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Mandarin Accents: Most understood? | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : Specific Languages |  | |
| Snowflake Senior Member United States Joined 5960 days ago 1032 posts - 1233 votes  Studies: Mandarin | Message 9 of 18 01 July 2012 at 7:07am | IP Logged | |||||
Are many people aiming for a particular accent? I'm not targetting any specific one. 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| eggcluck Senior Member China Joined 4702 days ago 168 posts - 278 votes Speaks: English* Studies: Mandarin, Japanese | Message 10 of 18 01 July 2012 at 7:48am | IP Logged | |||||
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I want to keep my clear of all beijing 儿's, simply put when no one here understands it. I have have to make an effort not to pick up any of the local accent ^^ 这个 here is pronounced "ji ge" .
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| LatinoBoy84 Bilingual Triglot Senior Member United States Joined 5576 days ago 443 posts - 603 votes Speaks: English*, Spanish*, French Studies: Russian, Portuguese, Latvian | Message 11 of 18 02 July 2012 at 4:06am | IP Logged | |||||
Hey Snowflake, I'm just trying to aim for a neutral accent. Beijing has a bit of heavy "r" use and consonant "slurring" that I'm trying to keep to a minimum. From what I understand, Taipei standard is seen as "soft" and a slight southern/Shanghai is "pleasant/chic" because of it's use in business...any thoughts? Edited by LatinoBoy84 on 02 July 2012 at 4:07am 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| eggcluck Senior Member China Joined 4702 days ago 168 posts - 278 votes Speaks: English* Studies: Mandarin, Japanese | Message 12 of 18 02 July 2012 at 5:24am | IP Logged | |||||
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My location is the Shanghai area and well, I know some people that when they left thearea for elswhere in China, tot he locals of that region they were almost incomprehensibe. It was like they were back at square one.
This is where I am aiming for the boring but well understood "standard" er less accent. 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| Snowflake Senior Member United States Joined 5960 days ago 1032 posts - 1233 votes Studies: Mandarin | Message 13 of 18 03 July 2012 at 10:31pm | IP Logged | |||||
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Guess it's a matter of who I have been talking with. The native Mandarin speakers I know are generally accustomed to interacting with people from different provinces. They usually won't let accents be a barrier. I've seen them go out of their way to try to understand people speaking a true Mandarin dialect. Anyhow, my friends generally talk about having a "pretty standard" or "heavy"/“non-standard” accent. Those with a heavy accent readily admit it. Most people I've met will modify their speech depending on who they’re talking with. And those with a heavy accent have no hesitations interacting with speakers having "better" Mandarin accents.
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| viedums Hexaglot Senior Member Thailand Joined 4667 days ago 327 posts - 528 votes Speaks: Latvian, English*, German, Mandarin, Thai, French Studies: Vietnamese | Message 14 of 18 04 July 2012 at 4:33am | IP Logged | |||||
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One reason Taiwan Mandarin may be perceived as “soft” on the mainland is the way speakers there use sentence-final “affect” particles like 啊 a , 嘍 lo etc. I think generally speakers of southern dialects use a greater variety of these, and use them more often. The link below is to an abstract of a study on particles in Taiwan TV dramas. It mentions that particle use is “associated with the performance of cuteness among young women,” which I think is also true in Japanese. But the study actually found that in the dramas men use them as much as women. Perhaps this is the source of the perception that Taiwanese men sound feminine.
In any case, I doubt that this will be a problem for foreign learners. The meaning of these particles can be subtle and context-dependent, so even if you wanted to learn how to use them (and risk sounding like a sissy) it wouldn’t be so easy. And just leaving them off is for the most part not a problem. If you ever watch Taiwanese dramas, it might be fun to try listening for them. Generally here I agree with Snowflake. I’ve been in many situations where Taiwan people were talking to mainland people, and no one ever had a problem making themselves understood. The same should be true for you if you reach a good level of Mandarin. taiwan particles 2 persons have voted this message useful | ||||||
| Snowflake Senior Member United States Joined 5960 days ago 1032 posts - 1233 votes Studies: Mandarin | Message 15 of 18 04 July 2012 at 5:19am | IP Logged | |||||
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I think one of the things being alluded to here is that people with relatively limited exposure to various
accents sometimes will not bother to make the effort to understand someone who speaks differently. I've run into my share of those and generally try to avoid them. It seems for say Eggcluck, avoiding these people is not necessarily practical. So there learning a pretty standard accent is quite important. Do have thoughts on the others, haven't had time to write those out yet. Edited by Snowflake on 04 July 2012 at 5:45am 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| Snowflake Senior Member United States Joined 5960 days ago 1032 posts - 1233 votes Studies: Mandarin | Message 16 of 18 05 July 2012 at 5:33pm | IP Logged | |||||
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I’ve met native Mandarin speakers who admitted they don’t understand Beijingnese. It’s the slang and pronunciation differences which throw them, not the 儿's. They generally understand the 儿's just fine. I’ve met some Beijingers who slowed down their speech to be understood by other Mandarin speakers. Is the super fast speech what you mean by slurring? Or does consonant slurring refer to things like the abbreviation of ming2tian1 jian4 to mier2 jian4? If it's the abbreviation thing, I'd consider that to fall into the category of Mandarin dialect.
I’m really the last person to be able to comment on what is considered chic. I had a conversation a while back with a woman from Taiwan about how mainlanders generally express themselves compared to Taiwanese. She characterized Taiwanese as being very emotional. The example she gave was complementing the hostess on the food served. Basically she's used to Taiwanese gushing about the food whereas her mainlander friends would say one very short complement and that would the end of the topic. She had to fight her impressions of mainlanders being cold and rude as she knew that was not the case. Her mainlander friends asked her whether all Taiwanese men are gay. In addition to Taiwanese men frequently using the sentence-final particles like Taiwanese women, compared to mainlanders they gush. One of her mainlander friends visited Taiwan and realized that the men there just behave that way and it wasn't a matter of being gay. Taiwanese and other southern accents being soft.....I understood that to be due to minimal or no retroflect sounds. Update; should probably mention that one of the reasons I listen to PopUp Chinese is to get used to hearing 儿's. I'd like to avoid the liberal use of 儿's as the reason for not comprehending someone. Edited by Snowflake on 05 July 2012 at 10:39pm 1 person has voted this message useful |
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