17 messages over 3 pages: 1 2 3
s_allard Triglot Senior Member Canada Joined 5422 days ago 2704 posts - 5425 votes Speaks: French*, English, Spanish Studies: Polish
| Message 17 of 17 11 April 2011 at 7:02pm | IP Logged |
Cainntear wrote:
Arekkusu wrote:
You can have a solid understanding of grammar and still NOT be fluent. On the other hand, one could only know a few grammatical structures and use them efficiently, with a certain fluency and ease. While mastery of grammar takes times, fluency doesn't have to wait and can be fostered right from the start. |
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Fluency in what though?
If you don't have accuracy, you can only be fluent in "Bad English/French/whatever". Becoming fluent in an incorrect grammar is an obstacle to becoming fluent in the genuine language. |
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I have to take exception to this statement and come to Arekkusu's defense. If I may be so bold as to paraphrase what Arekkusu said, you do not have to master all the grammar of a language to speak it fluently. (Notice here that I did not say "to be fluent" in a language. Regular readers here know that I detest usage of the word fluency to mean proficiency. Here I'm referring explicitly to ease of speech or fluency).
In fact, you can master a relatively small portion of the grammar and the vocabulary and speak fluently. This is not the same as speaking inaccurately, that is to say making many mistakes. The trick here is to be aware of one's limitations and avoid constructions that one does not master. For example, in a language like French (and to some extent Spanish) one could avoid the subjunctive, the simple future, most past tenses and conditional clauses and still speak correct and fluent French. Obviously, it would be nice to master all those areas, as one should strive to do, but in the meantime one can speak French fluently and make oneself understood. This is even more effective if you have a pretty good accent.
People do this all the time. If the accent is good and you master certain things and stay away from those that you don't, most people will be convinced that you speak the language well, i.e. that you are proficient (and not fluent, please).
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