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L-R | ||
Tags: Listening-Reading (L-R) | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : Learning Techniques, Methods & Strategies |  | |
| jazzboy.bebop Senior Member Norway norwegianthroughnove Joined 5353 days ago 439 posts - 800 votes  Speaks: English* Studies: Norwegian | Message 9 of 29 06 August 2011 at 1:46am | IP Logged | ||||||||
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Well, if you are sure you can identify every word the narrator says then proceed to step 3 but unless your listening skills are really good it may be too much for you and you should try and do step 2, as boring as it is.
Intensive sessions of L-R work much better, I'm not sure how much use L-R would be with only an hour or so a day. I think that low intensity is okay once you can understand most of what you listen to or you are at an intermediate stage but if you are a relative beginner, intensity seems to be essential. 1 person has voted this message useful | |||||||||
| Volte Tetraglot Senior Member Switzerland Joined 6374 days ago 4474 posts - 6726 votes Speaks: English*, Esperanto, German, Italian Studies: French, Finnish, Mandarin, Japanese | Message 10 of 29 06 August 2011 at 2:04am | IP Logged | ||||||||
Oh, that! Atamagaii (and, it seems, many other people) think that it's useful to have word-for-word translations at first. I acknowledge that they can be very valuable, but I honestly don't see the point for L-R, though I highly appreciate this feature in courses like Assimil, and in books about linguistic typology, etc. Atamagaii has explicitly said, though, and I heartily agree, that this isn't something a beginner should prepare for him/herself. It's a waste of time for a beginner to try that. What can make sense is using such texts, if available. At one point, Atamagaii posted a few pages of an L-R text for Polish learners of English, annotated with plenty of notes aimed at learners. If you have this kind of resource available, it's probably worth using. It's almost certainly not worth preparing for yourself, if how much you learn in a given amount of time is a priority. 2 persons have voted this message useful | |||||||||
| The Stephen Diglot Groupie United States Joined 4987 days ago 65 posts - 77 votes Speaks: English*, German Studies: Czech, Hungarian | Message 11 of 29 06 August 2011 at 4:34am | IP Logged | ||||||||
Ok, that explains it I suppose. In my defense, atamagaii can be a bit enigmatic at times... :) 1 person has voted this message useful | |||||||||
| watupboy101 Diglot Groupie United States Joined 4838 days ago 65 posts - 81 votes Speaks: English*, Spanish Studies: French | Message 12 of 29 06 August 2011 at 4:28pm | IP Logged | ||||||||
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When people say understand what your listening to I really don't get it... I see your supposed to associate the words with the English text but I'm not sure if I focus too much on either one. How much should I focus on reading it?
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| Volte Tetraglot Senior Member Switzerland Joined 6374 days ago 4474 posts - 6726 votes Speaks: English*, Esperanto, German, Italian Studies: French, Finnish, Mandarin, Japanese | Message 13 of 29 06 August 2011 at 6:13pm | IP Logged | ||||||||
I have difficulty understanding your question, but I hope the following is relevant/helpful. With L-R, you focus on what you are listening to as much as possible. At first, you will not understand what you are listening to (unless it's a language you already understand, or very close to one). The human brain is pretty good at learning from what Krashen calls "comprehensible input". So, by either knowing the story well in advance, or (better) by having a corresponding text in a language you know well, you can already know in advance what is going to be said in the recording. It's not about 'associating' words with the English text, it's about using the text as a tool to massively boost the comprehensibility of what you're hearing, so that you progressively understand more and more without the aid of such tools. Theory aside, for 'where to focus when', I'd recommend doing whatever is the most fun. In my experience, it's downright boring to extensively read L2 while listening to L2 while my L2 is very weak, and it's unnecessarily aggravating to read L1 while listening to L2 when my comprehension of L2 is fairly good. As a default, read L1 while paying as much attention to the L2 recording as you can; reading a paragraph of L1 while the narrator pauses for breath before reciting it is a fairly good technique, if the style of the narrator and your reading speed allow for it. 2 persons have voted this message useful | |||||||||
| Volte Tetraglot Senior Member Switzerland Joined 6374 days ago 4474 posts - 6726 votes Speaks: English*, Esperanto, German, Italian Studies: French, Finnish, Mandarin, Japanese | Message 14 of 29 06 August 2011 at 6:15pm | IP Logged | ||||||||
I have to agree with you on that! It's usually worth figuring out what s/he means, though, when it's related to L-R. 1 person has voted this message useful | |||||||||
| watupboy101 Diglot Groupie United States Joined 4838 days ago 65 posts - 81 votes Speaks: English*, Spanish Studies: French | Message 15 of 29 06 August 2011 at 11:44pm | IP Logged | ||||||||
So Volte your saying I should read a paragraph (in L1 of course), listen to that paragraph (in L2), pause and repeat? 1 person has voted this message useful | |||||||||
| Volte Tetraglot Senior Member Switzerland Joined 6374 days ago 4474 posts - 6726 votes Speaks: English*, Esperanto, German, Italian Studies: French, Finnish, Mandarin, Japanese | Message 16 of 29 07 August 2011 at 4:24am | IP Logged | ||||||||
Absolutely not. Both pausing and repeating are a bad idea for the main phase of L-R. The most important thing is to maximize the density of the comprehensible input you receive: that is, listen to as much audio as you can, in as little time as you can (ie, intensively - several hours a day, without skipping days). Where does the comprehensible part come in? You'll be listening to a story you've read in advance and have the text of in front of you. Read what you can, when you can. If the narrator doesn't pause enough to let you read paragraphs, try to read sentences. If he doesn't pause enough even for that, I'm not sure what to advise - maybe find a different audiobook, or increase your reading speed, or try to do what you can (and post about what that is, and how it goes). To the extent you can, maximize the amount of time when you're listening to something that you have just read. Atamagaii has also written about reading a story in advance, and then just listening to it, for closely related languages; if all else fails, you could try that. A few people on the forum have written about alternating reading chapters with L1 and L2 texts (either reading a chapter twice, first with one language and then with the other, or reading one chapter with L1, the next with L2, etc). I haven't tried this, so can't really say much about it. 1 person has voted this message useful |
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