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Flow as a source of motivation | ||
Tags: Motivation | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : Learning Techniques, Methods & Strategies |  | |
| Arekkusu Hexaglot Senior Member Canada bit.ly/qc_10_lec Joined 5316 days ago 3971 posts - 7747 votes  Speaks: English, French*, GermanC1, Spanish, Japanese, Esperanto Studies: Italian, Norwegian, Mandarin, Romanian, Estonian | Message 1 of 27 16 September 2011 at 10:25pm | IP Logged | |||||
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(For those who are less familiar with the concept of “flow”, you can refer to my post #204 here where I explain what flow is and discuss my experience when doing oral practice.)
We’ve all said at one point or another that motivation is, if not the most important aspect of learning a language, at least an essential part without which the end goal could not be reached. I’ve been realizing lately that reaching a state of flow when practicing orally is very motivating in itself, and so I find myself wondering if in the end WHAT we do is not less important that HOW we do it. I can’t help feel that any method of study or practice that is geared towards reaching flow would have to be much more rewarding and successful, and ultimately intrinsically motivating. Maybe the most successful learners simply know instinctively how to reach a state of flow. Have other members here considered the relationship between flow and motivation, or language learning in general? EDIT: link fixed -- thanks Iversen! Edited by Arekkusu on 22 September 2011 at 3:54pm 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| HMS Senior Member England Joined 5042 days ago 143 posts - 256 votes Speaks: English* | Message 2 of 27 16 September 2011 at 11:26pm | IP Logged | |||||
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Reading this was rather strange for me...
I understand exactly what you mean but it's the first time I've ever seen it described in words. I've never actually considered it before but thinking back - I can think of several occasions when I've reached it in a given situation. None of my situations were pertaining to language learning though, although the situations involved speaking. I can actually remember a time when I paused for a second and actually thought something along the lines of "wow, how the hell am I managing to do this!". It felt good. The motivation for me was, I was technically 'thrown in at the deep end' and had to prove myself in a very highly charged and potentially dangerous situation. Edited by HMS on 16 September 2011 at 11:28pm 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| pfn123 Senior Member Australia Joined 5018 days ago 171 posts - 291 votes Speaks: English* | Message 3 of 27 18 September 2011 at 4:20am | IP Logged | |||||
I agree. I always just thought of it as 'getting warmed up' :D Good to know there's a name for it. Interesting idea, too. I'll be thinking about it. 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| Silenz Newbie AustraliaRegistered users can see my Skype Name Joined 4849 days ago 23 posts - 33 votes Studies: French, German, Russian | Message 4 of 27 18 September 2011 at 9:03am | IP Logged | |||||
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In some sports (Cricket for me) I guess this would be equivelent to "the zone." It's
somewhat generally accepted that you're at your peak when you're in this "zone." The best are the best because the difference between this "zone" and their normal state of concentration or play is so minimal. Aiming to reach the zone is all well and good, but if you want to becoem truly proficcient, you should be aiming to close the gap between your normal speaking ability and that of when you're achieving good "flow." Because, lets face it, there are going to be days where you just won't be able to concentrate fully on the task at hand and then you'll have to fall back on your raw ability. 3 persons have voted this message useful | ||||||
| Arekkusu Hexaglot Senior Member Canada bit.ly/qc_10_lec Joined 5316 days ago 3971 posts - 7747 votes Speaks: English, French*, GermanC1, Spanish, Japanese, Esperanto Studies: Italian, Norwegian, Mandarin, Romanian, Estonian | Message 5 of 27 21 September 2011 at 9:13pm | IP Logged | |||||
Yes, "in the zone" is a common expression to refer to "flow", the latter being the term psychologists use in their research. Obviously, I am aiming to close the gap, but the point is that when I do reach flow, I can improve faster and more efficiently. That's why I'm looking for ways to reach it faster or more consistently. 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
 Iversen Super Polyglot Moderator Denmark berejst.dk Joined 6638 days ago 9078 posts - 16473 votes Speaks: Danish*, French, English, German, Italian, Spanish, Portuguese, Dutch, Swedish, Esperanto, Romanian, Catalan Studies: Afrikaans, Greek, Norwegian, Russian, Serbian, Icelandic, Latin, Irish, Lowland Scots, Indonesian, Polish, Croatian Personal Language Map | Message 6 of 27 22 September 2011 at 11:20am | IP Logged | |||||
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I found Arekkusu's post about flow one page earlier than expected in the other thread, but it was worth rereading it.
Flow in measurable terms occur for me when I do wordlists. When I start doing them I may have to reread the original source two or three times (sometimes more) or invent silly associations to remember the words, but twenty minutes later a simple glance may be enough. Flow may also appear after a while when listening to a weak target language, and the criterion here is simply how long you can keep on understanding the stream of words without running against a wall. Strangely enough I don't think much about getting into some kind of flow when speaking or writing. Which is rather puzzling as speech is Arekkusu's main example. Of course I may need a few minutes to get accostumed to the situation if somebody suddenly appears out of the blue and asks me to speak Portuguese or whatever, but when I'm ready to speak I would feel it as relief after surviving a challenge rather than the beginning of a period with something as positive as flow. In my better languages the 'facing up to the challenge' time is minimal, but then the feeling of relief is also minimal. Writing is slightly different because I have time to think things through first, and I don't start writing before I have decided that I'm ready. But flow... I simply don't think of flow in connection with any active use of my languages. Flow is (for me) being able to cope with input at the rate in which it comes to me. It is a passive - bordering on meditative - state. Which doesn't mean that there aren't positive aspects about being able to speak or write a language. For instance being able to speak the local language is one important factor that can make a voyage a memorable experience. But even here the feeling of flow is the feeling of being able to cope with things around me while staying calm and detached and content, and answering in some foreign language is just one skill among others that can contribute to getting there. Edited by Iversen on 22 September 2011 at 12:12pm 3 persons have voted this message useful | ||||||
| Teango Triglot Winner TAC 2010 & 2012 Senior Member United States teango.wordpress.comRegistered users can see my Skype Name Joined 5491 days ago 2210 posts - 3734 votes Speaks: English*, German, Russian Studies: Hawaiian, French, Toki Pona | Message 7 of 27 22 September 2011 at 3:10pm | IP Logged | |||||
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I notice that I "get into the flow" after about 7-9 minutes of listening to and reading a novel. It's as though my subconscious ability to predict future behaviour (e.g. the speed my eyes need to keep up, and which areas of the brain I'll need to access more frequently) kicks in. I guess it's simply a matter of increasing chemical and bioelectrical activation within the brain, but when it happens, it seems like magic.
What's even more curious is that when I try to follow a passage in Russian and then read the same section again in English, it takes about the same amount of time, and in some cases even longer, for my eyes to adjust back to the different print size and average word length (not to mention word order). I find that Russian words are, in general, much longer than English words, so I initially tend to skip ahead at twice the speed with lots of backtracking until I get used to reading in English again. This reminds me of what it's like to do any repeated activity, be it driving long-distance, programming, writing a thesis, playing a fun video game on a lazy Sunday afternoon, or even packaging vegetables in a factory all day with surreptitious glances to the second hand on your watch. We build up a model or routine in our head after a little while, and then play out the schema internally to help us along in the real world and optimise our activities. And I find the longer I perform an activity, especially a novel activity, the longer my brain continues to optimise and prepare for what it thinks is my new routine. I recall, in particular, speaking German for 4 hours straight last year in a small group at a local restaurant, and when I woke up the next morning, my thoughts continued to babble away in German for several hours as though they had another mind of their own. This is something I find very exciting, although often initially disconcerting, and I can well believe that some of our greatest gains in language learning take place when we hit this optimal moment. Edited by Teango on 22 September 2011 at 3:17pm 2 persons have voted this message useful | ||||||
| Arekkusu Hexaglot Senior Member Canada bit.ly/qc_10_lec Joined 5316 days ago 3971 posts - 7747 votes Speaks: English, French*, GermanC1, Spanish, Japanese, Esperanto Studies: Italian, Norwegian, Mandarin, Romanian, Estonian | Message 8 of 27 22 September 2011 at 3:51pm | IP Logged | |||||
Although we all seem to find flow in different aspects of the language -- and perhaps this is a good indication that we find pleasure in different aspects of language learning -- it appears that we all agree that flow is indeed an optimal learning moment, not just a vector of joy and well-being. It's definitely worth fostering. While some people do most of their learning through reading, I do most of mine through speaking. That's probably why I experience flow there, while others like Iversen find it in other aspects of learning instead. Edited by Arekkusu on 22 September 2011 at 3:55pm 2 persons have voted this message useful |
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