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Comparing Assimil Russian 1951/1971/2004 | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : Language Programs, Books & Tapes |  | |
| zorglub Pentaglot Senior Member France Joined 6998 days ago 441 posts - 504 votes  1 sounds Speaks: French*, English, Italian, Spanish, Portuguese Studies: German, Arabic (Written), Turkish, Mandarin | Message 17 of 34 02 June 2009 at 9:07pm | IP Logged | |||||
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Congratulations for the analysis.
But there is a "But". I'm afraid comparing langage learning courses is akin to comparing treatments or medications in medical research. There may be theoretical differences between treatments, laboratory observed drug properties that strongly suggest one is superior or safer than another. Animal research may have proved A superior to B. But often, studies on actual human patients do not confirm what can be predicted. I don't think one can say such or such course is better because this or that. First, there is room for lots of biases as we can see here from diverging opinions. Some deem some type of exercise is better while others deem the opposite. And we (I and I suppose others too) all know it was better "before". This is a human charactéristic that has been smilingly illustrated in "Rien de nouveau sous le soleil : Nihil novi sub sole, Edition bilingue français-latin" www.amazon.fr/Rien-nouveau-sous-soleil-fran%C3%A7ais-latin/d p/2266160788 The only way one could know at last would be to gather an as homogeneous as possible population of people wanting to learn a language, and proceed according to the following principles: - those people should be comparable or stratifiable in terms of number of languages learned before, proficiency in those languages, and maybe other factors. - They should be randomised in groups (and hopefully random would avoid important differences between groups. - And then those groups should be ascribed to different courses. - Course usage should be standardised. - After a predefined time, learners should be formally assessed for conversional , writing , understanding abilities and whatever would be deemed reevant. - Those assessing the learners should be blinded to which course learners used; This or similar procedures, I think, is the only rational scientific way to compare language learning courses. The rest is opinion, divination, at times incantation or religion, my method is better than yours, and at best the fruit of experience (I do admit to indulging in those too). As Hippocrates said: "“Life is short, art long, opportunity fleeting, experience treacherous, judgment difficult”. Edited by zorglub on 03 June 2009 at 11:27am 2 persons have voted this message useful | ||||||
| Breogan Bilingual Tetraglot Groupie Spain Joined 5914 days ago 42 posts - 48 votes Speaks: Spanish*, Galician*, French, English Studies: German, Russian, Arabic (classical) | Message 18 of 34 03 June 2009 at 10:29am | IP Logged | |||||
There is indeed one more method before the 2004 version (by the way I don't know this recent one); so we have, from older to newer: "Le russe sans peine" aka "Russian without toil" (50's-60's) "Le russe sans peine" aka "Russian without toil" (70's) "Le nouveau russe sans peine" aka "Russian with ease" (80's-90's) "Le russe" aka "Russian"? (2000's) 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| fanatic Octoglot Senior Member Australia speedmathematics.com Joined 7144 days ago 1152 posts - 1818 votes Speaks: English*, German, French, Afrikaans, Italian, Spanish, Russian, Dutch Studies: Swedish, Norwegian, Polish, Modern Hebrew, Malay, Mandarin, Esperanto | Message 19 of 34 03 June 2009 at 11:31am | IP Logged | |||||
I think you are right. I have all three versions of Assimil Russian. I have never really liked the first version. Instead, I preferred to use other material from Russia. I didn't like the accents of the speakers and I didn't like the texts very much. They didn't seem natural. I used the first version but found I lost interest after a few months and it was hard work to keep going (unlike the other Assimil language courses I have). The second version from the 70s was better and I enjoyed using it. The texts were better and kept my interest. I haven't done much yet with the latest version so I can't really comment on it but it looks promising. I am glad I have all three and I found the analysis on the three versions very helpful and enlightening. It is a good way to look at the differences but maybe not a good way to judge the value of the courses. Edited by fanatic on 03 June 2009 at 11:32am 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| zorglub Pentaglot Senior Member France Joined 6998 days ago 441 posts - 504 votes 1 sounds Speaks: French*, English, Italian, Spanish, Portuguese Studies: German, Arabic (Written), Turkish, Mandarin | Message 20 of 34 03 June 2009 at 12:57pm | IP Logged | |||||
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One important difference I find useful in the latest assimil series, those without the "ohne mühe" or "without toil " or "sans peine" is that they have a short bidirectional dictionnary of , supposedly, all words used in the book. And for each word , in addiction to the translation, the pages where the word was used are indicated.
I find this feature very useful. Many times I had to browse painstakingly to find a forgotten word or idiom, and at times , not even found it. This is very simple with the dictionnary, and referring back to the context seems to allow for better memorisation. 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| kam Newbie Canada Joined 5641 days ago 3 posts - 3 votes Studies: Russian | Message 21 of 34 13 June 2009 at 2:36am | IP Logged | |||||
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| shadad Pentaglot Newbie VenezuelaRegistered users can see my Skype Name Joined 6655 days ago 38 posts - 41 votes 3 sounds Studies: Arabic (Levantine), Spanish*, English, French, Italian, Portuguese Studies: Greek, Modern Hebrew, German | Message 22 of 34 10 March 2010 at 11:19am | IP Logged | |||||
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OK, I got "le russe sans peine", the 1973's version...And I'm downloading the audio for the 1971's version, because it was the only one I found. Do they match? What's the difference between the 1971 and 1973 book versions? Can I use the 1971's audio for both? I'm confused here.
1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| Breogan Bilingual Tetraglot Groupie Spain Joined 5914 days ago 42 posts - 48 votes Speaks: Spanish*, Galician*, French, English Studies: German, Russian, Arabic (classical) | Message 23 of 34 10 March 2010 at 12:30pm | IP Logged | |||||
There's just one version for these years (70's), the year (71, 73 or whatever) doesn't change anything. The book you have and the audio you're downloading will match. 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| shadad Pentaglot Newbie VenezuelaRegistered users can see my Skype Name Joined 6655 days ago 38 posts - 41 votes 3 sounds Studies: Arabic (Levantine), Spanish*, English, French, Italian, Portuguese Studies: Greek, Modern Hebrew, German | Message 24 of 34 10 March 2010 at 12:47pm | IP Logged | |||||
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Thank you very much, Breogan.
1 person has voted this message useful |
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