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Are we selfish? | ||
Tags: Endangered Language | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : General discussion |  | |
| Solfrid Cristin Heptaglot Winner TAC 2011 & 2012 Senior Member Norway Joined 5334 days ago 4143 posts - 8864 votes  Speaks: Norwegian*, Spanish, Swedish, French, English, German, Italian Studies: Russian | Message 1 of 26 10 December 2012 at 11:24am | IP Logged |
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Those of you who have seen my writings know that I try not to be unkind when I answer someone, but today I
saw a statement which I found so crazy, that I was unable to be my normal polite self. The statement was made by Mike Campbell, and what he said was in essence that polyglots should feel the duty to learn a language on the brink of extinction and help preserve those languages and help the smaller language communities to relearn or preserve their language and not just pile up languages because the latter would be selfish. One should have the obligation to give something back to the world. Now I can think of a good many reasons why I would learn an almost extinct language. I might do it because of the beauty of the language itself, or because I was staying somewhere where I had the need or even just the opportunity to learn it, and even the reason he gave, about learning it to help a people preserve their language. I would find that to be a highly laudable effort, and a very meaningful thing to do. What I take issue with, is the notion that it would be selfish for the average polyglot not to do the same. Ok. So let me get this straight. Because I happen to know some languages - languages that I have spent a great deal of time, money and effort in learning, I should have some obligation to learn a language that was of no interest to me, with presumably very little resources, and then do what? Leave my husband, kids, job and travel to the Amazonas and teach it? Now of course if you happen to be in an area where there are a number of languages that are close to extinct (like he presumably is), and you have no work and family obligations that tie you down, then that is great, but how many of the average Joe Polyglot is in that situation? Would you feel selfish for not learning an extinct language? I try never to be bitchy, but my read on this particular proposal is the following: "I am doing this, I want more attention regarding the fact that I am doing it, so let's try to give everybody else bad conscience for not being just as altruistic". I use my languages in so many ways to help people, everyone from my friends, to people I have just met, to random people in the street. I feel absolutely no obligation to do so, but it gives me great pleasure to be able to help people out. But do I feel selfish for not learning an almost extinct language? Hell, no!! Those who do so have my utmost respect, but it is not for me, and it is going to an extremely cold day in an extremely hot place before I start feeling bad about that. 9 persons have voted this message useful | |
| tarvos Super Polyglot Winner TAC 2012 Senior Member China likeapolyglot.wordpr Joined 4707 days ago 5310 posts - 9399 votes Speaks: Dutch*, English, Swedish, French, Russian, German, Italian, Norwegian, Mandarin, Romanian, Afrikaans Studies: Greek, Modern Hebrew, Spanish, Portuguese, Czech, Korean, Esperanto, Finnish | Message 2 of 26 10 December 2012 at 11:32am | IP Logged |
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It's not that I feel selfish for not learning an endangered language, just that I feel
good about giving something back? You don't have to, it's just very good of you if you do. I don't think we can bash people for not learning Frisian or a Bantu language. I thought having a rare language would be a good addition to my arsenal. Edited by tarvos on 10 December 2012 at 11:36am 3 persons have voted this message useful | |
| Solfrid Cristin Heptaglot Winner TAC 2011 & 2012 Senior Member Norway Joined 5334 days ago 4143 posts - 8864 votes Speaks: Norwegian*, Spanish, Swedish, French, English, German, Italian Studies: Russian | Message 3 of 26 10 December 2012 at 11:38am | IP Logged |
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I wouldn't mind learning a rare language either, and like I said, I think it is great that people do. It adds a
little extra spice. But to feel an obligation to do so? No way! 1 person has voted this message useful | |
| tarvos Super Polyglot Winner TAC 2012 Senior Member China likeapolyglot.wordpr Joined 4707 days ago 5310 posts - 9399 votes Speaks: Dutch*, English, Swedish, French, Russian, German, Italian, Norwegian, Mandarin, Romanian, Afrikaans Studies: Greek, Modern Hebrew, Spanish, Portuguese, Czech, Korean, Esperanto, Finnish | Message 4 of 26 10 December 2012 at 11:39am | IP Logged |
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No of course not.
на вкус и на цвет товарищей нет. We will never agree and we all have our reasons to learn what we do. I, for example, have not attempted a big Romance language after French (except Latin as a school subject) because I think learning Spanish would be boring. I prefer doing something fun instead. Edited by tarvos on 10 December 2012 at 11:41am 3 persons have voted this message useful | |
| beano Diglot Senior Member United KingdomRegistered users can see my Skype Name Joined 4622 days ago 1049 posts - 2152 votes Speaks: English*, German Studies: Russian, Serbian, Hungarian | Message 5 of 26 10 December 2012 at 11:39am | IP Logged |
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Languages die because the paernts stop passing the knowledge on to the children because they no longer see the language as relevant. Or the offspring reject their mother tongue for similar reasons. Either way, it's not the responsibility of a polyglot to step in and "save" the language. The will has to come from within.
Ramming a language down peoples' throats rarely works. In Ireland, the number of Irish speakers is perilously low despite 90 years of the language being heavily supported by the state. The public don't see the point. Yet in the USSR, the masses took to Russian because it gave them opportunities. I think the Norwegians have a healthy attitude. Learn other languages to communicate with the wider world but don't neglect your own. Ultimately languages are living entities which evolve, diverge and die of their own accord. Edited by beano on 10 December 2012 at 11:40am 9 persons have voted this message useful | |
| Brun Ugle Diglot Senior Member Norway brunugle.wordpress.c Joined 6620 days ago 1292 posts - 1766 votes Speaks: English*, NorwegianC1 Studies: Japanese, Esperanto, Spanish, Finnish | Message 6 of 26 10 December 2012 at 11:43am | IP Logged |
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It's a lot of work to learn a language and there is a limit to how many one person can learn. Many of us would like to learn all of them, but it isn't possible so we usually choose those we have a need for and those we have the most passion for.
And as Cristina said, it is not always convenient to learn an endangered language in order to help others learn it. Saying that it is selfish for a polyglot not to do that is like saying it is selfish for a hydro-engineer not to go build aqueducts and dig wells in Africa. BTW, Christina, I've been to that place. Contrary to popular belief, it is not hot. Nor is it exactly freezing. It is kind of chilly and damp. 2 persons have voted this message useful | |
| LanguageSponge Triglot Senior Member United Kingdom Joined 5766 days ago 1197 posts - 1487 votes Speaks: English*, German, French Studies: Welsh, Russian, Japanese, Slovenian, Greek, Italian | Message 7 of 26 10 December 2012 at 11:58am | IP Logged |
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No, we are not selfish. If you "saw" this statement (was it on the net?), is there any
way we could see it? I use my languages as often as possible to help people with whatever I can, and I, like you Solfrid, do not feel any kind of obligation to do that, it just pleases me to do so. While I have thought of learning a near-dead language before, because doing so would probably really be fascinating, the accompanying life- style in some community closed-off from all that I already know and love, does not necessarily appeal to me, although it did once. In an earlier point in our lives when the carpet was swept from under our feet and we were finding it difficult to get back up again, my mum and I did talk very seriously about going to some disadvantaged place and helping there - her using her nursing skills as she's been a nurse her whole professional life, and me helping the local population to build wells or schools or learn English or whatever I was capable of. I would then definitely learn a dead or dying language so long as I had a vaguely sensible reason for doing so. I would though, even in those circumstances, consider not bothering, because the second I left that community, I'd probably never use the language again. We only have one life and it is up to us and us alone what we choose to do with it. If Mike Campbell wants to spend his life learning a dead language just to keep that community's unique form of communication alive, then that's his choice. Whether he feels he's obligated to do that or not, we as humans have a wonderful thing called free will (sorry, getting a bit wound up), so he has made that choice for himself. What he does not have the right to do, is to make us feel bad about doing something we don't necessarily want to do - and all that simply because we have a talent. We will all use that talent if we desire so, but to learn languages that interest us. Jack Edited by LanguageSponge on 10 December 2012 at 12:04pm 3 persons have voted this message useful | |
| Maïwenn Diglot Groupie FranceRegistered users can see my Skype Name Joined 4369 days ago 56 posts - 72 votes Speaks: English*, French Studies: German, Mandarin, Breton | Message 8 of 26 10 December 2012 at 11:59am | IP Logged |
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Is it selfish? Absolutely not.
As someone who went to university with the idea of doing research in endangered languages, I really don't think that outsiders with no direct contact to the language are the way to resuscitate a language, nor is it their duty. I think that, where we can, we should encourage parents to pass on their languages and not create an environment where the children view their language as useless and unnecessary. If you're a linguist, you *could* go into an endangered language's community to help and create grammars, dictionaries, learning material, etc. However, the qualification of polyglot does not a linguistics-linguist make. And a polyglot in a faraway land without any intention of going into the community does not make any effect on the language. Outside interest might make the population feel that their language is valuable and important, but even that isn't always felt. In sum, learn what pleases you, you don't have any moral duty to learn any particular language. 6 persons have voted this message useful |
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