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The importance of a good accent | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : General discussion |  | |
| mrwarper Diglot Winner TAC 2012 Senior Member Spain forum_posts.asp?TID=Registered users can see my Skype Name Joined 5231 days ago 1493 posts - 2500 votes  Speaks: Spanish*, EnglishC2 Studies: German, Russian, Japanese | Message 25 of 255 12 December 2010 at 3:01am | IP Logged | ||
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There's a fine line between an accent and bad pronunciation. Both are deviances from 'standard pronunciation' if we define that as something intelligible to every speaker of the language. Going out on a limb, I'd draw that line exactly where comprehension is affected.
From my point of view, many native speakers don't speak their mother tongues but chew them and spit them out, just as many language students do. Other natives and students who really understand that languages are communication tools have different degrees of success in trying to pronounce properly so everyone who speaks the language can understand them, but at least they try. So, I tend to expect high language skills when I hear an almost accentless pronunciation, and otherwise I wait until my interlocutors show their 'real' (as in easier to grasp, infinitely harder to master) language skills, like poor/rich vocabulary, appropriate register, grammar use, etc. I guess I'm too used to explain L1 vocabulary and grammar to my L2 students and not only to foreigners :( 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Lucas Pentaglot Groupie Switzerland Joined 5172 days ago 85 posts - 130 votes Speaks: French*, English, German, Italian, Russian Studies: Mandarin | Message 26 of 255 12 December 2010 at 3:20am | IP Logged | ||
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There is no fine line between accent and pronociation, they're completely different
things! An accent is what language specialist call "prosodie". It's only the melody you're used to speak in (I don't know how to put that in English). It doesn't affect comprehension (except for tonal languages of course). Prononciation is the way you prononce the phonemes...if you prononce them wrong, comprehension will be often affected, and almost nobody will like you're accent. So you can speak a language with a strong accent and a good prononciation, and everybody will like your accent (especially if you're a beautiful girl) because everybody will understand you. ...and because you're a beautiful girl! ;) 6 persons have voted this message useful | |||
| mrwarper Diglot Winner TAC 2012 Senior Member Spain forum_posts.asp?TID=Registered users can see my Skype Name Joined 5231 days ago 1493 posts - 2500 votes Speaks: Spanish*, EnglishC2 Studies: German, Russian, Japanese | Message 27 of 255 12 December 2010 at 3:28am | IP Logged | ||
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I don't know how terminology goes in French, but prosody is the stress distribution (actually rhythm, intonation, stress, and related attributes) in speech, and pronunciation is how you utter your phonemes. In doing so, you may (or may not) have an accent, even if your prosody is right.
As you said yourself, except for tonal languages prosody won't greatly affect understanding, while accents can and sometimes do. 3 persons have voted this message useful | |||
| Lucas Pentaglot Groupie Switzerland Joined 5172 days ago 85 posts - 130 votes Speaks: French*, English, German, Italian, Russian Studies: Mandarin | Message 28 of 255 12 December 2010 at 5:58am | IP Logged | ||
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Interseting...
- for me what people call "accent" is part of what linguists call "prosody". - for you, prosody is prosody, and accent is something else...maybe the undefined way of speaking of people who are coming from a certain place? Well, for me, this is prosody. :) But nevermind...what's important here is that accent (OR prosody for me, AND prosody for you) is not to be confused with the prononciation. 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Arekkusu Hexaglot Senior Member Canada bit.ly/qc_10_lec Joined 5386 days ago 3971 posts - 7747 votes Speaks: English, French*, GermanC1, Spanish, Japanese, Esperanto Studies: Italian, Norwegian, Mandarin, Romanian, Estonian | Message 29 of 255 12 December 2010 at 7:12am | IP Logged | ||
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I take great pride in trying to achieve a perfect accent. On my way there, I attempt to use a pleasant and
non-intrusive accent. I find it difficult to believe that a person would truly think that having a good accent is not desirable or isn't worth the effort. People have different goals and that's fine, but it sounds like saying they prefer to study just a few words, to understand only part of what they read or for their grammar to be only half correct. There comes a point where if nothing is important there's just no point in even bothering. 3 persons have voted this message useful | |||
 LauraM Pro Member United States Joined 5357 days ago 77 posts - 97 votes Studies: German Personal Language Map | Message 30 of 255 12 December 2010 at 7:46am | IP Logged | ||
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I *wish* I had a bad accent since I am so limited in my target language. Too many people think I'm native.
In my son's preschool the other day, I had a woman (she is orig from Europe) tell me that I speak perfect English (Um, I hope so, I'm American and have never left the country!) and proceeded to ask how long I've been living here in the states. I'm so used to communicating with my 2 yr old in German, it comes so natural to me, and my inclination is to do so with other toddlers. I have to actually stop myslef. But my level is probably close to that of a 3 or 4 year old to be quite honest. It's embarrassing to admit that I am not fluent. I really think some people don't believe me... 2 persons have voted this message useful | |||
| Aineko Triglot Senior Member New Zealand Joined 5453 days ago 238 posts - 442 votes Speaks: Serbian*, EnglishC2, Spanish Studies: Russian, Arabic (Written), Mandarin | Message 31 of 255 12 December 2010 at 9:33am | IP Logged | ||
well, if by 'good accent' you mean 'near-native', I can tell you that in my book it's not worth the effort (for reasons I already explained on that other thread about the same question). And I can't find your analogy with studying just a few words correct, since people can be fully functional in a language although they have a foreign accent. If, on the other hand, you mean 'accent that does not prevent you from being understood', then I agree. 3 persons have voted this message useful | |||
| Arekkusu Hexaglot Senior Member Canada bit.ly/qc_10_lec Joined 5386 days ago 3971 posts - 7747 votes Speaks: English, French*, GermanC1, Spanish, Japanese, Esperanto Studies: Italian, Norwegian, Mandarin, Romanian, Estonian | Message 32 of 255 12 December 2010 at 9:45pm | IP Logged | ||
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I consider that I'm dependent on native speakers for an important part of my learning. In
essence, they hold the key to my success and it's their knowledge that I aim for. For that reason, I always considered that presenting native speakers with a carefully packaged pronunciation shows a level of care and dedication that encourages them to help me more than they otherwise would. It's hard to quantify or test, but I'm convinced it has made a significant difference in my learning. 1 person has voted this message useful |
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