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Interference Degree Romance Languages | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : Specific Languages |  | |
| Wort Groupie Austria Joined 4541 days ago 82 posts - 87 votes  Speaks: German* Studies: English, Spanish | Message 1 of 6 21 August 2012 at 10:33pm | IP Logged |
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I'd like to know your opinion concerning the three romance languages Italian, Spanish, and Portuguese - do you think some combinations would have a bigger or smaller risk of interference, given that you have an A2 or B1 in one of these languages? Although I don't have much knowledge in Portuguese, for me it is more difficult not to mix up Spanish and Italian because they seem more similar to me or at least even the differences can cause problems (For example after speaking Spanish a lot it's very difficult for me to omit the "e" at the beginning so that it was very tricky for me to say "sto" instead of "estoy" ".) Keeping this in mind it maybe is an advantage that for instance "estar" is the same in both Spanish and Portuguese and you don't have to switch that much to "stare" in Italian. So, what do you think which combination would be easier and which one not, and above all why? 1 person has voted this message useful | |
| Serpent Octoglot Senior Member Russian Federation serpent-849.livejour Joined 6598 days ago 9753 posts - 15779 votes 4 sounds Speaks: Russian*, English, FinnishC1, Latin, German, Italian, Spanish, Portuguese Studies: Danish, Romanian, Polish, Belarusian, Ukrainian, Croatian, Slovenian, Catalan, Czech, Galician, Dutch, Swedish | Message 2 of 6 21 August 2012 at 10:47pm | IP Logged |
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This thread was great.
IDK, I'm learning all three and it's not a problem. If it's easier for me to remember a word in a different language, that's just because I know the language better, or just that specific word. No big deal. If you're interested in all three, by all means, go for it! Focus on the passive skills though. A few months of intensive fun should bring all of your Romance langs to the level of your strongest one. 3 persons have voted this message useful | |
| outcast Bilingual Heptaglot Senior Member China Joined 4950 days ago 869 posts - 1364 votes Speaks: Spanish*, English*, German, Italian, French, Portuguese, Mandarin Studies: Korean | Message 3 of 6 22 August 2012 at 3:50am | IP Logged |
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Some people are just better at making brain compartments than others. Thus why on this forums you have half the people who will say it is no problem learning related languages, and the other half saying it messes you up in gnarls.
I am not a proper person to talk about this subject, since a Romance language is one of my native languages, so I never confuse it with French or Portuguese. That said, I don't really confuse French or Portuguese either, but on occasion I've had to "think" about which the right word is. Even today I had an infamous moment, where I struggled for a minute to say "boa" (Portuguese for "good" in the feminine), because my ever-increasingly assertive French kept trying to make me say "bonna" or something like that. But I knew it wasn't so I didn't say it, until I remembered the correct form. Now that's probably because I've been doing tons of French imput and not much Portuguese till day, so I was a tad rusty. My Portuguese is coming back rather fast now that I've been reviewing it the last couple of days. I would say, your example with "estar" just shows that your brain is simply conditioned to utter the word with "e" because of the repeated practice sessions. It takes a bit to get your brain more lissome and switch from learning language A to learning language B, but with enough time that happens too. 2 persons have voted this message useful | |
| Serpent Octoglot Senior Member Russian Federation serpent-849.livejour Joined 6598 days ago 9753 posts - 15779 votes 4 sounds Speaks: Russian*, English, FinnishC1, Latin, German, Italian, Spanish, Portuguese Studies: Danish, Romanian, Polish, Belarusian, Ukrainian, Croatian, Slovenian, Catalan, Czech, Galician, Dutch, Swedish | Message 4 of 6 22 August 2012 at 10:59am | IP Logged |
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I do think it's all about your attitude. If you really really really love a language, you don't want to get even a tiny thing wrong. I'm letting my Spanish suffer for this reason, it could be better but I hate the thought of using a single Spanish word in Portuguese. Switching between languages is a skill and while it may come easier to some and harder to others, anyone can acquire it. For example, it's been mentioned in another thread that in some Indian and African regions everyone speaks several languages with a limited degree of fluency. For them switching is no big deal, of course. By now it isn't for me, either. Learning L4 via L2 and L3 really helps :)
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| Medulin Tetraglot Senior Member Croatia Joined 4669 days ago 1199 posts - 2192 votes Speaks: Croatian*, English, Spanish, Portuguese Studies: Norwegian, Hindi, Nepali | Message 5 of 6 22 August 2012 at 4:45pm | IP Logged |
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In Portuguese and Italian you're likely to mix the pronunciation of open and closed vowels, since they are many times different:
MORTO in Portuguese, the first O is closed (as in GO without the final glide), in Italian it's open (as in British English JOHN, LONG) NEVE in Portuguese, the first E is open (between English BAT and BET), in standard Italian it's close(d), as in DEBATE without the final glide). ENORME in Portuguese, the O is open, in standard Italian it's close(d) TEMPO in Portuguese, the E is close(d) and nasal, in standard Italian it's open (tèmpo) PERDENDO in Portuguese, the E in ENDO is close(d) and nasal, in standard Italian it's oral, and open (perdèndo) PREZZO/Preço in Italian the vowel E is open (prèzzo) (between English BAT and BET), in Portuguese the vowel E is close(d) (like [ej] in debate without the final glide [j]) GOVERNO (the government) In Italian the vowel E is open, in Portuguese is close(d) ADORO (I adore) In Italian the stressed/1st o is closed ( like American English GO without the final glide), In Portuguese the vowel is open (like in British English JOHN). In Portuguese, the contrast between open and closed O's and E's is essential (both in standard and in non-standard varieties). In Italian, it's essential in standard Italian. (Most varieties of Italian have the contrast between open and closed O's and E's although their distribution may differ from the Central Italian standard; similar to English BAT / BET contrast, all varieties of English distinguish between BAT and BET, but BAT as pronounced in Chicago or New Zealand may sound like BET to people from Canada, California or the UK). It's very difficult for native speakers of Italian to speak Portuguese with the native accent. And vice versa, for the speaker of Portuguese to speak Italian without the trace of Portuguese/Brazilian accent. I've yet to hear two people speaking convincing Italian and Portuguese. On the other hand, I know of many Argentinians who speak Italian in a very native-like way, for example, Valeria Mazza. Edited by Medulin on 22 August 2012 at 5:03pm 4 persons have voted this message useful | |
| Wort Groupie Austria Joined 4541 days ago 82 posts - 87 votes Speaks: German* Studies: English, Spanish | Message 6 of 6 22 August 2012 at 9:05pm | IP Logged |
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I asked because I thought that these three mentioned languages are the most closely related ones among the
romance languages. Of course, Portuguese is a really interesting language but, in fact, I'd prefer to learn French or Romanian. Nevertheless I think even just one of these two in addition to my Spanish and Italian studies would cause a big interference, but I don't know. Concerning Romanian I assume that it would be a better combination than with adding French. And Serpent, how do you define "passive skills"? :) How can one achieve passive skills without learning actively? Best regards! 1 person has voted this message useful |
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