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What is Your Reading Process? | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : Learning Techniques, Methods & Strategies |  | |
| Katie Diglot Senior Member Australia Joined 6710 days ago 495 posts - 599 votes  Speaks: English*, Hungarian Studies: French, German | Message 1 of 24 29 August 2009 at 1:42am | IP Logged |
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Hi Everyone!
As I've mentioned, I am using a lot more native materials these days. I was reading a series of books targeted at 8-10 year olds because I thought it would be easier for me, HOWEVER - it bored me senseless. I got about 1/3 of the way through the first book and couldn't stand it anymore! A friend from Hungary has just sent me through a Hungarian version of a Virginia Andrews book. I am a big fan of these books in English, so I'm really happy to have this one - and I feel really motivated to read it. Now, the reason for my post is that, naturally, this book is a bit more challenging than my "Princess" series childrens books, as it's aimed at the young adult. There's a lot of vocabulary that I'm not familiar with, or that I recognise but can't recall as yet. My question is - how do you approach reading this sort of material in your target language? My current tactic is (and I only got this book 2 days ago): 1. Read the paragraph in Hungarian and try to understand it as best as I can (sometimes I have a general idea, sometimes I have NO CLUE, unfortunately). 2. If I fully understand the paragraph or even a part of it, I just move on. If I don't, I then type it into an online translator and work to understand it that way. I will get the full translation, go back and read it in Hungarian and try to recognise the sentence structure and individual words/phrases etc. Is this a helpful/effective way to read? I figured that by the time I got to the end of the book, I will be recognising a lot more of the words and hopefully have to look up less. Is this a good way to read this? I'd love your opinions! I just can't stand children's material any longer! It's driving me crazy! I do not have the English version of this particular book - and I don't really want to get it, because I KNOW that I will fall back on it and read it (I can't pull myself away from these books, so I know I'll rush ahead and read it in English - then the excitement will be gone from trying to read it in Hungarian as I will know what has happened!). How do you read native materials in this situation? Do you recommend a different approach? I am not looking for responses that say to pick an easier book - I have tried this, I am not motivated by it and I do not feel any frustration at this point by having the challenge of reading a more difficult text. I'm really looking to hear your ideas on the most effective methods you have come across for reading these texts... how to pick up grammatical points, understand and approach the whole reading process. Thanks in advance! I can't wait to hear your responses! 1 person has voted this message useful | |
| Lingua Decaglot Senior Member United States Joined 5568 days ago 186 posts - 319 votes Speaks: English*, German, Italian, Spanish, Swedish, Danish, French, Norwegian, Portuguese, Dutch | Message 2 of 24 29 August 2009 at 2:00am | IP Logged |
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Two ways.
You could read with a dictionary and just look up unknown words as they occur. Don't dwell on the words. Just use the dictionary to help you understand the sentence, then read on. Just read through the book and try to understand as much as you can. 2 persons have voted this message useful | |
| Katie Diglot Senior Member Australia Joined 6710 days ago 495 posts - 599 votes Speaks: English*, Hungarian Studies: French, German | Message 3 of 24 29 August 2009 at 2:08am | IP Logged |
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Thanks Lingua - personally, I like the second idea HOWEVER, at this point in time, there are some paragraphs that I don't understand at all - so I think the dictionary will have to be used for the timebeing. Who knows, perhaps half way through, I'll be able to switch to just reading!
Just a quick question - when you say don't dwell on the words, just understand it and move on, do you mean not to spend time trying to 'learn' the word? Edited by Katie on 29 August 2009 at 2:16am 1 person has voted this message useful | |
| Darobat Diglot Senior Member Joined 7180 days ago 754 posts - 770 votes Speaks: English*, Russian Studies: Latin | Message 4 of 24 29 August 2009 at 2:25am | IP Logged |
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I'm currently in a similar situation with Russian. Depending on what exactly I'm reading, I'll understand anywhere from almost everything, to practically nothing which makes reading a novel rather frustrating. Currently, I'm reading through a dual language book with Russian on the left, and a rather artistic translation on the right. I'll read a paragraph or two or three in English first, and then I'll read them in Russian, trying my best to refrain from referring to the English text again. While doing this, I also jot down any words which I want to learn, and then later add them to a word list which I learn using Iveresen's method. So far it seems to be working for me, but I too am curious as to what techniques others use.
2 persons have voted this message useful | |
| Bao Diglot Senior Member Germany tinyurl.com/pe4kqe5 Joined 5758 days ago 2256 posts - 4046 votes Speaks: German*, English Studies: French, Spanish, Japanese, Mandarin | Message 5 of 24 29 August 2009 at 2:27am | IP Logged |
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Biting and not translating.
If there's something I don't understand yet, I try to ignore it and only go back to the paragraph when I have to admit that I do not understand the story without it. Then I look up important seeming vocabulary in a dictionary and only when I still don't understand, dissect and/or translate. It can be quite straining but as long as the story is interesting and the writing not too much above my current level it's manageable - and this way I actually finish my books, what I do not do when I look up all unknown or shaky words, sentence patterns and grammar. Edited by Bao on 29 August 2009 at 4:21am 1 person has voted this message useful | |
| pohaku Diglot Senior Member United States Joined 5643 days ago 192 posts - 367 votes Speaks: English*, Persian Studies: Arabic (classical), French, German, Mandarin, Japanese | Message 6 of 24 29 August 2009 at 3:09am | IP Logged |
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I read Persian, German, and (at a beginning level) Arabic. I choose texts that I am truly interested in and, if it's something really challenging, I will do my best to get a literal translation. Generally, I try to read the target passage with dictionary and grammar in hand, only looking afterwards at the translation. The greatest satisfaction comes from eventually getting to the point when no reference translation is necessary and I am certain that I'm getting most of the meaning and most of the vocabulary without stopping to look up many words. I'm at that point now with novels by Hesse and certain classical Persian poetry. Other materials are more difficult; e.g., Sa'adi can be really mind-bending. I try to enjoy whatever I'm doing, whether it's just a hard-won sentence or two (as is now the case for me with Arabic, 1001 Nights, The Fisherman's Tale), a half-page (as with Sa'adi's Bustan) 5 pages at a time (as with Nezami's Vis o Ramin, a 11th century lyric/romantic book in verse), or 20 pages at a time (as with Hesse; I just finished Der Steppenwolf). I'd rather slave over a difficult but rewarding passage than move with ease through something mundane.
Relax! Don't rush. Be proud of your progress, yet know that it will take you a long, long time to become truly fluent. One more thing: I always read native materials in my target language for my learning purposes. I never read translations of English works in the target language. That way, I'm reading something that's of some importance in the target culture, often true classics, and I'm learning about that culture through its literature. I find this appealing and enlightening. 2 persons have voted this message useful | |
| awake Senior Member United States Joined 6628 days ago 406 posts - 438 votes Speaks: English* Studies: Esperanto, Spanish | Message 7 of 24 29 August 2009 at 7:03am | IP Logged |
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As I read, I write down any words I don't know (or any phrases where I think I know the words but they don't seem
to make sense). I just try to read and understand as much as I can from context. I don't look the words up as I'm reading, I just write them down and then keep reading. Once I've got 20 or so entries on my list, I'll stop reading, look them up, write down definitions, and drill them with flashcards until I've gotten them down. (It's not that many words so it usually doesn't take long.) Then I reread the section. Rinse and repeat with the next section of text. I feel this process has worked well for me. When I first make the jump to native materials, I may find that I can only get through a paragraph or two before I need to stop and look up words. That can be a bit onerous, but I try to focus on reading native material that I enjoy to make it less of a chore. With practice it gets a lot easier, and I can read much longer texts before I reach my ~20 word limit and have to pause. And rereading the text after I've drilled the words seems to be the crucial step for me, it really helps make more of the words stick. 4 persons have voted this message useful | |
| Lizzern Diglot Senior Member Norway Joined 5901 days ago 791 posts - 1053 votes Speaks: Norwegian*, English Studies: Japanese | Message 8 of 24 29 August 2009 at 11:06am | IP Logged |
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I think you need to decide if you want want these words in your active or passive vocabulary. If passive then just read, look things up as you go, try to understand them then, and move on.
What I do is make a wordlist of the words I don't know, where the word I'm looking at plus a few more words as an example of its use go in a column next to it, then a few hours later I translate the list into English and write that in the second column. Then the day after I translate the text into English (however literally it seems appropriate). On the third day I try to translate the second column back into Italian. Then the day after, translate the text back, so that I can see if I can produce the same thing correctly in Italian based on my translation only. Then the next day I write corrections over what I wrote in a darker pen. It's been hugely helpful in terms of understanding what I'm reading, understanding (and using) correct syntax, and not least active recall of vocabulary. I've written more (A LOT more) about it in my learning log if you're interested. So that's what I do for specific words I want to have a go at, it's a vocabulary-learning tool more than a reading tool as such (I read all my texts beforehand and then once I figure I'm stuck in enough places to make a 5-day wordlist thing out of it then I'll go ahead with it) but the times when I read without going further with it I just look things up as I go, and then try to visualise what is happening, sort of like making a little split-second visual mnemonic for myself. It seems to work. What I would suggest for you is to get a hold of the same book in English, grow some discipline :-) and then just do what you want with the text, but if you find a paragraph where you're stuck then you can try something like a wordlist and study the words and phrases that are unfamiliar, then give it a few days' break and then try to translate that part of the book using the English text as your basis. Then compare that with the translation in your book in Hungarian, and write any necessary corrections over what you wrote. I'm sure it would help both your understanding of the text and your ability to produce those same things that were problematic. That's my 2 cents anyway. Have fun! Liz 1 person has voted this message useful |
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