actual dedicated Spanish living abroad,that is barely more than 3 months. At 100 days you will not be at the level of a native speaker. And if you think so, you will really just be lying to yourself. You would be at about a B2 level if you work damn hard. Perhaps a B1 level would be achieved with 3.25 months crammed because it's not enough time for stuff to solidify in your head. It is really a marathon to get good at a language, not a sprint. If you really are at a B1 level right now, you will probably be farther than B2 after 1,000 hours but far from C1. I saw that you want to learn Colombian Spanish. Well, a C2 speaker will be able to understand ALL of this informal Colombian movie without having to concentrate that much; it will be pleasant. Perro come perro is hard as $#@*( to understand. I literally get about 50% of the words when somewhat focused and if I close my eyes and *really* focus, maybe 60%. It's gonna take MANY thousands of hours to get it all. Good luck. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G2iczAPCdn4 Finally, in case you wanted corrections (and I apologize for correcting you if you don't): "EL orden" means "the order of something" whereas "LA orden" is a "command" like in the military. Edited by casamata on 06 May 2013 at 5:44pm 3 persons have voted this message useful | |||
| Alanjazz Triglot Groupie United States Joined 4821 days ago 65 posts - 129 votes Speaks: English*, Spanish, French Studies: Portuguese | Message 16 of 18 15 May 2013 at 6:22pm | IP Logged | ||
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Avid learner, thanks for reading :)
Casamata, thank you for your response. Thanks for your correction too, I always appreciate it, as long as it's well-intentioned (because I have been in situations where it is meant as more of a jab at my level of Spanish than coming from a place of wanting to help me along. Probably every language learner has been in this situation.) We'll have to see what happens with my level. At the moment, I am planning on taking the C1 exam in August, and my goal is to have as many hours of Spanish as possible logged before that point. I am going to try to change to the Spanish department at my job, and so add more hours during the day. If I fail the exam, fine, if I pass it, even better. Either way, it will motivate me to work harder. I am going to start a Spanish movie club with other Spanish enthusiasts in my town and so that should be fun. It isn't very important to me whether or not my estimation of reaching C2 at 1000 hours is correct or not. What matters is reaching the highest level possible, logging as much time as I can, and moving to Colombia or another Spanish-speaking country as soon as I can. Thanks for your music and movie suggestions, I didn't know about many of them, and I am always excited about new movies :) I will post the next update soon. I should really get into a habit of doing this daily so I don't miss a minute. I am also going to look for job opportunities in Colombia. That's where I would like to learn, ideally, but Argentina, Mexico and Peru also seem interesting. AND I don't want to teach English. 2 persons have voted this message useful |
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