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Mastering prepositions | ||
Tags: Grammar | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : General discussion |  | |
| beano Diglot Senior Member United KingdomRegistered users can see my Skype Name Joined 4627 days ago 1049 posts - 2152 votes  Speaks: English*, German Studies: Russian, Serbian, Hungarian | Message 1 of 23 13 February 2013 at 11:27pm | IP Logged | ||
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Is it possible for a non-native speaker of a language to achieve the same grasp of prepositions as a native?
Maybe it can be done if you spend many years in the country where the target language is spoken, using it extensively every day. I don't think I've ever heard perfect prepositional use in English from someone who lives abroad, and that includes medical professors and university lecturers. I'm not putting these people down in any way. I don't deliberately listen out for mistakes but misuse of prepositions is something that you do notice. Edited by beano on 13 February 2013 at 11:30pm 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Chung Diglot Senior Member Joined 7161 days ago 4228 posts - 8259 votes 20 sounds Speaks: English*, French Studies: Polish, Slovak, Uzbek, Turkish, Korean, Finnish | Message 2 of 23 13 February 2013 at 11:41pm | IP Logged | ||
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From what I observed so far it hasn't happened in the English of non-native acquaintances or friends. Sooner or later something in the use of a preposition / phrasal verb diverges from what I would use after accounting for semantics.
On the other hand getting it to match the native's use/choice over 90% of the time over an extended period of output is good enough for me. 2 persons have voted this message useful | |||
| Cavesa Triglot Senior Member Czech Republic Joined 5014 days ago 3277 posts - 6779 votes Speaks: Czech*, FrenchC2, EnglishC1 Studies: Spanish, German, Italian | Message 3 of 23 13 February 2013 at 11:44pm | IP Logged | ||
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I wouldn't take medical professors and university lecturers in general as a sample of the best non native English speakers, trust me :-D I've heard more than a few. While terminology and vocab in general was good (they surely read a lot), the grammar and pronunciation was often a nightmare. Yes, those living in UK or USA may be better, sure. On a side note: It is actually quite strange that many medical faculties in Europe are now teaching in English as well. Both students and teachers are usually non native speakers (I have yet to see an american or british studying in Enlish abroad. In Prague, I've seen a lot of Portuguese (really a lot, one of the med faculties in Prague could teach in Portuguese instead of English), Spanish, Indians, people from the Arabic countries, Russians and people from central Asia and a few Germans. And some of the foreigners even choose to study in Czech).
I think it is possible to master prepositions. But a lot of input is needed and a lot (really a lot) of corrected practice. In English, it is more complicated as the mix of prepositions and phrasal verbs is an especially deadly one, in my opinion. 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Malek Groupie Christmas Island Joined 4348 days ago 60 posts - 76 votes | Message 4 of 23 14 February 2013 at 12:02am | IP Logged | ||
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Has anyone actually met a native speaker who has "mastered" prepositions? I'm yet to...
Also, does diverging use of prepositions indicate weak language skills? Not always. There is also dialect diversity which can contribute to things. Edited by Malek on 14 February 2013 at 12:04am 4 persons have voted this message useful | |||
| Hampie Diglot Senior Member Sweden Joined 6664 days ago 625 posts - 1009 votes Speaks: Swedish*, English Studies: Latin, German, Mandarin | Message 5 of 23 14 February 2013 at 12:47am | IP Logged | ||
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In Swedish not even natives use "the right" preposition all the time, so, probably not.
3 persons have voted this message useful | |||
| tanya b Senior Member United States Joined 4783 days ago 159 posts - 518 votes Speaks: Russian | Message 6 of 23 14 February 2013 at 2:16am | IP Logged | ||
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Since you're studying Russian, you probably know how mastering its baffling prepositions is no easy task--for example, the Russian word for "on" is "HA" but is sometimes used like the preposition "in" (B), so when someone says they are "in the car", they use "HA", so it sounds to a native English speaker like they are "on the car", which could be dangerous if it is moving.
Every language has its quirks, but at least in English you don't have to think about case inflection based on prepositions, which would be difficult for any non-native to master. In Russian you can screw up a whole sentence even if the preposition is correctly used but the case is wrong. The preposition "HA" sometimes takes the accusative case and sometimes it takes the locative case--it's not easy to predict. I have found that some non-native English speakers have mastered prepositions, although they might omit a preposition like "for" and say "I am waiting you", which is a major mistake but in their native language that sentence wouldn't have a preposition. Edited by tanya b on 14 February 2013 at 2:53am 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Serpent Octoglot Senior Member Russian Federation serpent-849.livejour Joined 6602 days ago 9753 posts - 15779 votes 4 sounds Speaks: Russian*, English, FinnishC1, Latin, German, Italian, Spanish, Portuguese Studies: Danish, Romanian, Polish, Belarusian, Ukrainian, Croatian, Slovenian, Catalan, Czech, Galician, Dutch, Swedish | Message 7 of 23 14 February 2013 at 3:10am | IP Logged | ||
Always, always bear in mind that this forum is not just for English native speakers learning foreign languages. 2 persons have voted this message useful | |||
| jhaberstro Senior Member United States Joined 4398 days ago 112 posts - 154 votes Speaks: English* Studies: French, Portuguese | Message 8 of 23 14 February 2013 at 3:38am | IP Logged | ||
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I don't think most native English speakers necessarily master prepositions (or any part of a language really).
However, I definitely have heard non-natives learn English so well such that if I didn't know better I wouldn't be able to distinguish from a native. The person who immediately comes to mind is Luca Lampariello. Granted, I've only seen him speak on youtube, but I sure couldn't tell that he wasn't American! 3 persons have voted this message useful |
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