Pronounce it perfectly in french (Language Programs, Books & Tapes) Language Learning Forum

Pronounce it perfectly in french
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nystagmatic
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Message 9 of 16

02 February 2014 at 4:29am | IP Logged

Are these books made specifically for native English speakers (i.e. do they assume proficiency with the phonemes of English), or are they helpful also for native speakers of other languages?
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luke
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Message 10 of 16

02 February 2014 at 9:07am | IP Logged

I've only gone through the first bit of the book introducing the International Phonetic Alphabet, but from what I've seen so far is that Pronounce it Perfectly in French does compare American English sounds to French. For example, it says the "d" sound in French donne is somewhat like the "d" sound in the English word "done". It does this on the recording too. I actually haven't found this comparison very helpful. As you know, there are several French sounds that do not exist in English. The book and recording mention this, but they still try to gvie an example of an word in English that sounds a bit like the French sound.

I listened to a couple of the recordings that daristani linked to above for the "D'accord..." book. Those are almost entirely in French. The book for that accompanies those recordings costs over $100 though. Those recordings may be helpful on their own and I may listen to them more systematically after I do the Pronounce it Perfectly course.
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Jeffers
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Message 11 of 16

03 February 2014 at 2:24pm | IP Logged

One criticism I have seen of Pronounce it Perfectly in French is that it focuses too much
on sounds made in isolation, and doesn't give enough time (or possibly doesn't even give
any time) to how sounds are made in words, phrases and sentences.

Let us know if you think this is the case.
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luke
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Message 12 of 16

08 April 2014 at 7:44am | IP Logged

French Pronounce it Perfectly in French has a new 3rd edition. Almost everything that is in French is recorded, although there is a good bit of English on the recordings. I'm not familiar with the earlier editions.

The course starts by covering the International Phonetic Alphabets (IPA).
Part one covers the vowels. (90 pages)
Part two covers consonants. (25 pages)

Those two parts are mostly the sounds within words, rather than phrases or sentences. There are two or three brief dialogues to practice the vowels or consonants.

Part three covers word patterns and intonation (18 pages)
They discuss liaison, enchainement, elision and intonation. The liaison part, which is only about 7 pages was the most helpful for me.

Part four is called "More Practice in Context for Enrichment". (25 pages)
Included here are popular French phrases, some poetry, proverbs, a few passages from literature, some tongue twisters, jokes, and riddles. Don't expect too much from the jokes/riddles.

The 3rd edition adds 3 lessons:
About 20 famous French quotations.
About 25 French words that may be heard mispronounced in English. (bonbons, haute couture, madame, monsieur, tout de suite)
A set of 20 words in French that are to be written in the IPA.

Overall, I found the course worthwhile. The focus on pronunciation helped me focus a bit more on that aspect of speaking. There are some relatively low frequency words that could be thought of as vocabulary in the first 2 parts of the book. For me, words in isolation aren't very sticky, so I wouldn't recommend the book to learn new words. If I used a highlighter, that might put them in my grasp. A lot of the words are common though.

The sayings, poetry, and literary passages are the part that has some draw for listening a few more times. That's a small portion of the course though. These sections are spoken slowly, like some of the early lessons in Assimil New French with Ease.

I do feel I've become more accurate when I shadow material in other courses. It's difficult to know how much of that is related to doing Pronounce it Perfectly in French.

If you are a "global/intuitive" learner as I feel I am, the course may be helpful when you're around intermediate, unless you really have the discipline to march through a course like this that is highly compartmentalized. It could be helpful for anyone wanting to improve their French pronunciation.

I worked through the course in 20-60 minute sessions (I didn't time them) over the course of about 2 months. Probably 30 sessions. I edited the English out of most of the recordings, which took some of the time. Usually I reviewed the previous session's audio before starting on new stuff. After I finished the course, I went through the recordings again. I repeated the literature/poetry/sayings part a third time. I'll probably listen to that stuff again.

Since the time commitment for PIPIF and FSI French Phonology is similar, I offer the following.

Strengths of PIPIF
Better recordings
Certain pronunciation exceptions are pointed out.

Strengths of FSI French Phonology
Better design

Weaknesses of PIPIF
Not enough connected speech or focus on the voice combinations that are troublesome. Equal weight is given to easy stuff. Although there is helpful "phonic" type headings, it could be organized/simplified a bit more. Certain sections seemed to be organized more alphabetically than phonetically. That's a minor criticism.
Speech is never taken anywhere near normal speed.

Weakness of FSI French Phonology
The recordings have low sound quality.
The book is a must.

I don't regret doing either course. They both have been helpful.

10 persons have voted this message useful

songlines
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Message 13 of 16

13 April 2014 at 3:16pm | IP Logged

Thanks so much for that excellent post, Luke I have access to both of those (one from the library, and
the other of which I own). - It'd be interesting to see how my experience compares with yours.

I also have Penny Sewell's La prononciation français pour de vrai DVD (bought on sale at Foyles/Grant
& Cutler, London), which I expect will be at a more intermediate level (the course itself is in French). When I
eventually (later in the year?) return to active study-study (as opposed to just using native materials), I'll try to
post something on it.

Penny Sewell's site:
www.soundsfrench.co.uk
2 persons have voted this message useful

Random review
Diglot
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Message 14 of 16

15 April 2014 at 1:00am | IP Logged

A 9 year thread resurrection! Is that some kind of record?
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PeterMollenburg
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Message 15 of 16

28 June 2014 at 7:11am | IP Logged

luke wrote:

French Pronounce it Perfectly in French has a new 3rd edition. Almost
everything that is in French is recorded, although there is a good bit of English on
the recordings. I'm not familiar with the earlier editions.

The course starts by covering the International Phonetic Alphabets (IPA).
Part one covers the vowels. (90 pages)
Part two covers consonants. (25 pages)

Those two parts are mostly the sounds within words, rather than phrases or sentences.
There are two or three brief dialogues to practice the vowels or consonants.

Part three covers word patterns and intonation (18 pages)
They discuss liaison, enchainement, elision and intonation. The liaison part, which is
only about 7 pages was the most helpful for me.

Part four is called "More Practice in Context for Enrichment". (25 pages)
Included here are popular French phrases, some poetry, proverbs, a few passages from
literature, some tongue twisters, jokes, and riddles. Don't expect too much from the
jokes/riddles.

The 3rd edition adds 3 lessons:
About 20 famous French quotations.
About 25 French words that may be heard mispronounced in English. (bonbons, haute
couture, madame, monsieur, tout de suite)
A set of 20 words in French that are to be written in the IPA.

Overall, I found the course worthwhile. The focus on pronunciation helped me focus a
bit more on that aspect of speaking. There are some relatively low frequency words
that could be thought of as vocabulary in the first 2 parts of the book. For me, words
in isolation aren't very sticky, so I wouldn't recommend the book to learn new words.
If I used a highlighter, that might put them in my grasp. A lot of the words are
common though.

The sayings, poetry, and literary passages are the part that has some draw for
listening a few more times. That's a small portion of the course though. These
sections are spoken slowly, like some of the early lessons in Assimil New French with
Ease.

I do feel I've become more accurate when I shadow material in other courses. It's
difficult to know how much of that is related to doing Pronounce it Perfectly in
French.

If you are a "global/intuitive" learner as I feel I am, the course may be helpful when
you're around intermediate, unless you really have the discipline to march through a
course like this that is highly compartmentalized. It could be helpful for anyone
wanting to improve their French pronunciation.

I worked through the course in 20-60 minute sessions (I didn't time them) over the
course of about 2 months. Probably 30 sessions. I edited the English out of most of
the recordings, which took some of the time. Usually I reviewed the previous session's
audio before starting on new stuff. After I finished the course, I went through the
recordings again. I repeated the literature/poetry/sayings part a third time. I'll
probably listen to that stuff again.

Since the time commitment for PIPIF and FSI French Phonology is similar, I offer the
following.

Strengths of PIPIF
Better recordings
Certain pronunciation exceptions are pointed out.

Strengths of FSI French Phonology
Better design

Weaknesses of PIPIF
Not enough connected speech or focus on the voice combinations that are troublesome.
Equal weight is given to easy stuff. Although there is helpful "phonic" type headings,
it could be organized/simplified a bit more. Certain sections seemed to be organized
more alphabetically than phonetically. That's a minor criticism.
Speech is never taken anywhere near normal speed.

Weakness of FSI French Phonology
The recordings have low sound quality.
The book is a must.

I don't regret doing either course. They both have been helpful.

Very useful review tnx Luke :)
1 person has voted this message useful

luke
Diglot
Senior Member
United States
Joined 7206 days ago
3133 posts - 4351 votes

Speaks: English*, Spanish
Studies: Esperanto, French

Message 16 of 16

28 June 2014 at 11:42am | IP Logged

I could see the course being helpful for beginners too. I noted "as an intermediate student...", but a lot of
recommendations for getting started suggest focusing on phonology, which make sense. I know Steven is
not a beginner. I just mention it because I'd thought of adding that comment to this review for a while.

1 person has voted this message useful

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