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Russian mobile stress in past tense verbs | ||
Tags: Verbs/Conjugation | Russian | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : Русский |  | |
| Antigrav_7 Newbie Philippines Joined 5318 days ago 17 posts - 20 votes | Message 1 of 10 10 July 2010 at 3:54am | IP Logged | ||
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hi, i'm doing this for a friend who's having great trouble with past tense verb forms. Example: nachalsya is stressed on 'sya', but 'nachala' is stressed on 'la', while nachal is stressed on 'na'. And that's just one example. He has no problem with memorising mobile stress in nouns and verb conjugations, but it's such a pain that even past tense forms have stress changes, and what's worse is that all the dictionaries that he has bought doesn't really show all the stress changes in the Russian past tense forms. Is there a way to predict them, or to know whether it will fall on 'sya', etc.?
I'm curious as well about this subject, as I plan on studying Russian next year. However, I might change my mind due to those extremely problematic mobile stresses that occur not only in past tense forms, but also in expressions, like 'na slovo' (stress is on the preposition, which is not usual) P.S. He's almost plannning on giving up Russian..... 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| shkesper-5 Newbie Russian Federation Joined 5283 days ago 3 posts - 6 votes Studies: Russian* | Message 2 of 10 10 July 2010 at 9:59am | IP Logged | ||
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я (I) начал (began)
мы (we) начали они (they) начали ты (you) начал он (he) начал она (she) начала оно (it, inanimate object neuter) началось он (it, inanimate object of masculine) начался она (it, inanimate object is feminine) началась я (I) сделал (made) мы (we) сделали они (they) сделали ты (you) сделал он (he) сделал она (she) сделала оно (it, inanimate object neuter) сделалось он (it, inanimate object of masculine) сделался она (it, inanimate object is feminine) сделалась Edited by shkesper-5 on 10 July 2010 at 10:07am 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| novemberain Triglot Groupie Russian Federation Joined 5872 days ago 59 posts - 87 votes  Speaks: Russian*, EnglishC1, Italian Studies: Spanish, Portuguese | Message 3 of 10 11 July 2010 at 12:01am | IP Logged | ||
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Antigrav_7,
There are rules but there sure are exceptions to them. I guess it is not exactly trivial since people publish academic papers on this subject. 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Antigrav_7 Newbie Philippines Joined 5318 days ago 17 posts - 20 votes | Message 4 of 10 13 July 2010 at 11:37am | IP Logged | ||
how would you go about learning Russian, whilst dealing with all of these difficulties? Will the learner be able to get used to all of these mobile stress accents, that constantly take place not only in words, but also in expressions? 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| lynxrunner Bilingual Triglot Senior Member United States crittercryptics.com Joined 5950 days ago 361 posts - 461 votes Speaks: English*, Spanish*, French Studies: Russian, Swedish, Haitian Creole | Message 5 of 10 13 July 2010 at 8:49pm | IP Logged | ||
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You just memorize it. I haven't had a problem remembering mobile stress. You'll get used
to it. There are three patterns for a past tense verb: fixed on stem, feminine stress, and always stressed on the end. Instead of thinking "no, more exceptions!", associate each verb with its pattern. I find that this makes it way easier to remember it... plus, you can then start to group verbs like that together and remember them all as a group. 2 persons have voted this message useful | |||
| Antigrav_7 Newbie Philippines Joined 5318 days ago 17 posts - 20 votes | Message 6 of 10 15 July 2010 at 2:57pm | IP Logged | ||
thanks! I actually found out that memorizing where the accent goes was a lot easier than I thought. The only problem that I'm probably going to have is that I'll have to sometimes pause quite a lot just to determine whether it's воДУ оr БОду, most especially when it comes to verbs with mobile accents in their tenses, moods, etc. After a few days, though, I had to stop, as I had to go back to learning Polish. I plan on mastering Polish (I've been learning it for 2 months), and then afterwards learn Russian. Or will that only make me confuse cognates, rules, words, placement of stress (Polish is always on the penultimate syllable), etc.? And how long do you reckon does it take to get to near-conversational fluency in Russian, considering the fact that I will have mastered Polish, by the time I start studying Russian? That is, if I study and practise 8 hours a day? (this is just a hypothetical quetion:D) Edited by Antigrav_7 on 15 July 2010 at 2:58pm 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| adaptissimus Diglot Newbie optusnet.com.au Joined 4994 days ago 5 posts - 5 votes Speaks: Russian*, English Studies: French | Message 7 of 10 21 April 2011 at 8:03am | IP Logged | ||
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Nachalsya can be stressed on the first syllable as well, and even on the second (the latter is very colloquial and will be seen by many as incorrect). Where the stress is is difficult to predict. There are two, maybe, rules: it tends to be on the root and in informal speech it tends to move to the last syllable, especially in shorter words. In your case it is a 'new' pronunciation, caused by moving the stress to the end. But it can be also on the prefix: vylez (climbed out), but in zalez (climbed on) it is on the second syllable. Maybe becuse 'out' is more informative. Well, this last explanation is a guess.
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