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Native material reading techniques | ||
Tags: Native Materials | Reading | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : Learning Techniques, Methods & Strategies |  | |
 Fasulye Heptaglot Winner TAC 2012 Moderator Germany fasulyespolyglotblog Joined 5782 days ago 5460 posts - 6006 votes  1 sounds Speaks: German*, DutchC1, EnglishB2, French, Italian, Spanish, Esperanto Studies: Latin, Danish, Norwegian, Turkish Personal Language Map | Message 17 of 43 04 November 2011 at 6:05am | IP Logged | |||||
Yes, you need the grammar knowledge because otherwise you don't understand the structures of the sentences which often are complex in native texts. But I'm working through my second and third textbook of Danish now, where the grammar is explained and I do the grammar exercises, so on my A2 - level I know enough grammar that I can deal with reading such a novel on a native level. Fasulye Edited by Fasulye on 04 November 2011 at 6:07am 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| Ari Heptaglot Senior Member Norway Joined 6517 days ago 2314 posts - 5695 votes Speaks: Swedish*, English, French, Spanish, Portuguese, Mandarin, Cantonese Studies: Czech, Latin, German | Message 18 of 43 04 November 2011 at 7:26am | IP Logged | |||||
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I do intensive reading on my iPad. With Mandarin I use Pleco. This gives me the ability to tap on any character to look up characters, words and fixed expressions in several different dictionaries. With another tap I add the expression as a flashcard. I can then, when I'm done with the text, go through all the words again to solidify them. After this I usually remove all the flashcards, at the moment. I do my flashcarding on my iPhone. But with the next version of Pleco, I'll be able to sync my flashcards with my phone, which will make it even easier. Tap to look up, tap to add flashcard, then study using SRS during the rest of the day.
I wouldn't like to study foreign languages using books and paper. 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| Hendrek Diglot Senior Member United States Joined 4817 days ago 152 posts - 210 votes Speaks: English*, Italian Studies: Persian | Message 19 of 43 07 November 2011 at 10:55pm | IP Logged | |||||
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I've just started reading a native book in Italian "Uomini che odiano le donne" (originally in Swedish, "The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo" in English), which isn't too difficult, but probably more so than Harry Potter would be. What I'm trying now is something like what fasulye indicated.
Except instead of re-copying the book, I just dedicate a separate notebook to it and number the notebook pages to correspond to the book pages. I have to look up a lot of words still, which takes a long time, but I've already noticed that I'm remembering them when I encounter them later. If not, then I'm at least looking them up again and reinforcing the meaning. It's sort of like an SRS process that way. Also, you'll often find yourself able to simply refer to a prior page in the notebook rather than having to crack open the dictionary again. I agree that knowing the grammar first is helpful, but this reading also helps to reinforce the less common structures, such as the subjunctive or literary past, in context. Strategically, choose a book that interests you and whose story discusses topics that would be useful in terms of vocabulary (e.g. a banking/law crime thriller ala Grisham if you will be working in that industry). Any book will do if you don't have specific vocabulary aims. Edited by Hendrek on 07 November 2011 at 10:58pm 2 persons have voted this message useful | ||||||
| hypersport Senior Member United States Joined 5816 days ago 216 posts - 307 votes Studies: Spanish | Message 20 of 43 08 November 2011 at 5:58am | IP Logged | |||||
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I started with childrens books aimed at ages 5 to 7. I was amazed at the vocabulary and complexity of the sentences. I looked up every word that I didn't know and wrote a one word definition in pen over the word.
Soon words were repeating themselves and it was getting easier. I read about 10 books in a series before moving on to more advanced material. Soon I was reading novels, mostly English originals translated but some native stuff too. From the beginning I read out loud and continue to do so. Reading out loud is probably one of the most effective tools that language learners don't do. It's a lot of work and most people aren't up to it. Currently I've read about 17 novels ranging from 500 to 800 pages, my current book by Stephen King "Bajo La Cupula" is almost 1,200 pages. Typically I look up a word or 2 maybe in 20 pages or so. Not many words that I have to look up anymore. Lots of reading will do that. My spoken vocabulary is also a lot greater when I speak with natives. 4 persons have voted this message useful | ||||||
| fomalhaut Groupie United States Joined 4838 days ago 80 posts - 101 votes Speaks: English* Studies: German | Message 21 of 43 08 November 2011 at 8:07am | IP Logged | |||||
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It's actually quite, quite interesting to be going through this again; My vocabulary and perceived eloquency in English is from a lifetime of voracious reading. It's quite a crazy feeling to be doing the same thing... for another language :)
1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| montmorency Diglot Senior Member United Kingdom Joined 4763 days ago 2371 posts - 3676 votes Speaks: English*, German Studies: Danish, Welsh | Message 22 of 43 09 November 2011 at 8:51pm | IP Logged | |||||
I suppose one could do the equivalent thing at lower cost by scanning instead of copying (should take about the same amount of time, plus a bit for OCR-ing), provided that one was happy to work on the computer and not on paper. 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| leosmith Senior Member United States Joined 6485 days ago 2365 posts - 3804 votes Speaks: English* Studies: Tagalog | Message 23 of 43 12 November 2011 at 2:30pm | IP Logged | |||||
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Nice thread. I've got a warning to make, but let me give you some background before I do.
I'm learning 5 languages right now (Thai, Japanese, Mandarin, French, Russian). I won't get into my reasons for doing it this way, but I start a language, get to where I'm conversing comfortably, then push it into the "only maintaining" queue, and start a new language. Every year I visit the country where the language is spoken for 2 - 15 weeks. When I'm in-country, all languages except the country language go into the queue. The only time that I would be able to spend ploughing through and looking up every word in a book would be my in-country time, and I wouldn't shoot the whole wad on intensive reading anyhow, so you see my time is severely limited. Here's the warning - if you aren't in a position to spend enough time in one shot to plough through and look up every word in as much material as it would take for you to become a good reader, then it's not worth doing it. For example, in a difficult language like Japanese, getting through 100 pages could easily take you 100 hours, and depending on your level, that may not be enough. If you finish those 100 pages, then go on to lighter activities, and spend little time in the language for a few weeks or months, that vocabulary will slip away quickly. In my experience, if you are in this situation, it's better to spend your time finding graduated materials and doing extensive reading. If, on the other hand, you are able to spend the time, then I can think of no better way of becoming a good reader. Sure, always get in a good 10 minutes of comfortable extensive reading a day, but spend as much time as you can afford doing intensive reading until you make that big breakthrough. I want to do this in all my languages, but I have decided to spend the time adding new languages instead of making breakthroughs in reading. 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| Ari Heptaglot Senior Member Norway Joined 6517 days ago 2314 posts - 5695 votes Speaks: Swedish*, English, French, Spanish, Portuguese, Mandarin, Cantonese Studies: Czech, Latin, German | Message 24 of 43 12 November 2011 at 4:08pm | IP Logged | |||||
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I don't see that I can read faster doing extensive reading compared to intensive reading. The amount of time it takes
to read through a page is pretty much the same. Looking up a word takes half a second, and skipping it makes my reading experience choppy. I guess the reading time increases a little if there are lots of unknown words, but if that's the case, I wouldn't be able to read it extensively, anyway. Granted, if you're trying to do extensive reading with a paper book and a paper dictionary, it's gonna take ages. But if you do it that way, you've only got yourself to blame. Or maybe there aren't any popup dictionaries for your language, in which case it's a different matter, of course. But intensive reading done right is not very time-consuming. 1 person has voted this message useful |
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